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Forums » Starting Out » For the guys that own hundreds of properties

For the guys that own hundreds of properties Subscribe to For the guys that own hundreds of properties

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Real Estate Investor · New York


Hi everyone, I had a question about accumulating investment properties. I just finished reading an interesting article about how an investor amassed hundreds of properties. I know everyone has their own unique situations, but I was wondering how this is possible. Lets say I want to start off with one property, then eventually save up enough and buy several others. If this were to become my full time job managing and investing in properties, How does one obtain financing. I always thought Lenders base loans off debt to income ratio (example 50k income will give loan up to 250k) It doesnt add up all of the debt these investors rack up, is income based on projected rentals? Do they have corporations finance the properties? I know im getting ahead of myself but I was trying to figure out how these real estate gurus obtain financing. Thanks


Real Estate Investor · Amarillo, Texas


Personally I do not own 100's of properties.. not yet anyways, but generally most investors who do aquire a huge amount of properties are not use traditional financing, maybe for the first few but not normally after that.
Different ways of obtaining properties include
owner finaincing
hard or private money financing
lines of credit
master lease (you dont actually own)
theres tons of ways out there..

My strategy is to take the several properties I have, and pay them down as much as possible in a short time, then pull money out of them and use that money for more properties! hope it works! lol
-Scott

P.s. Under real estate finance and legal check out the Creative Real Estate Financing listings..


· OR


The big boys are getting commercial loans, which are based upon the income of the business (building) and not the income of the owner. There is also no limit to how many commercial loans you can have, as long as you can show how you are going to pay for them.

A big possibility is that the guys with 100's of units own apartment buildings, which are normally financed with commercial loans.

I do know of one investor who owned thousands of individual houses, but all his money came from outside the country. No telling what he was doing to get all the cash he parked in the USA.


Real Estate Consultant · Ft Worth, Texas


I work for a firm that owns quite a number of units,both MH and MF. I have no personal interest in being a landlord,but if I did,would begin by learning the MF brokerage business.
From there,you have the platform to both evaluate properties and solicit investors. Many of the larger MF firms in the country began as a result of JV's between themselves and lenders,both public and private.
Many were MF developers,others simply acquired existing product. Obviously,this is a 5-15 year program,but there are many younger investors on this site. Good Luck to you!
(Obviously all this is off in 2012...)



Alan,

When would a bank partner in a JV in a situation other than CRA investments, that is the only thing i can think of. Also, what happens in 2012? Are you reffering to the end of the world?

Also, I have a similar question. Being relatively young what would be the best ways to achieve the goal of acquiring 100+ propertie sin the shortest period of time. I have been thinking MF just because it seems easier to acquire more units that way, and also there ar enot too many cash flowinf SFR's in my area. Starting with one property - maybe an REO apartment, executing a value added play, refinancing and using money for another acquisition is my current plan. anyone know how to acquire mor eproperties quicker and easier. REO tapes?

Also, I know REI is not about how "fast" can you acquire properties and I do not want to overleverage and incur undue credit risk. But I'm sure there ar eothers ways out there that I am not aware of?


Real Estate Investor · sioux falls, South Dakota


Mikey- I don't currently own hundreds of homes. There were times when I owned over 100 at one time, but currently own around 75. If you count apts, I'm over 200. My wife and I personally (no partners ) have owned a little over 1000 sfrs in our lifetime.

Here are some answers, and you can find lots more in previous posts and threads here on BP.

1.Lenders will count a % of rent from each rental in your qualifying. If you have other income or free and clear properties, this one will be ok. If you package multi homes together, lender will look harder at ability of properties to service the debt, than looking at you.

2. Owner financed properties don't have the same regulations and requirements. Tons of those currently available. Best way to grab multiple properties quickly.

Alan-
1. I've never had experiences to JV with a public lender. I have with private, but only paid higher interest, no share of profits.

Jimmy-
1. If you have some experience, decent income AND gift for gab, I'd start with owner financing on hard to finance properties. MH would fit this category well, as does older properties. Maybe Jon Klaus is awake, and he has had great results with this and can chime in.
2. MF- I subscribe to the theory that more is not always better (except for obtaining more depreciation).
3. If goal is more properties, MH or mf is probably the quickest. If long term creation of real wealth is the goal, I'd prefer newer sfrs. If cash flow is tough in your area and you want to stay there, then your choices and options become less.
I like your thought process and specific plans. I've NEVER had any luck with REO tapes.
I didn't do much in RE for about 25 years, then was challenged. I was told by many that you couldn't create wealth doing it the way I had 30+ years ago. I finally had enough doubters and decided to prove them wrong. Short story is I moved to a new state, TEXAS under 3 years ago. I bought 26 homes in 35 days and the majority were owner financed and ALL were less than 10% down. I did use approx 250K in cash eventually and began buying at foreclosure sale. In 19 months, I purchased or built 68 homes.( now have a subdivision in same area with 20 homes, 10 are mine and 44 lots. Just broke ground on 4 new models) It can be done. Much of the funds used were generated from profits in re-selling rehabbed foreclosures.
I'm sure there are many on here that would think or tell you "it can't be done now". There are others that are ,,,,DOING it. I was told the same thing 3 years ago. Lots more info on this in other threads and posts as to specifics.

Never over expose yourself on the risk and ALWAYS prepare for the rainy day.

You asked:
"Being relatively young what would be the best ways to achieve the goal of acquiring 100+ propertie sin the shortest period of time?"

Start now! Rich



Rich,

26 homes in 35 days is pretty impressive. Did you just basically mass mail lenders, banks, and brokers in the area and tell them you were looking for owner financed? That's probably how I would start.

What type of SFR's do you focus on? I hear so many people on hear buying "30k homes that need minimal rehab and rent for 800-900 per month". That doesn't exist in my area (Lexington, KY), not even in a war zone. I am more than wiling to relocate for a job and would conside investments in other markets, but I am not that familiar with anything but home, and therefore not as comfortable not knowing the neighborhoods. I have been looking in Cincinnati and it offers good CF, but it is a bit "rust belty" and has a declining population.

And when you say you invest in new SFr's for long term wealth is that just because they hold their value and appreciate well? I have been focusing more on CF investments as the new subdivisions with new SFR's in my area are all 100k+, probly rent for 800-900.

My issue right now is lack of income. I just turned 24 I have a undergraduate degrees in Finance, Accounting, Managament and I have an MBA with a focus in Finance - unfortunately I graduated in tought times and cannot find a good job (currently making 12.50 per hour as in intern in loan review department of a bank.) graduated my undergrad in 2.5 years instead of doing summer internships etc. So my work history is not long and an internship is not permanent. I did inheret a 300k SFR free and clear that I live in. If i get some steady income I plan to finance a 1st mortgage and use that pool of funds for acquisitions. Do you have any ideas of how to start in RE faster than having to wait for a year of solid employment to show the banks steady income? Owner financing seems to be my only option. Any ideas?



BTW, my current goals have nothing to do with the number of units I want to own, rather I want to have 10k free cash flow per month by the time i'm 30. That is my goal and I feel that with good CF the long term wealth will come.


Real Estate Investor · sioux falls, South Dakota


Jimmy,
I selected the state, and then started contacted brokers, REIAs and Craigslist! Each of those snowballed into more contacts and properties, and continued snowballing. When contacts find out you're not the normal lookie-lou and will actually close, you receive hundreds of deals.
I've only bought 2 homes in the 30's. They didn't generate $800 in rent, so I can't speak to that.
I only buy in 2 areas. TX and FL. They are the ones I know pretty well. I agree you should be careful going out of area and suggest you go do your own research.
I buy for long term, and not cash flow. I don't look at cash flow and creating wealth as the same. Here is why. I could go buy MH's cheap and generate good positive cash flow. You've probably seen what a 70's-80's MH looks like today. They're out behind homes in the sticks with broken windows etc. They undoubtedly provided cash flow, but obviously didn't creat wealth! Houses age also, just not as fast as MHs. They hold their value better, appreciate better, and provide more tax benefits.
The good news is you have a valuable asset. The bad news is not sufficient income to satisfy a bank for a refinance. I'd do NOTHING with that equity currently. Start doing research and look for owner financing. After you feel confident you've done your homework, you could probably find a small loan at a decent rate. Use a small amount to start.
You can reach your goal, but you may have to wait a bit to start. No rush. There'll be LOTS of properties for sale for the forseeable future. Good luck. Rich


Accountant · Garden Grove, California


Jimmy
I don't own hundreds of properties, not even 75 like Rich, I only own 30. But I started at age 19 (age 50 now) and bought a house for $30,000, no money down, seller carry and it rented for $500 a month. I did nothing else for a year, and then sold it for $50,000. And built from there. I would have much more if I didn't go through a divorce, but that is life.

Seller carry financing is your best bet, but you have a better chance if you put some 'skin' in the game (some of your own money). If you cannot refinance your personal residence, since you said it is free and clear, you can give a seller a trust deed on your personal residence to buy something else. You can also talk with private lenders about making a loan on your personal residence. Many private lenders don't mind a first position trust deed if the LTV is under 50%. I just got a small first trust deed with the LTV about 8% from a private lender.

Your best bet right now is to get educated on your market place. Learn values, learn rents, learn neighborhoods, learn property management, learn real estate law, etc.... Make contacts, brokers, appraisers, title representatives, lenders, bankers, handymen, and more. This will prove invaluable as your build your investment portfolio.

And the biggest asset? Patience! "Rome was not built in a day!"

Good Luck
Mike


Landlord · Seattle, Washington


Jimmy,

I don't have 100+ SFRs, but have learned a few things over the years. One is that I would rather take my time and find properties that make sense (location, numbers, potential appreciation, potential value add) than pick up large quantities.

I've been able to find good properties in good times and bad. It takes work and diligence to find those that perform though.

I've worked with real estate investors though that had 50+ SFR homes. Many of them had a very thin cash flow because they withdrew so much of the equity to purchase new homes. One eventually went bankrupt. Leverage can be good, but it can also be devastating.


Real Estate Investor · Chattanooga, Tennessee


Mikey,
If you are a new investor (it sounds like you are) the rules for getting financing will have changed before you will start to worry about where to get financing. Things are changing so fast there is little advice someone can give you that is guaranteed to be relevant in 3 years when you start running out of options. Just get in and start building your portfolio. As your expertise grows you will find ways to fund your deals.


Real Estate Investor · sioux falls, South Dakota


Agree wiyh Edwin. However, owner financed properties have always been here and probably always will be. Tons of those now if you look around. Rich


Real Estate Investor · pensacola, Florida


Sorry to cut in, but I have the same sitiution here. I currently have 5 properties including my principal residence. I have loans totaling 245k. I want to expand my portfolio but cannot get any more financing due to my debt income ratio. Does any one know of any Portfolio lenders or is my only hope owner financing as well. My properties together are netting 450.00 per month.


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