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Forums » Commercial Real Estate Investing Forum » Didn't quite know where to put this +here comes the blood+

Didn't quite know where to put this +here comes the blood+ Subscribe to Didn't quite know where to put this +here comes the blood+

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Real Estate Investor · fort lauderdale, Florida


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125167422962070925.html?mod=rss_whats_news_us

an article from the wall street journal about the troubles coming around the corner for commercial real estate.

I personally think this will be the best time to buy commercial properties, not random speculative buying but purchase properties with strong income that are way under valued.

Its exciting and sad at the same time, during great economic turmoil more millionaires are made but that's because the wealth flows to the top, while thats good for the top, it's not so good for everyone else, but alas that's the system we live in and we have to play by the rules unless we sit on the bench and play Monday morning QB.

I say go out there and build some security for yourself and your family and friends.


Real Estate Investor · Baltimore, Maryland


Owen,

Yes... it does look like we are in for some exciting times.

In my market, Baltimore, we are seeing at least one slam dunk residential deal every quarter.

By slam dunk I am talking about a deal that most regular investors can get into without a ton of cash on the down payment side and lots of upside potential.

Lets hope that the opportunities everyone is sensing come to pass.

Pete


Real Estate Investor · Weston, Florida


It is a sign of the madness of the time we live in.
Read carefully what it says.

By the end of 2012, some $153 billion in loans that make up CMBS are coming due, and close to $100 billion of that will face difficulty getting refinanced, according to Deutsche Bank. Even though the cash flows of these properties are enough to pay interest and principal on the debt, their values have fallen so far that borrowers won't be able to extend existing mortgages or replace them with new debt.

The very first task of a Banker is to do all he can to turn a bad loan into a good loan. What these guys are saying is that as a result of a rule that made sense in a different era under different circumstances someone is knowingly going to pull the trigger and unnecessarily destroy over $100 billion in capital.
So even though these properties are healthy and performing excellently, they will be destroyed.

I am so very glad that I am now a retired banker, as I cannot see myself in good conscience functioning in a climate where a sub mediocre bureaucracy blindly enforces a rule because it's there. And the saddest part is that the press, the players and the public just passively sit and watch while it happens.
How can anyone in good conscience foreclose on performing properties?

The people who enforce this crime against capitalism should be banned to 10 years volunteer work doing micro lending in the poor villages of Bangladesh and Vietnam.
Hopefully they will sober up and return with a healthy respect for what was build up by hard work to a level that it is still the envy of the free world.

Sorry for the rant guys.


Real Estate Consultant · San Francisco, California


Originally posted by Louis Bergman
It is a sign of the madness of the time we live in.
Read carefully what it says.

By the end of 2012, some $153 billion in loans that make up CMBS are coming due, and close to $100 billion of that will face difficulty getting refinanced, according to Deutsche Bank. Even though the cash flows of these properties are enough to pay interest and principal on the debt, their values have fallen so far that borrowers won't be able to extend existing mortgages or replace them with new debt.

The very first task of a Banker is to do all he can to turn a bad loan into a good loan. What these guys are saying is that as a result of a rule that made sense in a different era under different circumstances someone is knowingly going to pull the trigger and unnecessarily destroy over $100 billion in capital.
So even though these properties are healthy and performing excellently, they will be destroyed.

I am so very glad that I am now a retired banker, as I cannot see myself in good conscience functioning in a climate where a sub mediocre bureaucracy blindly enforces a rule because it's there. And the saddest part is that the press, the players and the public just passively sit and watch while it happens.
How can anyone in good conscience foreclose on performing properties?

The people who enforce this crime against capitalism should be banned to 10 years volunteer work doing micro lending in the poor villages of Bangladesh and Vietnam.
Hopefully they will sober up and return with a healthy respect for what was build up by hard work to a level that it is still the envy of the free world.

Sorry for the rant guys.

The Banksters........ :cool:


Real Estate Investor · Los Angeles, California


Owen,

Great post.

I'm looking forward to some of that action to trickle down into where I live in Southern California.

A few months ago I came across a 73-unit where the owner was willing to carry 75% of the paper but wanted $120,000 a door -- for a completely empty building!

I'm keeping my powder dry.

Anthony


Real Estate Investor · Altus, Oklahoma


Hmmm for a newb getting into commercial this looks like it's going to be good pickins :mrgreen:


Real Estate Investor · sioux falls, South Dakota


oh-oh. Here comes the competition for commercial! There goes the neighborhood. Newbies- be careful before you leap. This is not SFR 101. I suggest you read some posts and BLOGS on buying larger properties as well as do lots of research first. It is a completely different set of rules, especially in regards to financing. Rich in FL.


Real Estate Lender · Fort Pierce, Florida


Louis,

How much blame can be passed on to regulators who impose and enforce new rules on banks due to past mistakes by other banks/bankers and the regulators themselves?

Which of the regulators should shoulder the most blame?


Real Estate Investor · fort lauderdale, Florida


I just wanted to share what I read and I thank everyone for all their advice about not getting skinned alive.

I know it won't be easy but I just think sellers will have to be a little more flexible when it comes to selling their properties now.

Louis made a great point about the regulations that are in place that will cause so much hardship and stress. How can something that's performing and covering its debt not be allows to restructure the financing to keep the property performing.

I am not in any hurry to go out and sign for debt or take over anyone elses problem, i'll stay focused and carefully evaluate my deals, i've studied some real estate courses plus with a board like this and all the years of experience I think I will be ok.

We all know that banks are GREAT property managers right.... not! I would think that a bank would be willing to work with property owners to keep as many properties off their books as possible and keep some cash coming in to service all the debt.

Mr. Russell i couldn't stop laughing when read your post 120,000 per door... wow that's just crazy.


Private Money Lender · Los Angeles, California


Though inspiring, you have to be careful reading the Deutsche bank report. It focused on high value CMBS loans only. They did this because they could specifically identify each loan and had extremely detailed and complete data about every one of them, including exact cash flow models. There were 54079 loans totaling $601.9 Billion. Thus, the average loan was institutional grade CMBS and exceeded $11 million - significantly beyond the capability of most individual investors.

In subsequent testimony before congress, Richard Parkus, author of the Deutsch Bank report, clarified several items. He specifically noted that, "Commercial real estate financing markets are effectively closed, at least for loans in excess of $25-$35MM. Smaller loans on properties that are performing well have continued to have some degree of success refinancing, mainly with regional banks. However, we believe that this source will continue to deteriorate as problem loans mount in bank portfolios."

How much the smaller loans sources will deteriorate is unclear and neither explained in the Deutsche Bank report nor in the WSJ article. If Mr. Parkus is right, institutional grade vulture funds are in for a field day within a few years. We little guys might not have the same opportunities, since funding constraints for the lower dollar deals might not be as dire or drive as many properties back to the lenders as predicted for the institutional grade properties. Our advantage of course, is that we generally only need a handful of properties.

My sense is that a good deal now is still a good deal and I would not let the Deutsche Bank report or WSJ article sway me from an otherwise excellent investment. If you can find something that conservatively meets your criteria, and which can be financed with a sensible loan, then go for it now. If not, sitting on cash now is an excellent way to pass the time. You almost can't lose.


Real Estate Investor · fort lauderdale, Florida


Jeff your correct but like you said we only need a few properties to be ok.

The thing is news like this can be used as a negotiating tool with potential sellers, most people will read this article and not delve as deeply into it as you did.

I mean think about it warren buffet doesn't buy when the market is hot he buys when blood's in the streets or so everyone is told to believe.

A board like this were we can trade information about asset classes that are strong and will remain strong can be a great wealth builder and i'm in this game to win.

Also you make the point that if something meets your criteria and you didn't bend over backwards to make it fit will still be a deal.

I think there are very good information on this board about how to get a properties true value and work off those numbers so i doubt anyone on this board should get burned if they ask questions and don't go against their better judgement.




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