BiggerPockets

My month to month tenants just asked to paint the cupboards and bathroom at my expense. (taking out of rent)
Their year lease expired two months ago and they will not sign another because they want to stay month to month unless I lower the monthly rent $400 a month but will stay month to month at the current rent.. Does not make sense to me.

Would you let them paint the bathroom with mildew resistant paint and cupboards at my expense? I do not want them to paint since they could leave a month later. (should I just tell them that?)
There is no mildew unless the ceiling is cleaned every 6 months. The cleaning takes 5mins with tsp and water. Should I just tell them this?

Im in a hard spot since the market is hard to rent the place if they leave.

They also want me to pay for a fire extinguisher. Would you buy this for them?

They just changed their phone number to an area code across the county. This does not make sense to me..it is not work related. Can I ask them why they got an out of state number?

I appreciate your feedback. If the rental market was better I would tell them flat out NO painting.

Thanks!

A fire extinguisher is under 20 bucks, I might bring that as an offering to the table, but I wouldn't let them paint - painting cabinets requires some skill and patience - what if they do it very badly you may end up spending a lot of time reversing the job, or buying new hardware....worst case new cabinets. or they've spilled paint on the floors too...

I might give the extinguisher (it's safety related and cheap), and offer to have the "annual" cleaning done - maybe do some touch-ups or cheap cosmetic items at the time.

Remember if you give in to something make sure it's on the condition that you get something - otherwise you will just be expected to give more and more and in fact nobody will be happy. You need to train them that you're fair but firm.

$400 reduction in rent is HUGE - what can you afford, and if you dropped it that much would you be able to easily rent that apt to a fresh lease do you think?

it's kind of funny because when I was a renter, I ALWAYS got reduced rent in exchange for doing work on the property - I've put in tile floors, done plumbing, painting, treework, landscaping, you name it...

But I did quality work, left the places much nicer than when I moved in, and the landlords got very lucky in my case.

Don't expect the same! I sure won't be rolling the dice with my hard earned investment dollars and my tenants

I do think it's fine, however, to do occasional nice and not-necessarily-required things for good tenants, to build and keep a good relationship. There is such a thing as normal wear and tear, and improving your property. But these should be on your terms, not theirs.

I've seen how tenants paint. You can expect paint on the hardware, paint peeling off the grease they didn't wash off the cabinets, runs in the paints, and outrageous colors. I got my kitchen painted grape jelly purple without my permission.

The job might even be only half done with paint drips on your countertops.

Go take a look. If the cabinets need paint, then hire a professional to go in and paint them, You'd be doing it at your expense anyway. The tenants wanted to be paid for it.

If your tenants are moving out, you might need to paint the cabinets anyway, and your current tenants have told you they won't object to the fuss of having them painted while they live there.

If your tenants are undecided, new paint might make them stay a bit longer.

It sounds to me like they are thinking about buying (do they have enough income?). Tenants don't move without reason.

The out of state number is a cell phone, and maybe they had it before they moved in, and just recently cancelled their local number. Or a parent has paid for the phone for them (my cell is on my son's account, so it is in effect free).

Very few tenants know how to paint and cabinets are one of the hardest things in the house to get right.

All thanks so much for your input.
I just wanted another landlord feedback.

I will do a inspection this week. I used mildew resistant paint in the bathroom and they just probably do not wipe it down every few months.

So should I show the place even though they are month to month? Should let them know I am showing it?
The rental market in the area is super slow nice places in the area have been vacant for 4months with low rent.

They have been great tenants I just feel like im walking on egg shells since they are month to month and the rental market is terrible right now.. High vacancy risk and they know it. Hence why they was a rental decrease of $400 month for a year lease.

Keep the input coming :)

Are you sure you don't have a mildew or mold problem that you're just trying to cover up with paint? You say it has to be wiped down every few months. Is something growing behind this and eventually works its way through the paint? Of more concern is the source of moisture. Do you have a leak behind the wall that is keeping this area wet?

Do not show the unit until after they have given notice. Just because they are month to month, does not mean they are moving out. As soon as you start to show it, they will start to look for a new place to live.

They might wait until spring if you don't force their hand.

Would you have to reduce rent in order to get a new tenant? How much?

You know they are good tenants, you know they are going to be hard to replace. What is market rent?

You might think about calling them back and telling them that you've looked around and you see that rents have gone down and offer to drop the rent $150 or $200, or something that brings rent more in line with the area, if they will sign a 10 or 11 month lease (get move-out date moved to summer)

I don't normally offer to drop rent, but in their case, you know the vacancy is coming and that you are going to have to drop rent. Maybe you can drop rent and save the down time.

Is that a SFH? If so, ask them if they are thinking about buying and offer to sell the house they are in to them.

Nothing is wrong with the walls and no leaks. I was in there two months ago and checked it out. I am thinking they just want to paint for fun. Never was a mildew problem.

I did go look around at several rentals in the area and adjusted mine accordingly:
I offered to lower the rent $200 a month for 9months and they still said that is too little. It took them over a month to
respond. Another thing that annoys me is that they only converse in txt messages and never answer my calls.

They can not afford to buy.

I found a new fire extinguisher in my supples I will deliver to them and I will do an inspection.

They are not going to like it when I tell them no paint.

Thanks again all! I learn from all your responses :)

Justin,

One way to approach the extended lease term that gets you through to next summer is to stop by and talk to your tenants face to face. You need to come across as in control of your property. This is your property and you set the terms. I get the sense that the tenants feel like they have quite a bit of leverage on you.

When you stop by and talk to them explain to them that they have two options.
1.) Continue month to month at current rent. While this gives them flexibility to move out in 30 days it also gives you the flexibility to move them out in 30 days if another tenant comes along. Explain that since a month to month lease leaves you vulnerable to a winter vacancy you will begin keeping your eyes open for a 1 year lease tenant. The month to month lease with a 30 day move out notice works both ways.
2.) Sign the 9 month lease at the $200 decrease you previously offered.

Don't come across as mean. Just be polite and firm. Explain that you need to protect yourself from having the property come open this winter and that the $200 decrease is a win win for both of you. Tell them that if you don't hear back from them within XX number of days you will have to begin looking for a long term tenant to protect your interest. They are welcome to stay there on a month to month basis until you find another tenant. If you find a suitable tenant you will of course give them a 30 day notice.

I agree with everyone else that you should not let the tenant do any work on the apartment.

Again thanks for all your replies. I really appreciate it. :D

Michael you are correct They do feel like they have leverage on me. I think it is because I am a younger guy mid 20s. They are mid 30s. They also know the rental market is slow in the whole city. They do know I take good care and pride of my properties and I am very fair.

I have setup meetings several times with the tenants but then they become conveniently unavailable.
I did explain all of what you mention in 1 and 2. I had to over the phone since they would not set up a time to meet and when I conveniently stopped in they are not there.
The reason for not signing a lease is because of pay cuts at work and one started a masters degree.

The txts do annoy me. I never respond in txts I call them back immediately and I am always forwarded to voice mail.

Lately I see all the HGTV shows and read in the paper all the time advising renters to paint their rental how they want to spice it up how they want. I am sure they watch these shows and that is where they get the paint idea. Also seems odd they they want to do some painting when they are now month to month after they been there for a year.

One more question for you guys:

How am I sure they pay for the last month's rent they are their and do not use the damage deposit for the last month's rent? I do not take last months rent at lease signing. (I was advised not to by my mentor who is a PM) The tenants did mention something about using the damage deposit for last months rent when they decide to move. I told them they can not do that but what leverage do I have for them to not use the damage deposit as last months rent?