I was wondering if I should do a out of state rehab. I have never done one before. Does anyone have any ideas, suggestions or comments
I was wondering if I should do a out of state rehab. I have never done one before. Does anyone have any ideas, suggestions or comments
Victoria,
The only way I would say yes is if you are very experienced rehabber.
If you are from out of state, I am assuming you don't have crews, connections, and preferential pricing on materials. Who will run the show for you if you are not there?
Also, make sure you know the market you are getting into. I have a friend who bought an out of state property in Michigan and "just figured" the market was the same as the AZ market....long story short...they lost money and just wanted out. The rehab was suppose to take 3 weeks and took 6 months (due to shady contractors) etc. etc. etc. or yada yada yada.
So, unless you have a lot of experience I would say be very very careful...or just don't do it.
That said...if it's a good flip....start looking for another LOCAL investor you can assign or flip it to and make a few bucks.
My two cents!
Amigos,
Mark
I'm with Mark - forget trying to do the rehab long distance .
Wholesaling is a different story - we've done deals in 5 states over the years...
I love it when out of state investors buy property in Toledo. I usually buy it from them or their lender a few years later for half of what they paid.
I'm being a little bit snarky, but there is a lot of truth to what I said. Rarely do out of state buyers get good deals in Toledo (and I'm guessing most other cities too). In every market in the country there are loads of excellent LOCAL investors that spend 80 hours a week scouring for deals. Do you really think that the California, Utah, Australia, etc guys are finding deals that we don't see? No. They are buying the crap that we passed on. Here that means war zones or flood zones.
The other thing I love to hear them say is that they have their "power team" local real estate agent and property manager on the job getting them local deals. Again, trust me, they are selling you the crap that the rest of us don't want.
Again, not trying to sound nasty or snarky. Just speaking the truth.
Real estate is local. Real estate is local. Real estate is local.
Real Estate isn't necessary local. It's what you make of it.
But investing outside your local neighborhood is a whole new business. You need to be very organized and your profit margin must be higher then your use to, since their are extra cost involved. An example of this would be a project manager. Most people manage their own rehabs but when you are not there makes that extremely hard, or more impossible.
Some tips; Project manager is a must, usually around 10% of rehab cost.
Set up a local number to be forward to your office. This is important to give the impression you are in town and when people give you quotes, they wont try to take advantage of you.(But we all know they would never try this haha)
Partnering up with a local investor
Longer period of Due Diligence then you normally would do. This will give you the extra days to organize yourself.
A Real estate agent who works with out of town buyers. They usually will take 50+ pictures of the house, neighborhood, etc. May even take videos.
Project Managers must give the go ahead to finish a job up, once they have doubled check and taken pictures of the project. Your Due diligence becomes very very anal, compared to if you were there yourself.
Also remember materials and labor will be different then your local area so always do your research on everything.
Hope this helps!
Great input on other posts. The only thing I would add is that if you do decide to go into another market - spend the money to travel there and get familiar with the areas you will be buying. There is no substitute for feet on the ground.
Victoria- IMHO unless you have a team set up I would advise against it. Unless you are welling to fly out of state and be on site 2-3 days a week to make sure that the work gets done. It is possible but not for the newbie investor that has never done it before.
I do long distant flips from AZ to WI but I'm originally from WI and I know the area real well.
Thanks everyone for the input it was all very helpful. That's why i posted the topic so i could get the opinion of others and they were all very great. I think I will do the deal because I have family that lives not to far away so once I talk it over with them and see can they manage the work thats being done when i'm not there. I think it will work!
I'm curious, Victoria, whether or not you proceeded with that deal, and how it turned out if you did follow through with the remote rehab.
I disagree. Many local and remote investors got spanked when the market turned. Yet, savvy investors (whether local or remote) know how to get the data that they need to make solid investing decisions.
Any piece of real-estate on Earth could be a good deal provided one obtains it for the right price/terms. One person's trash can be another person's treasure. Properties in the most desirable areas can make money, and properties in war zones can make money too.
Besides, keep in mind that savvy investors don't need to spend 80 hrs per week scouring deals in Toledo. They could get the info that they need in less than an hour: they could call and ask an agent to run a query for all of the properties that sold in Toledo within the past 6 months. They'll know where those "experts" were buying, know the numbers, and find their next deals in those same areas for similar numbers.
Like Rudy, I also do some remote flips (and holds); some of are in OH. I'm originally from OH, know the areas where I invest very well.
The right power team definitely will make a difference--whether doing deals locally or remotely. Tax sales are one of my specialties; most investors--local or remote--aren't very familiar with them. So it should be clear at this point that local investors aren't slurping up all of the great deals; there's more than enough to go around.
No actual experience here, but everything I've read, heard, says that you need to do your homework. If you have bought locally, how much work did you have to do to feel comfortable buying your first investment? Are you willing to do the same for Toledo? (fly or drive a few times, get to know people, assemble a team, etc. etc.) This is the only reason I haven't tried "long distance" YET. I could be wrong, but it seems to me that I'd have to start my education all over again.