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Forums » Wholesaling » Cash purchase to FHA buyer

Cash purchase to FHA buyer Subscribe to Cash purchase to FHA buyer

11 posts by 5 users

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Wholesaler · Amarillo, Texas


I know about the seasoning rules when it comes to buying homes using an FHA loan then turning around and selling them.

I also know that if I purchase a government foreclosure there are seasoning rules also when reselling.

But, if I buy a house with cash from an owner that owns a house free and clear then sell it to someone using an FHA/VA loan, are there seasoning issues as well?


Real Estate Investor · Denver, Colorado


Yes, if its an FHA loan. FHA loans require 90 days from the time you are on title until you sign a contract to sell the property using an FHA loan.

Not sure about VA.

Small_flying-phoenixJon Holdman, Flying Phoenix LLC


Rehabber · Santa Clarita, California


But, if I buy a house with cash from an owner that owns a house free and clear then sell it to someone using an FHA/VA loan, are there seasoning issues as well?
Yes, the seasoning issue with FHA is from your end buyer. If your end buyer is using FHA financing, then you have a 90 day seasoning issue. You also have (as of May 1, 2009) an appraisal issue. Good luck getting your property appraised at the market value you intend on selling for.

Originally posted by Jon Holdman
FHA loans require 90 days from the time you are on title until you sign a contract to sell the property using an FHA loan.
Actually, it has been pointed out several times, originally by Ryan Weber I believe, that the 90 day seasoning period does not begin until the deed is filed with the county, that starts the clock, not just owning the property or the day escrow closes. On the 91st day from there, your end buyer may start the FHA process and enter into a PSA with you.

Small_barnardenterprisesWill Barnard, Barnard Enterprises, Inc.
E-Mail: info@barnardenterprises.com
Website: http://www.barnardenterprises.com
info@barnardenterprises.com


Wholesaler · Amarillo, Texas


Ok, thanks! Then, I'll scratch FHA buyers off the list for the first 90 days.

Renting out the property for 90 days is an option.

Buyers with commercial loans are still a viable option too.


Real Estate Investor · Denver, Colorado


Yes, you're correct, Will, recording is the key. I've learned the hard way title companies should be hounded relentlessly until the deed is actually recorded. There's no reason this can't be handled expediently.

Small_flying-phoenixJon Holdman, Flying Phoenix LLC


Real Estate Consultant · Scottsdale, AZ


HUDs mortgagee letter 06-14 states ....." FHA defines the seller's date of acquisition as the date of settlement on the seller's purchase of that property. The resale date is the date of execution of the sales contract by the buyer that will result in a mortgage to be insured by FHA.

As an example, a property acquired by the seller is not eligible for a mortgage to be insured for the buyer unless the seller has owned that property for at least 90 days. The seller must also be the owner of record. "

There is no mention in this letter the need for the deed to be recorded. Since it is the seller's choice which title company is used, perhaps using the same title company that did the original purchase would help? Reference this mortgagee letter, and inform all involved that FHA only requires proof of the closing date as suggested in the letter. If it turns out the lender requires the deed to be recorded, then they are "overwriting" the FHA guidelines, and at that point, there is nothing else to do but get it recorded. And, yes, I agree, recording is the key. But I can't imagine that any county is THAT busy that they can't record a deed in less than 90 days.


Rehabber · Santa Clarita, California


title companies should be hounded relentlessly until the deed is actually recorded. There's no reason this can't be handled expediently.
No doubt Jon. In fact, if you can choose the title company by paying the closing costs, then you could easily have much more control of the title being recorded.

HUDs mortgagee letter 06-14 states ....." FHA defines the seller's date of acquisition as the date of settlement on the seller's purchase of that property.
That is very interesting. I never looked it up as I assummed the info that has been given previously was correct as the poster was very adament about it, however, the government and FHA not only can be very confusing, but change wordings and rulings frequently. I would be curious to know what date this info was gathered from as the standards have repeadetly changed over the last few years.

Small_barnardenterprisesWill Barnard, Barnard Enterprises, Inc.
E-Mail: info@barnardenterprises.com
Website: http://www.barnardenterprises.com
info@barnardenterprises.com


Real Estate Consultant · Scottsdale, AZ


As you know, the letter I referenced was originally issued in 2006, But as a matter of fact I believe this was just released by one of my lenders..... FHA - TEMPORARY PROPERTY FLIPPING WAIVER EXTENSION. FHA has extended the temporary property flipping waiver that allows lenders and the property disposition firms they hire (or with whom they are affiliated) to sell properties on which they've foreclosed without regard to FHA's 90-day seasoning requirement. The waiver is in effect for loans with purchase agreements signed by the borrower and seller on or before May 10, 2010.

I hope this helps.


Rehabber · Santa Clarita, California


Of course, but that waiver is for banks only and not us investors and private sellers. The issue of the 90 day seasoning IS for us.

Thanks for posting that and clarifying Ron.

Small_barnardenterprisesWill Barnard, Barnard Enterprises, Inc.
E-Mail: info@barnardenterprises.com
Website: http://www.barnardenterprises.com
info@barnardenterprises.com


Wholesaler · Amarillo, Texas


Originally posted by nationwidepi
You also have (as of May 1, 2009) an appraisal issue.


Will, what exactly are you referring to with an appraisal issue?

Originally posted by nationwidepi
Actually, it has been pointed out several times, originally by Ryan Weber I believe, that the 90 day seasoning period does not begin until the deed is filed with the county, that starts the clock, not just owning the property or the day escrow closes. On the 91st day from there, your end buyer may start the FHA process and enter into a PSA with you.

Not I, Will. I've never heard this and my experience is actually to the contrary. The lender always requests that I send in my original HUD-1 and that's what they go off of for my closing date and to make sure that I'm not making too much money :D (I love the government). Not sure why it would be any different in a different market. I just closed on an FHA yesterday, and the lender had set it up for 90 days from the original HUD-1 and not the recording date.


Rehabber · Santa Clarita, California


Originally posted by Ryan Weber
Will, what exactly are you referring to with an appraisal issue?
The HVCC rules regarding appraisals. Appraisers are now being extra and overly conservative on their valuations and even more so on the oversight. I recently had an appraisal come in $25k lower than the contract purchase price and I had comp after comp showing the value over the purchase price.

Originally posted by Ryan Weber
Not I, Will. I've never heard this and my experience is actually to the contrary
Sorry for mixing you up with someone else Ryan, my mistake.

Small_barnardenterprisesWill Barnard, Barnard Enterprises, Inc.
E-Mail: info@barnardenterprises.com
Website: http://www.barnardenterprises.com
info@barnardenterprises.com


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