Best way to find Contractors in this busy market
Hi All,
I am undergoing my first renovation project. Its a small step, but its my basement which will require significant work. I am in a hot area in Boston Ma and also got lucky with home appreciation. Not only that but we can use the space, so I am treating this as my first GC project so I can get the feel for my next step, which would be true flip! Fairly soon we would like to move out and keep this as a second property.
In either case, it's summer and it's a booming market, so finding reliable help as a new person out on the scene is difficult! Any tips for finding the right contractors? I'd need to someone to knock down existing, a builder, plumber, electrician. I will pull the permits myself.
Appreciate the help!
Contact a lot of people now, be ready to wait 2-4 weeks before anyone can start.
If you call 20 people, maybe 10 will answer or call you back. Of those 10, you will eliminate/they'll flake/can't/don't want to do your job- 5 more. You'll schedule 5 to come see the project and 2-3 will show-up. Hopefully 1 of those 2-3 doesn't try to bend you over, is reliable, and does good work.
This is my experience in the 4-5yrs I've been doing this business full-time.
Thanks, I will start collecting the info now. Any sites in particular that you like to use or do you just do a google search?
Hey, I'm a small potatoes GC and I recommend ask your family and friends for referrals. I haven't had any experience with connecting online but I guess just check their reviews.
Make sure if you general it, write down the scope of work and the order of work progression. For example, don't let the electrician run wire until the plumbing and venting are in! Paint before flooring, etc. If you don't feel up to it, just get a general with good subs.
Might have to wait a bit this time of year. Everyone worth their salt is booked. If the job is worth it you might find someone out towards Worcester but Boston can be a hard town to work in for out of towners with the horrendous parking situation
Also if it's not structural work (load bearing wall and such) you might find someone without a license like a good handyman looking for some side work
@Nick Mand I look everywhere. I ask my salesmen at builders supply houses, friends, subs I like and use regularly, I've used thumbtack, angieslist, craigslist, call numbers off trucks, walked-up to jobsites and got business cards, references from people at reia's, business cards tacked onto walls at the bank and in sherwin williams, etc.
It's tough to find the good ones, they don't advertise and in this environment they don't have too. My best guys are from references from another investor that was my mentor starting but then I've had other subs from references who have been AWFUL. I just got ripped by a plumber who was referred to me by a GC I'm using, I let me guard down just for a second because it was a solid reference and it bit me. I guess references are still the best but you need to be as careful with these people as you would someone off craigslist.
I would really advise you to find a decent GC and let him handle it.
It's crazy time for contractors right now. Everyone who's any good is booked. If someone can start tomorrow, well....there's probably a reason why. A good GC has a good set of subs who will make time for him in their schedule, because he sends them repeated work.
A good GC will also keep things flowing by coordinating among the different subs to make sure the schedule goes right, that drywallers don't cover up the walls before electrical and plumbing rough-in are done, that the inspections are called in at the right time, in the right order, so you don't end up having to remove work that's already done. And he'll know what inspectors in your area are typically looking for so you typically get green-tagged on the first visit. Inspectors get frustrated if they keep showing up and having to red-tag the work that was done.
Can you learn to do these things yourself? Sure. But you don't know how to do them now. So the subs know they'll be doing more education for you, which means more work for them. And with it being busy season, there will be subs who will take a deposit from you to cash-flow things, then put your project on the absolute back burner while they take good care of the GCs who bring them regular work.
A good GC gets preferred rates from his subs, so even with his markup, you don't pay much more than you will pay to do it yourself. And you'll save money by not redoing work or experiencing extended delays.
I'd be honest and tell the GC that you'd like to learn to GC your own projects. Some will be put off by that, but others won't mind, especially if you find a contractor who's an investor himself. A lot of people in this industry like to teach and mentor wherever they can. Even with 8 full-time crews plus associated sub, I have more business than I can handle. I don't really feel threatened by an investor wanting to learn to do it himself. Find someone like that in your area and use him on your first few projects, then start gradually taking more and more responsibility yourself.
References! Call the very busy guys, ask for a quote and visit your site, they probably say "sorry, thanks but no, small project for me and not worth it". Then, you ask for references, and call them and start building that contractor's list.
I live just north of Boston. I can't get anyone to call me back. Luckily, I can do most stuff myself, but anything big. I'll call 20 people and I won't get a single call back. It took me 5 months to get a plumber to my house to hook up a gas dryer last year.
If the property is not your personal residence, you may not be able to pull permits yourself. (A building can fall down on yourself, not not on other people, is the rational.) Check with your building permit office.
@Tyler Libby just remember, every time you pick up a hammer you're only worth $25/hour (or more depending on the Tradesman but no where near as much as a RE Investor can make).
What message do you leave when you call 20 people?
@Mike Hurney I usually just tell them what I need to be done and of course anything they ask for in the recording.
#3 Contractors Contributor
- Contractor
- Los Angeles, CA
Tyler Libby Well you're obviously not saying anything. If my guys are busy and I need something done, I call companies with at least 20 employees and tell them scope and budget. i make 3 calls, 2 show up next morning. This is my script, "I need a sewer capped on a 8' deep trench, no trench walls installed, you must be confined space certified and need 1 more watch guy while you're in the trench, this is a quick 2 hour job with 2 guys with a trip at your supply house, i have a $500 budget and $90 in material, the address is 123 ABC Road. Call me back at xxx-xxx-xxxx, this needs to be done tomorrow or day after that and is classified as an On-Call service.". Words create different reactions, if you don't know what you want or doing, it's hard to get a call back.
#3 Contractors Contributor
- Contractor
- Los Angeles, CA
Nick Mand Oh boy, I could already tell that you'll have trouble finding contractors. But here is my advice, make your plans and right before you pull a permit, submit to contractor websites your draft plans. This will give any if not all professional contractors an idea of what your project is and give a price based on that. If it's professional enough, you'll have calls, this is one way for contractors to vet you, it's a two way street, remember that contractors would rather take money from a headache free client than that of anything else.
@Manolo D. is on the right track!
You don't want to leave a message like "I need you to submit a detailed Scope and Estimate so that I can review it and select five contractors to also check their references and see real examples of their work. Then next Spring I'll select a contractor to start the work..." = No Return call (obviously;-)
Outline the work, location and some urgency.
Thanks all for the help!
@Mike Hurney If there is anyone that you would recommend in the area as it looks like you are close by, let me know! I can provide my email if that is preferred.
Have you tried the app Thumbtack? You post a detailed project scope and receive up to 5 responses from contractors who can bid on the project. I posted a roofing job and received 5 inquiries within minutes (which doesn't mean they can begin the work within minute, but at least you'll hear back from contractors). You can read reviews and check out their websites as you decide who to contact.
I'm the founder of a company that is making sourcing and scheduling vendors a more simple process for property managers.
So far we have been able to successfully source vendors within 24-48 hours for property managers. With my background at Amazon developing their 2-hour shipping model and because my company spends 100% of the day and its resources on maintenance that we are able to accomplish a feat like this. We are able to contact several vendors at once that have quality community reviews, and our software makes this step much easier than spending hours searching through references and individual sites.
If you guys had a service like that available to you to you on the landlord/investor level I'm curious as to what you would want out of a service like that, and how much you personally believe you would pay for a service which finds reliable vendors, schedules them, and gets the invoices with ratings for you?
@Nick Mand most of our Contractors now spend as much time vetting (qualifying) customers as you do checking them out. You may want to join us at an upcoming meeting MassRealEstate dot net
Good advice on here. It's a busy time of year and I'd be cautious of anyone able to schedule you in on such short notice. Check credentials and detail out the scope of work. Also being that your new to this, hiring a GC with existing contacts would likely save you a lot of headache.