Second-hand smoke from condo below

[Annchen Knodt]

I just received a long letter from my tenant detailing multiple health issues she is experiencing that are clearly linked to second hand smoke coming from the unit below. I lived in this condo before renting it out and had been aware of the issue and disclosed it on the property tour. I had also spoken to the neighbor who smokes in the below unit and bought an air purifier before moving out - I had noticed clear improvement and the neighbor seemed to be smoking less. I have now written a letter to the smoking neighbor (who is the owner of the below unit, not a tenant) and forwarded the tenant's letter to the HOA, pointing out the clause in the bylaws preventing any "noxious or offensive trade or activity" (there doesn't seem to be anything specific to smoking, but I think this clearly covers it).

If there is no resolution I plan to release the tenant and hope to find one less sensitive to the issue, but this tenant is a dream and I would so love to keep her happy.  Is there anything else I can/should do? The condo is in Maryland, and specifically I'm wondering:

1) Is there any way to thoroughly seal up crevices etc to prevent smoke from getting into my unit?  From what I read online, it's fairly impossible as it can seep through walls, which seems to be the case here.  I'm going to try and call around to HVAC / duct cleaning companies etc to see if they offer any mitigation services, but would love to hear if anyone has had experience with this type of thing.

2) My tenant has reached out to the Department of Health and I'm wondering if anyone has any knowledge of how this or other government agencies might be able to intervene?  Seems unlikely but I'd like to explore all my options.

3) The HOA has declined to act previously but I'm hoping this letter from my tenant will help. As they seem to be my best bet I'm wondering if anyone has suggestions for spurring them to action.

Thanks!

[Chris Seveney]

@Annchen Knodt

What type of building is it and how old is the building?

If it’s a concrete structure for firesafing purposes there should not be openings between floors.

If there is, then call county inspector and let them know you have a fire hazard with the building

Just be advised if the county makes the condo association go through and fire safe all penetrations get ready for a really big assessment but that is a life safety issue

[Joe Villeneuve]

Smoke coming from one unit to the other doesn't man there's a fire safety problem.  There are many, many ways for this to happen.  The construction of the building will have no effect if the smoker in question is a heavy smoker.  I'm allergic to cigarette smoke, so I feel for your tenant.

I don't think that clause you referred to will have any impact on this since smoking is legal, and this would open an enormous can of worms if this went to court.

There's only one solution I see, and that's to buy the unit below and either flip it or rent that one out too (after clean up) if the complex allows for it to be a rental.  You may need to pay over property value, but the cost of keeping this unit with this problem unchecked will probably cost you more.  If (more like when) you lose this tenant, it will be next to impossible to replace her since the problem will still exist.  You can do a major cleanup (repaint, etc...) but putting lipstick on a pig doesn't solve the problem...and it will take many coats of paint to eliminate the smell that is now a co-tenant in your unit. 

[Annchen Knodt]

Quote from @Chris Seveney:

@Annchen Knodt

What type of building is it and how old is the building?

If it’s a concrete structure for firesafing purposes there should not be openings between floors.

If there is, then call county inspector and let them know you have a fire hazard with the building

Just be advised if the county makes the condo association go through and fire safe all penetrations get ready for a really big assessment but that is a life safety issue

THanks for your response!  It's a 1985 wood frame construction, only two floors.  I have wondered about firesafing also, but don't know how the different types of construction affect how this is done.  Is it different for wood frame then?

[Annchen Knodt]

Quote from @Joe Villeneuve:

Smoke coming from one unit to the other doesn't man there's a fire safety problem.  There are many, many ways for this to happen.  The construction of the building will have no effect if the smoker in question is a heavy smoker.  I'm allergic to cigarette smoke, so I feel for your tenant.

I don't think that clause you referred to will have any impact on this since smoking is legal, and this would open an enormous can of worms if this went to court.

There's only one solution I see, and that's to buy the unit below and either flip it or rent that one out too (after clean up) if the complex allows for it to be a rental.  You may need to pay over property value, but the cost of keeping this unit with this problem unchecked will probably cost you more.  If (more like when) you lose this tenant, it will be next to impossible to replace her since the problem will still exist.  You can do a major cleanup (repaint, etc...) but putting lipstick on a pig doesn't solve the problem...and it will take many coats of paint to eliminate the smell that is now a co-tenant in your unit. 

 Thanks JOe, these are my concerns also.  Incidentally, there are both tobacco and marijuana smokers in that unit, and only medical MJ is currently legal in MD, which i really doubt is the case here…  I am considering reaching out to an attorney to better understand my options.

[Bruce Woodruff]

IMO, you either have to light a fire under the HOA, or do as @Joe Villeneuve said and buy the lower unit. Easier to get nasty with the HOA. Do what it takes to make their lives miserable.....have you been to BOD meetings and expressed your concerns?

[Sergey A. Petrov]

These are tough especially in older buildings. The noxious/ offensive activity likely won’t help. Do you how the smoke gets in? If through an open window / sliding door, the fix is easy. Your tenant can close them when the neighbor is smoking. Use a fan or a portable AC unit if the reason for the open windows is that it is too hot.

Trying to chase all cracks and sealing off your unit in a 1980s building will be mission impossible. Then there are bathroom fans, kitchen fans, laundry ducts, etc. Those can run close to each other and crack overtime allowing smells to travel between the units.

I don’t think the health dept will do anything…

Is this the first communication on the subject  from your tenant. If so a long letter (+complaint to the health dept) seems like an overkill. Most will call. But if that is the nature of the relationship your tenant wants to have with you, you are better off with a new tenant 

If the tenant has been complaining and you’ve done nothing, that is a different story.

There will always be smells in an older wood frame building. Cooking? That’s another super common one in addition to smoking. Not everyone likes everyone else’s cuisine.

To me it sounds like you’ve done what you can and your might be better off moving to a single family home. If it is not smoke, it’ll be cooking, or noise or something else as different move in and out of your neighboring units

[Chris Seveney]

@Annchen Knodt

Then what I mentioned does not apply, only applies to mid rise and high rise buildings.

[Chris Seveney]

@Joe Villeneuve

In type 1 and type 2 construction which are typically high rise and mid rise you must fire safe every floor to a 2 hr rating. So every floor penetration must be firesafed and shaft must be 2 hr rated.

Wood frame structures do not apply as those are typically type 5

[Joe Villeneuve]

Quote from @Chris Seveney:

@Joe Villeneuve

In type 1 and type 2 construction which are typically high rise and mid rise you must fire safe every floor to a 2 hr rating. So every floor penetration must be firesafed and shaft must be 2 hr rated.

Wood frame structures do not apply as those are typically type 5

I know.

[Scott Mac]

Maybe be more granular in your questions to your renter.

For instance, renter says Mr. Smokey Smokey's smoke is invading my apartment and making me get emphasima, please make him stop.

You respond: Oh sorry to hear that Ms. Brezzy. Is the actual smoke coming into your unit (setting off the smoke detectors), or is it that you are smelling a stale odor from cigarettes (from time to time)?

Stale odors are probably not going to cause emphasima, but actual smoke might...(figure out which is the problem here).

If it's stale odors of smoke these handy dandy little doo dads (MIGHT) do the trick for Ms. Brezzy.

https://www.nucalgon.com/products/clenair/hvac-odor-block/

https://www.filtrete.com/3M/en_US/filtrete/products/~/Filtrete-MPR-1200-Odor-Reduction-Air-Filters/?N=4315+3288870163+3294529207&preselect=7568680+3293786499&rt=rud

Most likely I'd provide the first one's and then renter pays as needed (the Higher MERV Air filter must be changed more often than the see through ones).

Good Luck!

[Annchen Knodt]

Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:

IMO, you either have to light a fire under the HOA, or do as @Joe Villeneuve said and buy the lower unit. Easier to get nasty with the HOA. Do what it takes to make their lives miserable.....have you been to BOD meetings and expressed your concerns?

Thanks, yes really pestering the HOA is top of my list for sure. I went to one BOD meeting to bring it up, and ended up sitting right next to my smoker neighbor and having a conversation with her instead. Plan now is to get contact info for all the board members from the management company (as meetings are in person and i'm now out of state). Seems there are some who are likely to be attentive. I also know other owners in the complex with the same issue.

[Annchen Knodt]

Quote from @Sergey A. Petrov:

These are tough especially in older buildings. The noxious/ offensive activity likely won’t help. Do you how the smoke gets in? If through an open window / sliding door, the fix is easy. Your tenant can close them when the neighbor is smoking. Use a fan or a portable AC unit if the reason for the open windows is that it is too hot.

Trying to chase all cracks and sealing off your unit in a 1980s building will be mission impossible. Then there are bathroom fans, kitchen fans, laundry ducts, etc. Those can run close to each other and crack overtime allowing smells to travel between the units.

I don’t think the health dept will do anything…

Is this the first communication on the subject  from your tenant. If so a long letter (+complaint to the health dept) seems like an overkill. Most will call. But if that is the nature of the relationship your tenant wants to have with you, you are better off with a new tenant 

If the tenant has been complaining and you’ve done nothing, that is a different story.

There will always be smells in an older wood frame building. Cooking? That’s another super common one in addition to smoking. Not everyone likes everyone else’s cuisine.

To me it sounds like you’ve done what you can and your might be better off moving to a single family home. If it is not smoke, it’ll be cooking, or noise or something else as different move in and out of your neighboring units

Thanks for your insights. The neighbor smokes insiide and somehow it gets into my unit through the floor / walls / vents etc.  I sealed off the shower plumbing access panel which seemed to help but clearly not enough.  Other than that I couldnt really pin point any places it was getting in - maybe vents in bathroom but generally seemed pretty pervasiive so yes it does kind of feel like i might be looking at mission impossible for sealiing everythiing off.

This is indeed first communication from tenant.  I dont think she filed any complaints or anything but just wanted to understand what her options were before bringing it up with me.  If I release her from the lease due to her stated health concerns, i don't see her taking any sort of legal action against me (or having a case), but that's just my speculation.  THere are no SF units to rent in this area / price range (greater DC metro) so i'd expect to find tenants maybe more accepting of it if they don't have the symptoms like my current tenant is having, but I also generally don't want my tenants exposed to secondhand smoke :-(

[Annchen Knodt]

Quote from @Scott Mac:

Maybe be more granular in your questions to your renter.

For instance, renter says Mr. Smokey Smokey's smoke is invading my apartment and making me get emphasima, please make him stop.

You respond: Oh sorry to hear that Ms. Brezzy. Is the actual smoke coming into your unit (setting off the smoke detectors), or is it that you are smelling a stale odor from cigarettes (from time to time)?

Stale odors are probably not going to cause emphasima, but actual smoke might...(figure out which is the problem here).

If it's stale odors of smoke these handy dandy little doo dads (MIGHT) do the trick for Ms. Brezzy.

https://www.nucalgon.com/products/clenair/hvac-odor-block/

https://www.filtrete.com/3M/en_US/filtrete/products/~/Filtrete-MPR-1200-Odor-Reduction-Air-Filters/?N=4315+3288870163+3294529207&preselect=7568680+3293786499&rt=rud

Most likely I'd provide the first one's and then renter pays as needed (the Higher MERV Air filter must be changed more often than the see through ones).

Good Luck!

 Thank you!!  Tenant has told me she has been diagnosed with an upper respiratory infection, so i believe it's beyond the stale odor stage.  I was unfamiliar with either of those products you linked to and they both sound worth implementing!  I am thinking I will have someone service the air handler and install those (it's not in great shape but also certainly not nearly the main issue here)

[Bruce Woodruff]

Quote from @Annchen Knodt:

Thank you!!  Tenant has told me she has been diagnosed with an upper respiratory infection,

Uh oh.....I would hope this does not become litigatory.....

Meaning - CYA...

[Annchen Knodt]

Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:

Quote from @Annchen Knodt:

Thank you!!  Tenant has told me she has been diagnosed with an upper respiratory infection,

Uh oh.....I would hope this does not become litigatory.....

Meaning - CYA... 

If I release her from the lease due to her stated health concerns, i don't see her taking any sort of legal action against me (or having a case), but that's just my speculation.  What CYA steps would you recommend?  I've started looking for an attorney to consult with, and am wondering if I should deed the property over to an LLC since it's currently still in my name, but not sure if it's too late for that in this situation.

[Bruce Woodruff]

I think that consulting an attorney would be your first step. Especially now that the diagnosis has come into play....and more importantly the fact that you know about it. They can advise about the necessity of the LLC, it may not be necessary....