Investor in Arizona looking to venture into Ohio

17 Replies

How is the Ohio market for flips?  Which city is the best Cincinnati, Cleveland or Columbus?  If you are flipping in any of these cities please share your experiences.  I hear good contractors are hard to find and many of the basement homes have radon on inspection.  How have you dealt with these challenges?  Is there other things one needs to watch out for?

Thanks for the advice!

Hello Sam!

I am a Home Inspector in the Cleveland area and would be happy to answer any questions you may have about the inspection process. Don't hesitate to contact me!

Thanks,

Keith Sandy

Sam I am a full service turn key operation in the Cleveland market. I am a contractor by trade currently working with multiple bp out of state investors. We handle all aspects of sourcing the home, construction, etc.

Feel free to reach out to speak

Sam I am a full service turn key operation in the Cleveland market. I am a contractor by trade currently working with multiple bp out of state investors. We handle all aspects of sourcing the home, construction, prop management etc

Feel free to reach out to speak

Also FYI most purchases don't have inspections on investment properties.

Originally posted by @Sean Webb :

Sam I am a full service turn key operation in the Cleveland market. I am a contractor by trade currently working with multiple bp out of state investors. We handle all aspects of sourcing the home, construction, prop management etc

Feel free to reach out to speak

Also FYI most purchases don't have inspections on investment properties.

 Hey Sean, Many questions arise to me. How are you handling Property Management if your not a licensed brokerage or realtor?

Also It's highly advisable for all out of state investors to do an inspection on the property they purchase so they know exactly what they are getting themselves into. Take care of your clients first.

Originally posted by @Federico Gutierrez :
Originally posted by @Sean Webb:

Sam I am a full service turn key operation in the Cleveland market. I am a contractor by trade currently working with multiple bp out of state investors. We handle all aspects of sourcing the home, construction, prop management etc

Feel free to reach out to speak

Also FYI most purchases don't have inspections on investment properties.

 Hey Sean, Many questions arise to me. How are you handling Property Management if your not a licensed brokerage or realtor?

Also It's highly advisable for all out of state investors to do an inspection on the property they purchase so they know exactly what they are getting themselves into. Take care of your clients first.

I was unaware of where i posted about whether or not i was a licensed agent. Furthermore Ohio law is vague and has many work around to address your concerns.  It is also highly advisable that instead of working with an inspector in Ohio that requires no actual license that you work with a licensed contractor to walk through the house. That's how your clients are taken care of first.

Originally posted by @Sean Webb :
Originally posted by @Federico Gutierrez:
Originally posted by @Sean Webb:

Sam I am a full service turn key operation in the Cleveland market. I am a contractor by trade currently working with multiple bp out of state investors. We handle all aspects of sourcing the home, construction, prop management etc

Feel free to reach out to speak

Also FYI most purchases don't have inspections on investment properties.

 Hey Sean, Many questions arise to me. How are you handling Property Management if your not a licensed brokerage or realtor?

Also It's highly advisable for all out of state investors to do an inspection on the property they purchase so they know exactly what they are getting themselves into. Take care of your clients first.

I was unaware of where i posted about whether or not i was a licensed agent. Furthermore Ohio law is vague and has many work around to address your concerns.  It is also highly advisable that instead of working with an inspector in Ohio that requires no actual license that you work with a licensed contractor to walk through the house. That's how your clients are taken care of first.

 Funny. I don't see how Ohio Law is vague. It's pretty cut and dry

Ohio Revised Code Section 4735.01(A) provides a list of activities that if performed for another for a fee requires a real estate license. This list includes anyone who “operates, manages, or rents, or offers or attempts to operate, manage, or rent other than as a custodian, caretaker, or janitor, any building or portions of buildings to the public as tenants.” Also included on the list of activities that require a license are any attempts to lease property, any acts directed at procuring tenants for a property, the negotiation of leases, or advertising or holding oneself out as in the business of leasing property. Under Ohio law, performing any of these acts without a license constitutes a first degree misdemeanor and subjects the offender to a civil penalty of up to one thousand dollars per violation. Each day a violation occurs or continues is a separate violation. - See more at: http://ohiorealtors.org/legal/topics/wpproperty-ma...

Just like working with a licensed contractor you should work with a licensed PM company. 

Originally posted by @Federico Gutierrez :
Originally posted by @Sean Webb:
Originally posted by @Federico Gutierrez:
Originally posted by @Sean Webb:

Sam I am a full service turn key operation in the Cleveland market. I am a contractor by trade currently working with multiple bp out of state investors. We handle all aspects of sourcing the home, construction, prop management etc

Feel free to reach out to speak

Also FYI most purchases don't have inspections on investment properties.

 Hey Sean, Many questions arise to me. How are you handling Property Management if your not a licensed brokerage or realtor?

Also It's highly advisable for all out of state investors to do an inspection on the property they purchase so they know exactly what they are getting themselves into. Take care of your clients first.

I was unaware of where i posted about whether or not i was a licensed agent. Furthermore Ohio law is vague and has many work around to address your concerns.  It is also highly advisable that instead of working with an inspector in Ohio that requires no actual license that you work with a licensed contractor to walk through the house. That's how your clients are taken care of first.

 Funny. I don't see how Ohio Law is vague. It's pretty cut and dry

Ohio Revised Code Section 4735.01(A) provides a list of activities that if performed for another for a fee requires a real estate license. This list includes anyone who “operates, manages, or rents, or offers or attempts to operate, manage, or rent other than as a custodian, caretaker, or janitor, any building or portions of buildings to the public as tenants.” Also included on the list of activities that require a license are any attempts to lease property, any acts directed at procuring tenants for a property, the negotiation of leases, or advertising or holding oneself out as in the business of leasing property. Under Ohio law, performing any of these acts without a license constitutes a first degree misdemeanor and subjects the offender to a civil penalty of up to one thousand dollars per violation. Each day a violation occurs or continues is a separate violation. - See more at: http://ohiorealtors.org/legal/topics/wpproperty-ma...

Just like working with a licensed contractor you should work with a licensed PM company. 

Does Holton-Wise troll the forums to speak non-sense to people that do business differently than them? I am well aware of what the law says and we take our legal advice from our attorneys, not real estate agents. At no time did i say we didn't hold a license, you made the assumption. 

And for any other contractors that would like a perfect example on how to avoid the license requirement. Its simple. Don't charge a management fee.  Example

Your client rehab contract 40k and through in prop management for "free"

or a simple joint venture agreement

Feel free to contact me for multiple other work around to make it completely legal.

Originally posted by @Sean Webb :
Originally posted by @Federico Gutierrez:
Originally posted by @Sean Webb:

Sam I am a full service turn key operation in the Cleveland market. I am a contractor by trade currently working with multiple bp out of state investors. We handle all aspects of sourcing the home, construction, prop management etc

Feel free to reach out to speak

Also FYI most purchases don't have inspections on investment properties.

 Hey Sean, Many questions arise to me. How are you handling Property Management if your not a licensed brokerage or realtor?

Also It's highly advisable for all out of state investors to do an inspection on the property they purchase so they know exactly what they are getting themselves into. Take care of your clients first.

I was unaware of where i posted about whether or not i was a licensed agent. Furthermore Ohio law is vague and has many work around to address your concerns.  It is also highly advisable that instead of working with an inspector in Ohio that requires no actual license that you work with a licensed contractor to walk through the house. That's how your clients are taken care of first.

 I see this is getting a little heated, I thought I would jump in and offer some insight myself, while I see everyone is throwing around laws and rules.

#1 - In the State of Ohio in order to operate or manage someones real estate property you must be a licensed brokerage or broker.

#2 - State of Ohio does not issue licensing to General Contractors, no such thing. I would highly advise anyone seeking a reputable contractor to request pertinent information from the contractor : Copy of General Liability (you can even have it setup for you to be the Certificate Holder), Ohio Workers Compensation, City Registration where the work is being performed, warranty information, contract, defined scope of work, W-9, references client and professional). Now, trade specialties such as (Plumbing, HVAC, Electrical) are all licensed trades in the State of Ohio, they should be able to facilitate a copy of the license, you can also go online and check in a state database the current state of the license. 

#3 - In the State of Ohio home inspectors are not licensed, however, you may want to consider getting a Home Inspector that is a registered HUD Consultant or a NACHI registered inspector. Just like a GC you can request some pertinent information in advance to get a gauge on experience and knowledge. You may ask (Insurance, W-9, References, if they worked with investors before, a copy of a report sample)

You want to go through this vetting process, you want to be able to utilize the experience of the contractor and the people around you to insure you are capturing all there administrative actions insuring you are able have as many controls as possible. A competent and experienced contractor will pull all the proper permits first, they will not fool around as they want to retain a good reputation with the municipality if they expect to continue working in that respected city.  Call the building department and ask if they have heard or know of the contractor you elect to work with, believe me they know the good and bad ones. Its not a secret to anyone that a junk contractor or one that is looking to cut corners are all well monitored or not even allowed to operate in the city.

Finally, you do not want to begin any process with anyone that is seeking to evade or circumvent rules and manipulate the system. Whats wrong with the system and the controls set forth by State Law or Rules, they are designed ot protect consumers. My advice is that if you cannot figure out a way to do it the correct and legal way, then you are not setting up a future of success and growth. You will always deal with some challenges and eventually this will become a very laborious and seemingly bad experience. I encourage you to do things the way they are supposed to be done, in a professional manner that will allow you to build long term wealth not just make a quick buck.

#TeamTurnkey

You guys are funny when you skew facts and mislead people. Its hilarious this is your focus to gain business. So lets address actual facts.

The state of Ohio does not require a contractor to be licensed. Furthermore the state may not offer general licenses however the city they work in do. 

Telling people that they have to be a broker to be your PM is also incorrect. Their are exclusions to such statements and this seems to be overlooked in these statements these guys make. Exclusions are such as homeowners, joint ventures, pms that dont charge a pm fee, etc etc.

If anyone refers you to a INTERNACHI inspector i would be skeptical of any further information they refer you to as those specific inspectors are self taught with an online course with no type of actual training.

The irony in people making statements saying that if you use the way the law is written to your advantage that your not setting your self up for success. Clearly they must not take advantage of poorly written tax advantages or city ordinances. Are you not aware that Donald Trump & Henry Ford both pushed the limits of the law to their advantage and became very successful.

I am done arguing with people that are misinformed and do not have the ability to analyze a simple law to understand it and break it down. 


Suburbs of Akron Canton is where we focus our rehabs. Selling is pretty easy if you have a good product, finding profitable deals is a bigger challenge.

Our group is on target to rehab a little over 40 houses this year, stark, summit and portage counties, excluding Canton, and Akron schools. 

About 70% of our buyers ask for radon inspections. Roughly half the houses tested have radon levels above acceptable levels.  

Cost of remediation is about 1,000.

The way we handle it, whenever we get an offer on a property and the buyer wants a radon test. We write in initial counter offer that if there is radon, buyer and seller will split costs, most buyers will accept that. If we don't write it in before inspection, they always want us to pay for it. 

Thus most radon mitigation costs us about $500. Not a major expense. 

There are plenty of good subcontractors in Ohio, assume gcs as well, although I haven't hired any, we act as our own gc on our projects, as do the other rehabbers we work with.

Hi Sean Webb, are you licensed in Ohio as a real estate agent?  I'm not seeing your name as a licensed agent anywhere.  Or do you have a broker who acts on your behalf?  Just wondering.

Originally posted by @Mike Ferrante :

Hi Sean Webb, are you licensed in Ohio as a real estate agent?  I'm not seeing your name as a licensed agent anywhere.  Or do you have a broker who acts on your behalf?  Just wondering.

 I am not a licensed agent. My wife and CFO is however.  Again you guys make a lot of assumptions and seem to be so wound up in me. 

Originally posted by @Dell Schlabach :

Suburbs of Akron Canton is where we focus our rehabs. Selling is pretty easy if you have a good product, finding profitable deals is a bigger challenge.

Our group is on target to rehab a little over 40 houses this year, stark, summit and portage counties, excluding Canton, and Akron schools. 

About 70% of our buyers ask for radon inspections. Roughly half the houses tested have radon levels above acceptable levels.  

Cost of remediation is about 1,000.

The way we handle it, whenever we get an offer on a property and the buyer wants a radon test. We write in initial counter offer that if there is radon, buyer and seller will split costs, most buyers will accept that. If we don't write it in before inspection, they always want us to pay for it. 

Thus most radon mitigation costs us about $500. Not a major expense. 

There are plenty of good subcontractors in Ohio, assume gcs as well, although I haven't hired any, we act as our own gc on our projects, as do the other rehabbers we work with.

 Dell that's a very smart clause to write in the paperwork. I think I may have to steal your idea. Lol

most of the time when a new client approaches us we throw the property management in for free to get them on their feet. If you read the law you clearly see it says it's illegal when you collect a fee. Either way makes no difference since a licensed agent works with our clients anyways but again points out how much you guys can't read. Furthermore since we are talking about licenses let's talk about all the legal advice I keep reading from unlicensed "lawyers" on here. 

I work with a lot of investors in and out of state, and I always advise they get a neutral 3rd party inspection done.  Never wise to have contractor who is trying to get the job, to do the property inspection for you, until you have a solid relationship with that contractor.  

No matter what your doing, accountability is a must have.  To much money being thrown around to go without inspections, and insight from parties who don't stand to make 15k from your purchase...

No matter how neutral turnkey providers try to be, they have a large payday coming at the end of the deal, so there motivation is highly skewed.  You need an inspection of some kind in my opinion until you know you have a contractor you can trust, and even then I would probably still get some type of 3rd party viewpoint on every deal to make sure your as safe as possible.  

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