Rating Cincinnati Neighborhoods for B&H: What do you think?

31 Replies

Hello fellow BPers and Cincy REIs!

A complete "newbie" that is trying to educate myself on buy & hold, as well as the local Cincinnati/N KY markets.  I was interested on getting feedback on how some people might rate (A, B, C, etc.) the neighborhoods around the city.  I realize that individual investing strategdy comes into play here, along with other variables. For the sake of a standard, let's say we're rating on a long term B & H strategy, looking for cash flow/equity build, any appreciation is a bonus.  I guess I'm trying to gauge my perspective and rating versus more season veterans and see where I'm at.  I'm concentrating my scope on the I-71 corridor and some neighborhoods near there.  Any feedback and info is appreciated! Please feel free to voice your opinion.  Look forward to getting to know more BPers and local connections!  Thanks!

My take:

Walnut Hills - B+

Norwood - C

Silverton - C+

Pleasant Ridge - B

Hyde Park - A

Oakley - A

Mt. Lookout - A

Columbia Tusculum - A

Kennedy Heights - ??

St. Bernard - C-

Great info, thanks. We'll be visiting at the end of the month and I will taking your list with me. I can let you know my thoughts after meeting with some brokers. 

@Todd Kalsey  

Todd your grades for those areas, imo, are spot on.  One other area you may want to consider that has a lower barrier to entry, but is nearby to surrounding great areas, would be Mt. Washington.  Mt.  Washington is close by to Mt. Lookout and Hyde Park.  Getting started a location like this may be a great start for you.  Another area to maybe consider is Madisonville/Madison Place.     

@Craig James

Craig:  Appreciate the feedback.  Mt. Washington is a great area...slipped my mind!

            Any thoughts on Deer Park? (B-)  Was thinking solid working class neighborhood, some younger professionals with starter homes.  

Originally posted by @Melissa N. :

Great info, thanks. We'll be visiting at the end of the month and I will taking your list with me. I can let you know my thoughts after meeting with some brokers. 

 Melissa:  Glad I could help.  Hope you enjoy our city.  Please let me know your thoughts once you swing through!

Originally posted by @Craig James:

@Todd Kalsey 

Todd your grades for those areas, imo, are spot on.  One other area you may want to consider that has a lower barrier to entry, but is nearby to surrounding great areas, would be Mt. Washington.  Mt.  Washington is close by to Mt. Lookout and Hyde Park.  Getting started a location like this may be a great start for you.  Another area to maybe consider is Madisonville/Madison Place.     

 Craig:  Appreciate the feedback on my list.  Also, Mt. Washington totally slipped my mind...thanks!

Originally posted by @Todd Kalsey :

@Craig James

Craig:  Appreciate the feedback.  Mt. Washington is a great area...slipped my mind!

            Any thoughts on Deer Park? (B-)  Was thinking solid working class neighborhood, some younger professionals with starter homes.  

 Todd about all I know about the Deer Park area is where it is.  Other than that I am not of help for that area.  For that area ask @JoeCornwell

Originally posted by @Adam Newcomb :

For info, is west Chester and mason considered "A"?

Adam, I'm a total "newbie" but I would say Mason is definitely due to arguably best school district in the suburbs. West Chester is pretty solid too for suburbs although it's more in the I-75 corridor. I'm Still solid schools, a notch below Mason in most people's minds. Not sure what the rental market is in terms of SFR in these areas or potential cash flow. More the appreciation game here IMO.

Kennedy Heights and Walnut Hills are spotty. More potential in Walnut Hills and I'd be paying attention to East Walnut Hills and near the Eden Park area for now. Parts of Walnut Hills are A neighborhoods but in the million dollar price range. Also, Huge interchange going in that will be a game changer for Walnut Hills as well. A lot of big money being thrown around near the interchange. Parts of Walnut Hills are D/F parts too.

Kennedy Heights has areas that I would call B neighborhoods and there are some great houses in these areas in pretty safe spots. There are also parts of Kennedy Heights I'd say are D. And everything in between. 

Grew up in West Chester and sad to say Lakota Schools have been on the decline, but people still like the area and Liberty township is getting a lot of attention too. 

Most of these neighborhoods on your list have good parts and bad.  Norwood, for example, is a no way zone for me south of the Lateral and west of Mongtomery Rd.  Presidential District and South Presidential Districts are great, though.

Same with Kennedy Heights. Some streets I won't drive on and others I'd buy for my own investments. I'd put Silverton and Deer Park on pretty equal footing, though Deer Park is more desirable to my customers for some reason. They'll take 25% ROI there but demand 30%+ in Silverton. I suspect that some consider Silverton to be "diverse" (their code word for black folks living there), where Deer Park is mostly considered white blue collar folks (feels like a west side town to me).

Columbia Tusculum is hit or miss.  Even parts of Oakley are tough for me to sell.  Here's a pic of the locations of the last 65 or so houses we've bought/sold.  You'll see that there's opportunity all over Cincinnati.

Adam:

Thanks for the feedback and insight.  Yes, agree that Lakota schools have been on the decline but I do constantly hear people looking in the WC and Liberty Township area.  I'll have to take a drive through Walnut Hills and check out the interchange construction.  Appreciate the info and also your other informative posts!

Sean:

Couldn't agree more with you "good parts/bad parts" evaluation.  That really was the main question I had before posting.  It seems like certain sections of neighborhoods are home runs if you find something, while other parts I'd never touch.

Also, you couldn't be more correct on the DP/Silverton comparison and speaking the hard truth there.  People see it, but won't say it.  Thanks for the map and info!  

Thanks for starting the thread @Todd Kalsey . I'm literally on a plane headed to Cincy now and plan on checking on a couple of these areas while I'm in town. My in-laws live in Madeira and Mason. I have friends from Walnut Hills and West Chester, but look forward to spending time I other areas.

Originally posted by @Todd Kalsey :

Adam:

Thanks for the feedback and insight.  Yes, agree that Lakota schools have been on the decline but I do constantly hear people looking in the WC and Liberty Township area.  I'll have to take a drive through Walnut Hills and check out the interchange construction.  Appreciate the info and also your other informative posts!

No problem. For now, people are really drawn to the taxes in WC/LT. There's been talks of that changing thought from what I've heard. 

@Todd Kalsey

My thoughts and opinion are in line with most of the feedback on here. As mentioned, most of those neighborhoods have specific areas that I would not invest in. The biggest question that needs answered is what areas can you afford, and how are you going to manage them? If you are managing them yourself, are you comfortable collecting rent, showing units, etc in D/F areas? If not then you either need strong management that is comfortable and you need to buy at a price that makes sense to pay for management. It's basically a simple ideology of, the better the area the more it cost which typically = less cash flow. This can also mean less turnover cost, vacancy, etc. Its all risk vs reward... you could also potentially invest in an F area, find a great tenant and they take awesome care of a property, and it cash flows through the roof. Those are the first questions I would answer, what is my comfort level, who is managing, and how much risk can I afford? 

As for the Deer Park Vs. Silverton discussion, having worked for both police departments, prior to Silverton's disbanding in 2014. Deer Park is very different, even though the City Buildings are less than a mile apart. Silverton has significantly more crime, and violent crime. Also most of Silverton is in the City of Cincinnati's school district. I would suggest researching those school systems, class sizes, etc to make an informed decision if you are looking at either of those neighborhoods. 

@Joseph Cornwell  Yes, that's what I'm wrestling with right now.  Finding that happy medium between cash flow and potential headaches.  Since I'm still a year or so away, I'm trying to due my homework and really get to know some of the areas.  Your feedback on DP vs. Silverton is quite helpful! Appreciate your time to respond!

@Todd Kalsey  

No problem, Deer Park and some surrounding neighborhoods are strong rental markets, that is where I look for rental properties. You definitely need to continue educating yourself and define exactly what you are willing/comfortable doing, that should help narrow your focus. If you have questions about particular markets near Deer Park, or really anywhere east of I-75, feel free to message me. I am also a license real estate agent in Ohio. Good luck!

I would add OTR/Pendelton to your list! The appreciation in OTR has been very strong and there is a ton of $ being put into developing the surrounding area right now. With the streetcar opening next month, lots of business flocking to the area as well.

Avondale is kind of a war zone. (well, C- / D- )

I mean, sure there are probably some nice places, but Avondale is constantly in the news (and not for good reasons).

Melissa Nevich I think Avondale falls into what was said earlier regarding a lot of Cincinnati neighborhoods.  There a some "patches" or "spots" that are really nice.   Think edge of N. Avondale near XU, Rose Ave near Avon Fields off East Mitchell and also a couple other pockets. Beautiful old homes, but difficult to find continuity within.  Evanston seems to be getting some rehabbing going on especially nearer Dana Ave and XU.  With the commercial build off the Dana Ave. exit this seems to have helped.

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