International Real Estate

User Stats

23
Posts
37
Votes
Thomas Youngman
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Portugal
37
Votes |
23
Posts

Property Investment in Portugal

Thomas Youngman
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Portugal
Posted Jan 8 2019, 17:57

Hi,

The purpose of this post is to connect with anyone interested/actively investing in the Portuguese Real Estate market. 

I am moving to Portugal in March 2019 and wanted to connect with fellow Property investors. There seems to be an interesting investment case for Portugal currently and by building a supportive network of investors we will be able to discuss opportunities and build our experience faster than if we go it alone

When I arrive in March I will be focusing on learning the market and seeing which strategies will work for me. 

Thanks

Thomas

User Stats

19
Posts
12
Votes
Replied Aug 15 2019, 05:19

@Bernardo Bento - That's some awesome information - Thanks! A few questions if I may:

> so the option of letting via Airbnb is a viable one though they aren’t giving more licenses in these areas

Is it possible to purchase/transfer AL licenses from existing owners? What determines when AL licences are available again? Is there a publicly accessible list available of the areas where AL licenses are still available? Are there any fees/taxes associated with AL licenses?

> Capital gains realized by nonresidents on the sale of Portuguese property are taxed at a flat rate of 28%

Are there any other options that are more tax-efficient (E.g. Portuguese-registered businesses, businesses registered elsewhere in the EU)? Is capital-gains charged for ALL properties or just for properties over x-value built after x-date?

User Stats

19
Posts
12
Votes
Replied Aug 15 2019, 05:30

@Thomas Youngman - As promised, I reached out to some folks from the expat community and they recommend the following:

* Liliana Solipa - Lawyer (Contact: https://homekeyportugal.com/advogado/?lang=pt-pt and https://pt.linkedin.com/in/liliana-solipa-15a17ba3)
* Armanda Vidal - Estate agent (Contact: https://global.remax.com/en/agents/portugal/carnaxide-e-queijas-queijas/armanda-vidal/121481148)
* Azevedo Legal - Law Firm (Contact: https://azevedolegal.com/) --> This looks to be the most promising as their expertise seem to cover the questions you have, incl. tax law.

User Stats

103
Posts
17
Votes
Joe Crupi
  • Rental Property Investor
17
Votes |
103
Posts
Joe Crupi
  • Rental Property Investor
Replied Aug 16 2019, 06:02

@Bernardo Bento

Hello! Hope all is well. Thanks for the info. The golden visa sounds interesting, but def oit of my price range. The fees they tack on AFTER you invest hindreds of thousands of dollars is just nuts!

Btw, only been to portugal once but loved it. Great food and people.

User Stats

9
Posts
10
Votes
Bernardo Bento
  • Real Estate Agent
10
Votes |
9
Posts
Bernardo Bento
  • Real Estate Agent
Replied Aug 16 2019, 06:39

@Ryan Knoetze As far as I know, these are the areas (in red) https://cdn2-img.pressreader.c...
I just read some news saying they are now allowing new AL licenses BUT only for 5 years, after that they will re-evaluate them and decide wether you can keep them or not.

Also, regarding taxes, if you apply for an AL license you should declare your rental income under category B, this type of activity receives a special treatment under the IRS and tax is calculated on sales, in other words you are only taxable on 15% or 35% of your invoiced income, depending on the way your business is structured.

Capital gains are not charged if the property is more than 30 years and you refurbished it or if it is located on an urban rehabilitation zone. Also, if the capital gains are reinvested in real estate inside the country you won't have to pay any tax. Imagine that you have a capital gain of 20k, if you invest those 20k as a down payment for another property in the following 2 years you won't have to pay tax on them. If you choose not to invest them, you'll have to pay tax (28%) on 50% of that, which would be 2.8k €. Also, since you're living outside the country I think that there are some special laws in your favour and you won't have to pay as much. Not sure though I would have to look more into it.

User Stats

9
Posts
10
Votes
Bernardo Bento
  • Real Estate Agent
10
Votes |
9
Posts
Bernardo Bento
  • Real Estate Agent
Replied Aug 16 2019, 06:44
Originally posted by @Joe Crupi:

@Bernardo Bento

Hello! Hope all is well. Thanks for the info. The golden visa sounds interesting, but def oit of my price range. The fees they tack on AFTER you invest hindreds of thousands of dollars is just nuts!

Btw, only been to portugal once but loved it. Great food and people.

Joe, you can also buy a property for 350k and they will give you a Golden Visa. It has some special requirements though such as being older than 30 years and in need of a requalification OR in an urban regeneration zone. Needless to say, it will be more expensive than 350k, but at least it won't be 500k. 🤷‍♂️😎

User Stats

9
Posts
10
Votes
Bernardo Bento
  • Real Estate Agent
10
Votes |
9
Posts
Bernardo Bento
  • Real Estate Agent
Replied Aug 16 2019, 06:46
Originally posted by @Riaan Knoetze:

@Bernardo Bento - That's some awesome information - Thanks! A few questions if I may:

> so the option of letting via Airbnb is a viable one though they aren’t giving more licenses in these areas

Is it possible to purchase/transfer AL licenses from existing owners? What determines when AL licences are available again? Is there a publicly accessible list available of the areas where AL licenses are still available? Are there any fees/taxes associated with AL licenses?

> Capital gains realized by nonresidents on the sale of Portuguese property are taxed at a flat rate of 28%

Are there any other options that are more tax-efficient (E.g. Portuguese-registered businesses, businesses registered elsewhere in the EU)? Is capital-gains charged for ALL properties or just for properties over x-value built after x-date?

I replied to you but wasn't able to mention you for some reason. My reply is like 2 answers above this one. 

User Stats

1
Posts
1
Votes
Replied Aug 17 2019, 08:12

Hello everyone,

I am new here and quite interested in REI in Portugal, especially in the northern part and Porto. We went there last year and just loved the place! Great weather, people and food ;)

Any idea about the market there? Since it's been going up very fast, any chance that it falls a little with the upcoming/foreseen recession? Also any opportunities you could think about? Is it easy to get a loan when you're a foreigner and not working in the country?

I will be there next September and October, so please feel free to contact me if you're also there and would like to meet and directly exchange about the topic. I look forward to it!

Thanks! 

User Stats

15
Posts
11
Votes
Replied Aug 23 2019, 12:10

Hi @Emilie Berger, I would recommend talking to a Portuguese mortgage broker about the loan, as far as I know, it is possible, don't know if it's easy but conditions and ease will differ, probably by a significant amount, from bank to bank. About the market, I live in Lisbon and don't really know how the market is in those areas.

Either way would love to meet, let me know when you are going to be here and in which part of the country.

Hope this helps and best of luck!

User Stats

2
Posts
0
Votes
Eugene Du Rand
  • Developer
  • Algarve
0
Votes |
2
Posts
Eugene Du Rand
  • Developer
  • Algarve
Replied Sep 3 2019, 10:04

Hi all,

Some good info here, thanks to all!

I'm looking to buy in the Algarve, either some land or something to refurb.

London based and been in the building industry for 15 odd years,

Any meet ups down there or guys doing the same thing and interested to share ideas etc?

@Riaan Knoetze you South African?

User Stats

19
Posts
12
Votes
Replied Sep 3 2019, 10:20

@Eugene Du Rand - Lekker man, lekker! I think that answers your question ;)

Waiting for residency stuff and then I'll be calling Algarve home; Things are bloody taking forever! Great to have another Saffa on here!

#smallworld

User Stats

2
Posts
0
Votes
Eugene Du Rand
  • Developer
  • Algarve
0
Votes |
2
Posts
Eugene Du Rand
  • Developer
  • Algarve
Replied Sep 3 2019, 10:55

@Riaan Knoetze haha ek het so gedink met dai naam!

So you still back home?

I saw you post some links etc further back but have you found anything for down there?

Did you have an area down there in mind?

User Stats

12
Posts
3
Votes
Replied Sep 19 2019, 23:13

Hi guys. I currently live at Ovar (40km from Porto) but also have lived in Portimão (Algarve) and around Porto, so to start, these might the areas i'll be targetting. I'm currently in the learning and networking phase, i have already an idea of what i want to do, but still need to contact a few people to see what i can get from them. Some have many years of experience in construction and many knowledge and connections in the Porto area. Then, when it comes to Algarve, i also have people i trust in Portimão which can help me a lot. One, for example, is a property manager specialized in short term rentals. I also know someone specialized in student rentals in Coimbra, who's interested to invest in more student rentals there, or LTR/STR in Algarve.

As you can see, from the people i know, this is what i'm starting to lean. When i know exactly the strategies i will use, i'll tell you more about it.

PS: One thing i'm almost sure at this point is, if you plan to buy a one utit property, put a mortgage on it and use LTR, it is very likely it won't work. Rents in Portugal are very low and barely can cover for the mortgage. Not saying that cannot be exceptions but seems pretty hard.

Regards. 

User Stats

12
Posts
3
Votes
Replied Sep 20 2019, 02:27

Hi guys, i made a post moments ago introducing myself but for some reason got deleted. So before i try to write it all down again, just letting you know im on the same boat. For now im just trying to figure whats wrong with the posts.

User Stats

12
Posts
3
Votes
Replied Sep 20 2019, 03:47

Hello all, good to find more people looking to Invest in Portugal.

I'll make a better post later when i can. 

User Stats

5
Posts
7
Votes
Replied Nov 4 2019, 06:11

Hello everyone,

Any one investing in multi-family buying entire buildings in Portugal?

User Stats

133
Posts
39
Votes
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
39
Votes |
133
Posts
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
Replied Nov 7 2019, 21:28

@Thomas Youngman I am excited to find this thread! I have been exploring Portugal as an investment opportunity and looking for others to learn from and perhaps partner with. I would love to hear about your experience to date and what you have learned! I plan to come a scope out locations/properties this winter. 

User Stats

133
Posts
39
Votes
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
39
Votes |
133
Posts
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
Replied Nov 7 2019, 21:30

@Angelo Costa I would be interested in learning more about multi-family investing. I would like to buy a multi-family and convert into micro units to maximize revenue. I wonder if you have heard of this being done in Portugal? It is legal and very lucrative in some parts of the US. 

User Stats

133
Posts
39
Votes
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
39
Votes |
133
Posts
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
Replied Nov 7 2019, 21:36

@Bernardo Bento where can i find what is included in the rehabilitation zone? 

User Stats

3
Posts
1
Votes
Replied Nov 11 2019, 05:11

Hello everyone,

Good to see here a post regarding property investment in Portugal. So far I only have one apartment but planning to increase next year. My strategy is mainly focused on Buy and Hold.

Best regards,

Frederico

User Stats

42
Posts
21
Votes
Luís Ferreira
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Lisbon, Lisbon
21
Votes |
42
Posts
Luís Ferreira
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Lisbon, Lisbon
Replied Nov 11 2019, 12:19

Hi  guys,

I had returned to Portugal, and so, living in Lisbon from September and for the next 3 years for sure. Been lucky to meet personally some of you (Diogo, Angelo, others) and will be happy to meet more of you. So if you are in Lisbon or around, hit a message.

Best regards,

Luis

User Stats

11
Posts
11
Votes
Alexandre Pita
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Lisbon
11
Votes |
11
Posts
Alexandre Pita
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Lisbon
Replied Nov 13 2019, 04:13

Hello guys,

I'm a portuguese Investor, owner of several properties and I'm looking for partners to expand!
I invest in the Lisbon South Bay area, and other suburbs of Lisbon region - several regions with good opportunities.

I look up to meet you in a Meetup, but also hit me up if you need help or information about REI in Portugal :)

User Stats

15
Posts
11
Votes
Replied Nov 15 2019, 11:00

@Marielle Walter, I'm actually working on a project using that strategy in Oeiras, Lisbon, we are converting a large single-family house into micro studios for students and a small hostel. It's in the renovation/construction phase, I actually walked the property today with @Luís Ferreira.

We are also looking into multi-family in Lisbon and greater Lisbon areas right now @Angelo Costa, but the way the market is in this area it's been a little tricky to find something where the numbers make sense, have you found any deals?

Let me know if you're around and let's meet up!

User Stats

5
Posts
7
Votes
Replied Nov 15 2019, 13:57

Hello Diogo,

We should definitively meet. May be we can organize something with Luís as well.

Regards.

User Stats

133
Posts
39
Votes
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
39
Votes |
133
Posts
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
Replied Nov 15 2019, 19:15

@Diogo Candido Wow very cool you are doing the same type of project i am looking to go into! I would love to hear more about it. I plan to visit portugal soon and would like to meet if you would be up for it. I'll be scoping out properties all over the country but definitely in Oeiras as well - i am eyeing one there right now. How many micro units will you have in that one house? What is the cap rate? Do you have a property management company you use? 

User Stats

133
Posts
39
Votes
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
39
Votes |
133
Posts
Marielle Walter
  • Washington, DC
Replied Nov 15 2019, 19:35

@Alexandre Pita i would be interested to connect and learn about your current investments and plans for the future - i plan to invest in Portugal this spring and i have others from my investment group that may be interested.