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All Forum Posts by: Jon Martin

Jon Martin has started 33 posts and replied 996 times.

My STRs are a few counties south of Asheville and lost power for a week. It was pretty easy for me to refund guests once I called in, including fees, but by the time I was making the calls it was clearly a mess. With the app I could only refund from my own payout. 

Hope that helps! 

If you have room in your DTI you can get a Fannie/Freddy loan. If it works as a LTR with rent higher than PITI you can DSCR.

Plenty of markets with a lower entry point where the numbers work. I heard a STR focused book keeper say that the her Midwest investors are crushing it, while the more typical markets are struggling.

Post: Co-hosting vs. Arbitrage

Jon MartinPosted
  • Posts 1,007
  • Votes 865
Quote from @Todd Goedeke:

@Jon Martin You are right , if you don t know how to market a property and get direct reservations you should not attempt to co-host or triple net lease a property.

You fail to mention that leases on a property can be as long as 30 years.Long leases are a way to give both property owners and management companies favorable terMs.

How common are 30 year leases for SFRs? If I am signing a contract to pay for 30 years, then I may as well get a mortgage and own it by the end. Plus it would have to be a banger of a property for me to have that kind of confidence in it going the distance through all the market cycles, regulation changes, OTA market shifts etc at which point I may as well buy it.

Which circles back to my original point- if I am not owning and benefiting from the appreciation, why should I absorb so much risk and upfront capital if instead I can find an underperforming property with potential, take a guaranteed return off the top and invest almost no money on my side? 

Same day. Especially if there is a decent gap between the next guest, I want someone to be able to book for that night and stay as long as possible. Every night you allow to pass is money not made. 

Exception would be if there a check in the next day, because I don't allow 1-night stays. At that point I don't mind giving the cleaner a break. 

Post: Co-hosting vs. Arbitrage

Jon MartinPosted
  • Posts 1,007
  • Votes 865

Agreed with @John Underwood it is basically a job. 

I wouldn't touch arbitrage with a 10 foot pole unless it was a super unique property and situation with an owner where I saw some longevity and buy in from them. Otherwise you spend year 1 paying yourself back for the furniture (if you're lucky) and then hope to make a profit in year 2, only for your lease to possibly change terms, losing all of the time you put into building your brand. Plus the gray area between who's responsible for repairs. 

If I found myself out of work I would consider co-hosting to the pay the bills. Almost zero risk/investment and direct payment off of top line. 

Quote from @John Underwood:
I really like Vrbo's free dynamic pricing tool. It has worked well for me.

 I'm sure I would like it if it worked. I had to go into the app to delete it (based on your rec, thank you btw!) because the desktop version put me into an endless loop. 

Quote from @Denis Ponder:

I can see VRBO trying to protect their brand and set a bar of excellence with this.

However, it also makes you wonder if they are being rated accurately.  If multiple guests have a terrible experience and rate those accordingly, this should resolve itself.  If someone comes by after that and books a 2star property expecting 5star service, that's their fault.


 Problem is that they are putting all of the onus on the host instead of working on their own backend issues. A few examples: 

-OneKey points that can be redeemed for some listings but not others

-Certain photos being denied from upload with no explanation for why

-Completely failed dynamic pricing tool that puts you in a catch 22 with your calendar 

At least AirBnb has their IT game in order and a modern and relatively intuitive interface with updated fonts, graphics etc. VRBO needs a facelift, badly. 

Quote from @Ken Boone:
Quote from @Denis Ponder:

I can see VRBO trying to protect their brand and set a bar of excellence with this.

However, it also makes you wonder if they are being rated accurately.  If multiple guests have a terrible experience and rate those accordingly, this should resolve itself.  If someone comes by after that and books a 2star property expecting 5star service, that's their fault.

They are trying to turn in to AirBnb…

If they want to do that, at least improve on the interface/user experience. VRBO's is a decade behind AirBnb in that regard. 

Quote from @Christine Cho:

Yes, it was the penalty I paid for not being firm and not knowing what do to...it seems like alteration request being used as way to get more refund is not new issue, and until Airbnb fixes this hosts have to be aware and plan for the course of action and stick with it.

Agreed with the above- unless there is an extenuating circumstance where the blame falls on you then you don't owe them anything. They've already blocked dates off your calendar that you most likely will not fill on short notice. These types of people are never satisfied and probably make everyone around them miserable with their constant back and forth with everything. 

The only times that I've allowed this was a situation where there was a cleaning or a maintenance issue, which ultimately falls on me.  In that case I don't go back and forth, I simply tell them they can have a refund for unused nights if they leave immediately. 

@Angela Marquez ok that's where the confusion is. From what I can tell there is no need to upload a formal rental agreement on your end. You put your house rules in the listing and the platform walks them through it.