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Forums » Starting Out » Owner died, no will. Question

Owner died, no will. Question Subscribe to Owner died, no will.  Question

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Real Estate Investor · Longview, Texas


Ok, I think I've come across one of those situations you read about in the real estate books that you think never happen.

My father in law's dad died two years ago. He owned an old 1940s house. County appraises it at 35k, I see comps for sale in the area for 30-55. It needs some work from what I understand. Here's the deal:

When he died he didnt have a will in place so the house is still under the deceased name (it had no mortgage). My father in law (the responsible one in the family) doesnt want to do anything with it. The house is just sitting there empty, back taxes are owed on it. He has no motivation to do anything. The rest of the symblings are either dead or crack heads. So my question is how would I go about buying a house like this?

Im pretty sure I can get this house for cheap.

Owner died. No will. Paid off mortgage.
Owner had 4 kids, two are still living
the 2 kids that died have living kids.

Im in Texas.

I know I will have to eventually get a real estate lawyer to figure out all this just trying to get a preliminary idea of what I can expect.

Thanks.

Nick


Real Estate Investor · Corpus Christi, Texas


Nick,

From what I understand, this house would have to go through the probate process to get a clear title on it. It doesn't sound like it has.

I would definately consult a real estate attorney before I put up any funds or made any commitments.


Real Estate Investor · Longview, Texas


Thanks Ali.

Another question that I just thought of:

When probate stuff is complete, is there a single person responsible for decision making for the house? Or is it shared responsibility? The reason Im asking is it may be difficult to get 6+ people to all agree to a sale price. I can just imagine one person is going to be the sore thumb and want some outrageous price.


Wholesaler · Memphis, Tennessee


nick,

When a person dies without a will and owns property it is called Intestate. the property is supposed to pass to the decedent's heirs according to the states Statue Of Descent and Distribution. In effect, the state makes a will for an intestate decedent.

You will want to check what your state has in place for this issue. Good luck.
p.s. the above paragraph came right out of the Modern Real estate Practice textbook.

Small_buymemphisnow_stacksCurt Davis, buyMemphisnow.com
E-Mail: crtdavis@gmail.com
Telephone: 901-881-0552
Website: http://www.buymemphisnow.com
Full Service Real Estate Investing in Memphis TN


Real Estate Investor · Corpus Christi, Texas


Originally posted by Nick Dunin
Thanks Ali.

Another question that I just thought of:

When probate stuff is complete, is there a single person responsible for decision making for the house? Or is it shared responsibility? The reason Im asking is it may be difficult to get 6+ people to all agree to a sale price. I can just imagine one person is going to be the sore thumb and want some outrageous price.

Hi Nick,

I am speaking from a very limited experience on this, but when I dealt with it 1 person was assigned as the executor. That person had the authority to make all of the decision etc.


Residential Real Estate Agent · Ohio


An executor or executrix is named in the will. When someone is intestate the state is the executor and all parties must abide by the decision of the state.


Real Estate Lender · Fort Pierce, Florida


Originally posted by Nick Dunin
The rest of the symblings are either dead or crack heads.

I know I will have to eventually get a real estate lawyer to figure out all this just trying to get a preliminary idea of what I can expect.

Thanks.

Nick



Find a better family. (just kidding)

You have some good advice here - meet with an attorney. Since the death was 2 years ago, I am surprised this has not settled yet or is at least working its way throught the probate courts.

If I were in your shoes I would first determine the upside of pursuing this deal. You stated that the comps are maxing out at $55 K. This gives an estimate of the upside. Second, what are your expenses for pursuing this. I'd find out what taxes are owed. Next what obvious repairs & maintenance will this house need before it can be sold or rented. Any utility bills owed on the property even if vacant? What will you have to pay out once you become an owner?

Finally there is the disfunctional family. This is where you really have to meet with an attorney. The owner died leaving 4 bloodlines. 2 direct bloodlines are living (I assume one is your wife), the other living direct descendant has issues. Of the grandchildren (children of the dead children), how many are there? Are they adults or minors?

Talk to the lawyer about how the assets are passed down in this situation.

I assume that the property is in Texas.

The bottom line: "Is this deal worth it?" Your upside is about $55K. Is that worth it for the hassles?


Real Estate Investor · Lake Worth, Florida


Originally posted by Nick Dunin

My father in law's dad died two years ago. He owned an old 1940s house.

Just my advice. I would Not get involved with trying to buy a house from your father in law or another family member.
The potential for lawsuits, verbal assaults, and not being able to go to family get togethers is very high. If you buy the house at a fair investor price, rehab, and sell it for a profit they will always accuse you of scamming them and look at you as someone who is profiting due to a family members passing.



As a concerned individual I would illustrate the cost of holding, and maintaining the property if it is not occupied.
The costs include taxes, insurance, maintenance such as the lawn, fixing any leaks, utilities since you don't want the pipes bursting when it freezes and don't want mold growing all over the place. Then there is the potential for additional losses due to vandalism.

This could be a good opportunity to gain some experience if the executor will let you get involved.


Real Estate Investor · Lake Worth, Florida


Originally posted by Nick Dunin
My father in law's dad died two years ago. He owned an old 1940s house.


Just my advice. I would Not get involved with trying to buy a house from your father in law or another family member.
The potential for lawsuits, verbal assaults, and not being able to go to family get togethers is very high. If you buy the house at a fair investor price, rehab, and sell it for a profit they will always accuse you of scamming them and look at you as someone who is profiting due to a family members passing.

As a concerned individual I would illustrate the cost of holding, and maintaining the property if it is not occupied.
The costs include taxes, insurance, maintenance such as the lawn, fixing any leaks, utilities since you don't want the pipes bursting when it freezes and don't want mold growing all over the place. Then there is the potential for additional losses due to vandalism.

This could be a good opportunity to gain some experience if the executor will let you get involved.


Real Estate Investor · Longview, Texas


Thanks for the replies guys.

Kevin, I definetly think there is an upside here. I may have understimated the $55k ceiling for comps. Since I made this post I got a couple emails from local RE agents and the houses that have sold on the block in the last year seem to average $48-49 a sqft. This house is 1293 sqft that puts it at 62k. I'm basing this being a good deal if I can get this house for $10k. About 750 is owed in back taxes. My fatherinlaw is the reponsible one, and he coudlnt care less about this house, he didnt pay the taxes cause he doesnt want to deal with it, not because he cant affford it. And like I said the rest of the family are crackheads and couldnt care less about the house, so if I wave a few bucks in front of them they will sign it away.

About the repairs. All I know that is wrong with it is there's a broken pipe under the house (pier and beam) and part of the floor is sagging somewhere in the house. I havent seen this myself. Even if I put in another 10k into the house Im at 21k. If I can sell the house for $50, which is below comp value, I would be doing good. This is the numbers rolling around in my head. Im sure Im missing expenses here, but it seems like I have some wiggle room.


Real Estate Investor · Longview, Texas


Originally posted by Jeff B.
Originally posted by Nick Dunin
.
not being able to go to family get togethers is very high.

Sounds like an incentive to jump right in to me :mrgreen:


Real Estate Lender · Fort Pierce, Florida


Nick, what else is available that you could buy and rehab?

If you make a good paycheck on this house after paying off the relatives, they will forever come back and say that you own them more money even if they agreed in writing to settle for what you pay them today.

Is it worth it? This is your wife's family. Does she want to forever part with them for $10k - $20K?


Note Investor · Tempe, Arizona


Probate in Texas does not start automatically. Some heir will have to petition the court to start the proceedings. Sometimes a title co will accept a heirship affadavid, if all heirs will agree. This is a situation where if no heir is interested the county may end up conducting a tax foreclosure sale since the property taxes are not being paid.


Real Estate Investor · Springfield, Massachusetts


I've seen intestates come back years after the death since no one bothered to petition for such (to be named executor, etc.) without a will, or the heirs didn't probably give a damn overall or lost contact and didn't know...or even the will was lost and found.

Consult with a probate attorney...but it should be for the state where the death occurred (which I'm assuming is Texas-makes life a bit easier).

You also don't need to "buy" the property, you'd simply inherit it with the case approval and disbursement of assets. I'd be more than highly willing to bet that none of the other heirs would care if you did.

Since no one else in the heirs right now cares to start the process, a good candidate would be your wife to be named executrix since it's a more "direct" family member.

The alternative would be to simply sell it either during (if the court allows it or you don't need to file for such) probate and just collect the money there instead after estate settlement.

Sure there's always the possibility of family "backlash" after...but that call is up to you based on how your family is.

Personally, I'd think it's worth the pursuit if you want to spend some time on the side with it.


Real Estate Investor · Longview, Texas


Thanks for the replies guys. Im not too worried about the family issues.


Real Estate Coach · St. Louis, Missouri


It will probably have to go through probate. You may have to wait until its over or talk to the courts about buying it.

Brian Haskins



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