Real Estate Investor · Bristol, CT · Member since 2012 · 16 posts · 4 votes
Like to know your experience or opinion.
Local Housing Authority has hired new inspection company. One of my property was failed for 4 missing window screens, 1 ungrounded 3-prong outlet and access to attic for inspection. This is 3-floor MFH, inspection was for the first floor unit. I have nothing against safe, livable and clean property.
But I don't think having screens in ALL windows is necessity or reason for them to access attic, this is not livable space, tenants have no access to it and none of my other inspectors in prior years ever had requested access to the attic? I'm planning to call HA and Inspection agency to get some clarification and maybe complain.
I know this can be easily corrected but where this stops? What's next?
Do you have any suggestions how I can reason screens and attic out?
I wish there was a yes answer, but there isn't. They make the rules, they cut the checks. If you push back, you're more likely to have a tougher inspection next time.
The one you might be able to get by on is the attic access. It makes sense to try and be in the better graces of your inspectors and to meet them at the homes when possible. It will go a long way towards reducing repair requests if you can build rapport with them.
These don't sound like a terribly expensive list of items. Compare it to your costs of turning over the unit, and for me at least, I'm getting things fixed and keeping the cash flow coming. Be sure to get your renewals done ahead of doing this work.
I wish there was a yes answer, but there isn't. They make the rules, they cut the checks. If you push back, you're more likely to have a tougher inspection next time.
The one you might be able to get by on is the attic access. It makes sense to try and be in the better graces of your inspectors and to meet them at the homes when possible. It will go a long way towards reducing repair requests if you can build rapport with them.
These don't sound like a terribly expensive list of items. Compare it to your costs of turning over the unit, and for me at least, I'm getting things fixed and keeping the cash flow coming. Be sure to get your renewals done ahead of doing this work.
I currently have over ten properties rented to section 8 tenants. If you are well versed/read on your local guidelines you should push back. If the tenant has no access to the attic and none of their mechanicals are located up there then no access should be granted. If they see a potential problem or hazard then they may have cause. My local HA stopped the whole missing screen debacle a few years back so you should double check on that also. When new companies take over the inspection process they are often experiencing a learning curve so it is our duty as landlords and partners to help and keep them consistent.
My understanding of the Section 8 rules is that each room needs one operable window with a screen. If a room has three windows, two could be painted shut and have missing screens.
I have a small window company that I deal with. They come to the house and make screens and frames on site. $25 each - materials and labor. I would find someone like that to make screens for you rather than split hairs over such a small repair. As far as the attic, that's a weird one. Most of those inspectors are so fat and lazy they would never climb a ladder or fit through an attic hatch.
Consider this from a different perspective. A new inspection company? Maybe it's in their best interest to find "something" Fix it keep notes and see how things go going forward.
I've heard stories of investors leaving something undone just to let inspectors find something to justify their existence.
Replacement screens are available at your local Home Depot for under $10. I use to keep plenty on hand during inspections. They can adjust to the width of the window. They are by no means curb appealing, just a way of getting through the inspections in a timely matter and at low cost.
The adjustable screens at Lowes or Home Depot passed for an inspection I had last month. They were less than $5 a piece, I believe. And, if I have to buy one or two next year, so be it.
As stated above, when they pay, they make the rules. As minuscule as some of the things can be, I find it helps me maintain the property condition fairly well. I also really enjoy when the inspector makes a note that a certain repair is required of the tenant. Then there's no arguing with me. They either fix it, or they lose their assistance. While it would not be fun for me to lose a month's rent, it would be way harder on them to have no assistance.
I'm curious as to the issue with the attic.
Is there an access hatch to the attic, but the inspector didn't have a ladder?
Or is the attic sealed off?
Also curious, (and this answer may just be that it's section 8 housing). But if there is an access hatch, do you literally write in the lease that the tenant has no access to the attic for storage? Short of going up there to find meth lab, why not allow access to the attic for storage?
If you want to deal with the government then get used to dealing with all of their rules. You can either meet their minimum standards or rent to a private tenant. Screens are always an issue here and you'd never pass a section 8 inspection without screens in every window and every window opening properly. Here even the city will write you up for a code violation here for missing/ripped screens if they notice them, it's a bit much.
I had a section 8 inspection that I failed because they thought some tree limbs were too close to the roof (more than 10' away).
I knew from the beginning I will have to comply even if I disagree with these judgments. That is the wise thing to do in my case.
I will call the company and asked them why they need access to the attic? Maybe because they can it’s just another flight of stairs with locked door at the bottom, easy access. There is nothing there except chimney and furnace for 3rd floor. (Inspection is for 1st floor)
They have scheduled another inspection in July on a date that I will be gone for few days.
I don’t think I’m obligated to leave the key to the attic with the tenant.
Short of going up there to find meth lab, why not allow access to the attic for storage?
Thanks
I don't allow attic storage for a couple reasons.
One they'll probably do it anyway, but at least I can have legal grounds to tell them to stop when they start putting way to much stuff up there, which some tenants are likely to do. Honestly if they need to store a couple suitcases I wouldn't mind, but it's easier to start strict and go more lenient afterward then the other way around.
The second is most tenants are not careful about things in the attic like A/C duct-work and will lay or drop stuff on them causing damage and possibly extra wear on the unit since it is now cooling the attic instead of the living space or has restricted flow.
Also if I need to have a repair man access something up there I don't want him to charge for having to move the tenant's stuff. and telling them to keep a clear path is subject to their judgement on what that path needs to be.
You need screens & grounded outlets (especially ones within 1.5 feet of water). But I dont get providing access to the attic. Each HA has minimal housing quality standards (HQS), find out what they are for your area. I dont see a prob with meeting with the inspection supervisor to 'discuss' them.
What is the deal with screens? Can someone please explain it to me? Why do some villages and things like sec 8 require screens? Screens have nothing to do with the safety of the house.
The lead paint stuff I get. Making sure stairs have railings I get. All rooms should have a window that opens - obviously. But where in the world do these places get off telling me my house has to have screens? Why?
That should not be a requirement at all.
Thats like telling me I have to provide a microwave too. Its every bit as arbitrary as screens.
Mike H. the idea behind it is that it keeps insects out, and insects can be a health issue. In my area (Orlando, FL) the section 8 guidelines say screens on all windows for a home without central A/C. So they understand that for homes with A/C you will not likely be opening windows for airflow so the insect issue is not a problem. For homes without central A/C they assume that natural ventilation will be the primary possible source of cooling and that to protect the residents you need screens in all of the windows.
Actually. That I would have no problem with. If I didn't have AC and they wanted to require screens, I'd understand that logic.
Its interesting that they only require screens down there if you have no A/C. I'm surprised anyone would even considering renting a house in florida that didn't have A/C. :-)
Yeah the logic is often (supposedly) based on a logical train of thought, though it goes off on tangets that make you scratch your head.
There are a lot of older homes('40s and '50s built especially in the higher Section 8 areas) that don't have central A/C, but do have window units. Window units don't count for the no screen requirement(that I know of). Logic being that it is removable so they could go away and you'd be back to the open windows.
I do only have 1 section 8 tenant and that was in a freshly rehabbed property with new A/C and is also managed by a PM so I can't say how the inspections actually go, but that is what their requirements checklist states.
George P. - window screens are NOT designed or intended to keep people from falling out of the opened window; they are strictly meant for keeping insects out as much as possible. I've even seen screens carry labels that say they are not intended for the purpose of keeping people from falling.
George P. - window screens are NOT designed or intended to keep people from falling out of the opened window; they are strictly meant for keeping insects out as much as possible. I've even seen screens carry labels that say they are not intended for the purpose of keeping people from falling.
yes, i know. but city requires them and i am sure it's not to keep the bugs out.
i'd rather have a screen on my house with a toddler than not.
You have to read your local Housing Authority's admin plan and city codes. The admin plan tells you what that particular housing authority requires along with the city. This usually curbs those rogue inspectors that try and ding you on their personal preferences.