Help! Need a reliable plumber & electrician, permit q's -King Co.

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Help! Need a reliable plumber & electrician, permit q's -King Co.

Andrea Mas
San Francisco, CA · Member since 2015 · 19 posts · 5 votes

Hi All,

First of all I want to offer my profuse gratitude to this community, to BP for their podcasts and wealth of priceless information that got me to move out of my comfort zone in San Francisco to Seattle to get started in Real Estate investing. This website has been my biggest cheerleader, teacher and a profound inspiration. So thank you, thank you, thank you!

Now, on to the background story: I bought my first SFH in March of this year, in Des Moines, WA (just south of SeaTac airport). It's a 1900 sq ft, 3 bed, 2 bath home with a 2-car garage and a partially finished daylight basement. The house was built in 74' and is in pretty good condition, brand new roof, but bad siding. There some wood-rot here and there and could use a bit of a cosmetic face lift. Since we moved in April I have been getting adjusted; new city, job, pretty much new everything. I found a tenant to move in one of the extra rooms and have now refocused on getting the daylight basement converted into a studio apartment with an open layout. It's about 600 sq ft and it's all dry walled, with cement flooring. The plumbing seems pretty accessible, but all new plumbing infrastructure is needed and there's electricity, but we'll need to get a separate breaker box to sustain the kitchen appliances.

I am a total newbie (emphasis added) and my broker told me I could do the whole thing for around 10k. First quote came in at 40k. (YIKES!) I definitely don't have that kind of money laying around. So I'm thinking if I do it in pieces, maybe start with the big things first like plumbing and electrical, then move on to putting some walls in/kitchen cabinets and restroom features that way the cost will be easier to swallow. I'm a W2 employee so I have a steady stream of income and may try to borrow some cash from BOM (Bank of Mom), got that from one of the BP podcasts a long time ago (ha!). I'd really like the whole thing done by the end of the year, if possible. Anyways, here are my questions:

1- Do you know of a reliable plumber in the greater Seattle area who isn't tied up with bigger jobs? (I know, it's summer in Seattle...rehab central)

2- Do you know of a reliable electrician who can help me out?

3- Should I go about registering for permits for the work now? I heard its best to do so before the jobs start? Can you shed any light on the subject of permitting in King County? I guess it would be considered a MIL unit? I'm not really sure.

Any tips/advice would be so greatly appreciated! Thanks for reading this long post! 

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  • Account Closed
    Investor · Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 885 votes
    9y

    @Andrea Mas I have done many flips in Seattle and several south of the airport. The broker's quote is if *you* do the work. Judging from the year of the building, it probably has galvanized pipes and without seeing them there would be no way of knowing if they are salvageable. Also, the electrical box could be outdated by now with all of the appliances (computers, microwaves, phones to plug in.)  Service should probably be upgraded to 200amp. 

    If you are down by the water, you should be fine. If you are near Pac Hiway you should look at Trulia's Crime Heat Map just so that you know what is going on around you to avoid the tough areas. The City Of Des Moines is helpful and easy to work with. You can pull your own permits. I do my own wiring & plumbing to code, since it speeds up the job, so I don't have a contact for you on that. Check for any stains of water seepage or flood damage that won't be wet this time of year. It will show when it starts raining and you want to resolve those issues before you button up the walls. 

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  • Andrea Mas
    OP
    San Francisco, CA · Member since 2015 · 19 posts · 5 votes
    9y

    @Account Closed Hi Ken, thanks for the reply!  You sound very familir with the area! Do you live near here?

    I don't think the pipes are galvanized, but I'm not entirely sure and should find out. There was somewhat of an issue with water seepage down into the foundation, but the previous owners installed 2 sump pumps that seem to be working just fine. And we are pretty close to the Des Moines beach park, so the area seems really safe to me. I didn't know Des Moines had a reputation for being a bad area...? Thanks for the permitting info, I'll be looking into it with the city rather than the county then?

    Thanks again!

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  • Manolo D.
    Contractor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Andrea Mas I have no idea about the state laws, so I'll advice you what to do as if it is SF all over again. First you mentioned "a" bid, ding ding, it's round two, not over, get some more bids, and once you get to a comfortable level, start honing it down. I personally believe 40k is a lot for a 600sf, but I only can guess. Circle back to your broker and ask for referrals and see if indeed he can get someone to do it for 10k, he might feel the pressure of losing another deal with you. Back to the construction method, I suggest the flooring will be epoxy or stained not just cement, it is cheap, it is smelly when you do it, but it is durable and easy to maintain, to add it is great looking, not sure if it is great for tenants though, but I have always enjoyed it. Second is yes, pull the permits first as owner builder, have a draftsperson do it not an archi firm, or just go to the city with pictures and you can lay-out your existing floor plan and show them a proposed one (some cities have the patience to teach you how to pull it as owner builder), who knows, you might save money but spend time on it, if not draftsperson or an architectural student will do the trick, residential are very typical drawing. Next you plan your plumbing below any other plumbing, this will save you cost and schedule. The breaker upgrade is a must, IF you drop line (line from the streets) is enough, and you have breaker spaces, you can either simply add them to the vacant boxes, if not, there are expensive (but cheaper than changing/upgrading the whole panel) that offer two sets in one CB, so you remove an old double spaced 15A breaker to be replaced with TWO 15A breaker.

    But before you do all this, make sure you have pictures and existing/new floor plan, and a scope of work list for all the contractors to hand out when you invite them to come and bid on the project. Another is, you can use contractors that offer financing (hard to find), pay a little more but get committed on a monthly payment without using the BOM, and save it for a real rainy day.

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  • Andrea Mas
    OP
    San Francisco, CA · Member since 2015 · 19 posts · 5 votes
    9y

    @Manolo D. wow, thanks for the wealth of knowledge you just dropped! Ill need to read through it all a few more times before I totally understand what you mean haha! I definitely plan to get several more bids, but unfortunately that gent I got the quote for 40k from WAS my brokers recommendation. She gave me a few others and I've found a couple of my own so the search continues! As far as permits go, I have some time and some money so I don't I plan to try and do the owner builder plans you mentioned if I can. 

    When you mention doing the plumbing below any plumbing do you mean, the plumbing that's already existing in the home? The thing is the current property is situated as such that all the plumbing is up to the left of the property and the basement is below to the right of the property. But I can see the plumbing lines in ceiling of the basement and the sewage (I think) as well. I'll try to add pics to the original post.

    And for the flooring I planned to do allure? I mentioned cement bc I figure that'll require some cement Removal and then repatching to get the plumbing lines put in.

    Thanks for all the advice!

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  • Manolo D.
    Contractor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y
    Andrea Mas ohh, too technical? lol. Sorry about that, I'm here to help. So yeah, as far as plumbing goes, it's usually only done in the kitchen and bathroom, if you have the option to run it behind a wall (assuming behind the drywall that's installed, you just have to find each way and to where, i'll let your plumber worry about that, but there are some who offer trenchless nowadays, haven't tried it as i don't deal with residential much. The point is, figure out from a potential plumber the most cost efficient (not necessarily the cheapest) way to run piping before you go to the city and pull permits. Once you pull, there's no more alteration.
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  • Andrea Mas
    OP
    San Francisco, CA · Member since 2015 · 19 posts · 5 votes
    9y

    @Manolo D.

    utility room where the plumbing lines are visible 

    ceiling of that utility room with hot and cold water pipes

    I think the black pipe inside the utility room is for drainage? I really don't know much!

    What would be the front door, leads to the back yard.

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  • Manolo D.
    Contractor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y
    Andrea Mas Oh nice. That's great, plumbing is open and exposed. So yes, what you do is draw whatever you have right now and mark it as existing, then do another with what you plan, then show the city and ask for help. Plan your bathroom where the pipes are if all possible. Looks like a great house. Shouldn't be 40k for sure.
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  • Andrea Mas
    OP
    San Francisco, CA · Member since 2015 · 19 posts · 5 votes
    9y

    @Manolo D.Thanks so much for the advice and encouragement!

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