Tenant remaining in home after foreclosure

Tenant remaining in home after foreclosure

Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes

Good afternoon. I need the advice of the more experienced people on here.

Four and a half months ago, I closed on a foreclosure. There was a man, his wife, and five children living in the home. The home had belonged to the man's aunt, and they were supposedly paying $500/month rent to her. After closing, I went to talk to the man to see what we could work out. He said they were planning on moving out in February, after he gets a tax refund check. So, I wrote him a contract to expire the last day of February. I let them stay for $400 per month, which is about half or less of market rent, if the house was updated. They made on time payments each month. I wrote the contract so that if they stayed past the last day of February, the rent would go up to aproximate market, which is $900. It is now the 4th day of March, and I have received no rent payment for this month. I talked to him yesterday, and he said he should have the money by Friday or Saturday, and asked if they could stay until his kids are out of school at the end of May. I honestly don't see how this family will be able to pay $900 per month. But considering the situation that they were in, I have tried to help them out the best that I could. Since the house was bought with cash, the only money that I'm actually out of each month is Insurance, about $84. My biggest issue is that I need to get in the house to do the rehab, so I can do a cash-out refinance. How would you guys handle the situation?

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Ned J.Pro Member
Investor · Manteca, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
6y
People in this situation will string you along as far as they can until you finally get tough and say no more.... they are going to ride this wave until it crashes You have already given them a very sweet deal...... time to toughen up and say that free ride is over. When school gets out, there will be another excuse not to move...... start the process to evict them now.....
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  • Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 27 votes
    6y

    Hi Barry,

    It's obviously up to you how you want to run your business, but if you own multiple properties and your tenants start getting wind that you allow for late rent payments, you're going to get taken advantage of.  You've already granted this family a lot of slack.  Even though it's not costing you much each month, the opportunity cost of you being able to rehab then refinance keeps getting higher since you keep pushing it out.  You'll make more money/have more money available for future investments once you're able to execute your strategy.

    I'd stick by your original agreement and not push further then that.  If they don't leave then you would have to get law enforcement and/or a lawyer involved.

    Best,

    Paul

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Paul Wachtler

    Thank you for your input Paul. I failed to mention that this is my first property purchase. No other tenants at this time. With that being said, would you try to collect the rent until the end of May, and issue 7 Day notice to cure if it is not paid? Or would you go ahead and send a 30 day notice to vacate?

  • Rental Property Investor · Member since 2019 · 22 posts · 10 votes
    6y

    I agree. I think you have been very reasonable and willing to work with them while giving them adequate time to vacate. I would be polite, but firm with whatever decision you choose to make. Best of luck.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Alex Zhao

    Thanks Alex. That's what my gut is telling me.

  • Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 27 votes
    6y

    Yea I believe that they're now technically month to month (at $900 a month) since they stayed past February.  Since they seem to only be a source of trouble, I'd have them vacated.  The issue is they may try to trash the place if you have them vacate - depending on how much of a renovation you were planning to do that may cause more issues for you.  

  • Investor · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2017 · 319 posts · 330 votes
    6y

    This is where being a landlord is tough - not so much the scumbag tenants that you enjoy kicking out, but the ones who haven't done anything wrong (yet!) that are just too poor to make the investment work. 

    Moving is no fun no matter who you are, and these guys are probably looking at getting a place that's much less nice than the one they're in now (because it was a sweetheart deal from a family member). So, they're gonna want to hang on as long as they can.

    That said, the people who become the most trouble are often the ones you helped for as long as you could. When you finally stop, they'll hate you for it much more than if you were cold from day one. 

    I'd probably push em to stick to the original deal, and maybe point out that this time of year there's more selection than there will be in May or June. They'll probably find a nicer place moving now, and besides, you've got bills to pay and contractors waiting.

  • David MartinPro Member
    Cypress, TX · Member since 2016 · 137 posts · 119 votes
    6y

    @Barry Cooley Cash for keys agreement, mate. Sounds like they are in a cash crunch, and sounds like you need a fast and agreeable way for them to get out. Get it rock solid with legal and have a 24/7 locksmith on retention to re-master the whole house the moment they've given you notice they have left as agreed.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Russ B.

    You're right, it will probably be easier for them to find a place now. But also, if I don't get started on the rehab until they move out at the end of May, it's going to probably be getting cold weather before it's complete, so it's going to be harder for me to rent.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @David Martin

    Thanks David. I actually tried to help them out with cash for keys when I first closed on the house. But at that time, they just weren't prepared to move. So, I am not against trying that approach again.

  • Lender · Member since 2020 · 89 posts · 69 votes
    6y

    @Barry Cooley and @David Martin Make sure you execute a cash for keys agreement asking them to leave it broom swept in exchange for the funds. Otherwise you are left with discarding all their junk and it can be costly. Furthermore, the agreement should stipulate what they can take or not appliances, etc. Hopefully they will not destroy the premises. I worked in REO for 11 yrs and can tell you many outcomes. Good Luck!

  • Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 27 votes
    6y

    That's a great idea @David Martin!  I didn't think about that but you're right.  They're hurting for cash so if they're given some amount ($400-$500 or so) they may sign something saying they'll vacate immediately.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Jenny Roman

    Thanks for your input. I have a CFK agreement that I intended to use when I first closed. I believe it has that in there, but will need to confirm. As far as the appliances, I have no idea what, if any, belong to them. I haven't put any in the property.

  • Jennifer T.Pro Member
    Investor · New Orleans, LA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 944 votes
    6y

    I'm curious why you originally lowered the rent to $400/month?  When they were already in a sweetheart deal with the aunt for $500/month.

    If you haven't already, look up the landlord/tenant laws where this property is located.  Post the appropriate Pay or Quit notice on the door and/or send by certified mail.

    This is me, because I have few enough rental properties I can sometimes give a more personal touch.  But I would even give this tenant a heads up that it is coming, because sometimes people can get freaked out.  With words that are something like "...I know you said you will be paying the rent by Sunday.  And, if you do, that complies with the Notice and it will be moot.  But I'm sure you understand that I also need to protect myself, just in case the rent doesn't get paid."

    Now that you have gotten into "buy and hold" REI, you will quickly discover that you can't count on what people say. Only what they do.

    You have already been exceedingly generous with these people.  They've had ample notice to either find another place to live or face paying $900/month.  They CHOSE to stay.  You have even been charging less rent than the aunt was!  If they'd saved that extra hundred for the last 4 months, plus the $400 they were already paying, they'd almost have all the rent for March already.  But it's a good guess they didn't think that far ahead and didn't do that.

    All of that is their choices and their problem.  Don't make it yours.  I know it's easier said than done, but you need to harden your heart when it comes to tenants or they will walk all over you.  It is also not usually reciprocal.

    In my early years, I thought the best of people.  I was flexible and would give tenants chance after chance.  Then would finally get to the end of my rope.  They'd leave and could care less they were leaving me holding the bag for their unpaid rent and damages.  Plus usually a filthy house.  Because, even though it's free to clean, people don't bother when they know they aren't getting their security deposit back. 

  • Ned J.Pro Member
    Investor · Manteca, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y
    People in this situation will string you along as far as they can until you finally get tough and say no more.... they are going to ride this wave until it crashes You have already given them a very sweet deal...... time to toughen up and say that free ride is over. When school gets out, there will be another excuse not to move...... start the process to evict them now.....
  • Naperville, IL · Member since 2018 · 330 posts · 357 votes
    6y

    "That said, the people who become the most trouble are often the ones you helped for as long as you could. When you finally stop, they'll hate you for it much more than if you were cold from day one."

    This and what Ned J. said.  I am about as bleeding heart liberal as they come....and my first tenant had so many excuses it was breathtaking.  Paid the first month's rent to get the keys and then never paid full rent again,  and it took 6 months to get him out,  and our REALTOR got that first month's rent. (Never used a Realtor to find a tenant again either.)  When we stopped accepting excuses,  he lied to a judge's face and said we told him we wanted him out because of his race.  (Judge logically asked "if they are racist why did they rent to you in the first place?" and then dismissed.)  The morning of the eviction had a "heart attack"  and called us "from the hospital".  When we said we were moving forward he said some choice words and hung up.  But 90 minutes later his stuff was all gone....pretty good for a guy who had a heart attack that day lol.  I'd probably give your guy $1000--I'm still a bleeding heart...but I would not let him stay.  They are never going to pay on time.  If at all.

  • Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    You were nice.  And they did not pay.  Nor follow the agreement.  So proceed swiftly to eviction.  

  • Rental Property Investor · MI · Member since 2019 · 192 posts · 205 votes
    6y

    @Barry Cooley

    Ask yourself.....Did you sign up to manage a homeless shelter or manage cash flowing rentals? I hope it’s managing cash flowing properties.

    I’m only two years into this game and I can be the sweetest person but don’t play with my money!! I have a child to put through college. I have grown to have a low tolerance for the BS.

  • Lender · Member since 2020 · 89 posts · 69 votes
    6y

    @Barry Cooley Unfortunately when there are children involved you must respect that because the tenant love those protect families with children during school times and during Christmas and cold weather I remembered not being able to me Vict people until the school year was over

  • Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    @Barry Cooley

    Never let a tenant turn their problem into your problem without taxing them enough that they understand the difference. Right now they have paid zero tax. Change that.

  • Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Paul Wachtler:

    That's a great idea @David Martin!  I didn't think about that but you're right.  They're hurting for cash so if they're given some amount ($400-$500 or so) they may sign something saying they'll vacate immediately.

     I would offer them enough money that they can get into another home. So maybe 3x rent. This is the easiest way to help them and help yourself. But dont be stingy on the funds. Offer them enough that they cant say no. Also give them time to find a place  but dont give them the funds til they leave.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Jennifer T.

    I lowered the rent to allow them the opportunity to save a little more for a new home/moving expenses.

    I went by and talked to the tenant yesterday, gave him a 7 day notice to cure, and told him nearly exactly as you suggested (even before I read your reply). After giving him the notice, I agreed to allow them to stay until the end of May, with the stipulation that rent/late fees are caught up and payment is received by the first of each month. I also told him if they found a place before the end of May, that I would pay their first month's rent. I know the payments won't come, but I have the 7 day notice in place and will proceed accordingly.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Ned J.

    Thanks Ned. I gave them the 7 day notice yesterday, so I have essentially started the process.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Nancy P.

    Wow. Sorry about your hard luck. At least I have received a few month's rent, although it may take all of that to get them out.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @Brian Ploszay

    True. I feel I can proceed to eviction now without too much guilt on my part.

  • Athens, AL · Member since 2017 · 62 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    @E.S. Burrell

    I hear you. I'm very protective of my money also. I just hate that these people were caught up in this. But I have given them opportunities...

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