B/C class neighborhood renovations for rental property

Jordan Baker · 2022-05-01T18:55:23-07:00

Hey Bigger Pockets Family, I have a duplex in a B/C neighborhood in Jacksonville FL. I bought the property as a primary using my FHA loan and have been doing some updates to my side but have a tennant moving out soon and want to update the other rental side of my property. I currently get 950 in rent for the 2br/1Ba side of my property and I am looking to do about $2,000-$4,000 worth of work to the otherside to bump the rent up to 1200-1300 (this is what the upper rents are going for in this area). Nothing is majorly wrong with the house at this time it is mainly doing some cosmetic updates becuase it looks really ugly and I know I can get more for it with this rental market. Mainly updating counter tops, new flooring, paint, ceiling fans, updated cabinetry, adding a garbarge disposal and possibly dishwasher. Most of this I will do my self except for the dishwasher and garbage disposal because i need to call in an electrician to wire it. My big questions is what are some renovations y'all have made that have gotten you a good return on investment and gotten you solid tennants willing to pay a bit more in these middle of the road neighborhoods? is it worth it to get granite countertops? Is it neccesary to put in the dishwasher for this small of a unit? Any input about the renovations worth doing that will make the biggest bang for your buck in this type of neighborhood would be greatly appreciated!

Malcomb StapelPro Member

Investor · Topeka, KS · Member since 2020 · 669 posts · 488 votes

4y

@Jordan Baker 2-4k dollars isn't going to get you very much renovation. Granite counters would burn a lot of that, a fresh repaint can easily eat 1k. I don't have a good answer for you on the dishwasher, but here's a few thoughts.

- Menards and HD both sell high definition laminate countertops. You could do 16ft of countertop for less than $500.

- Paint scheme really helps, nice fresh colors. I know flat white and navajo grey are super popular traditional landlord colors, but they can be very drab.

- A clean, fresh looking bathroom is going to be a big selling point. Whats your current setup look like in there?

5 Reply

Nathan Grabau

Realtor · Longmont, CO · Member since 2021 · 577 posts · 631 votes

4y

I think you are on the right track here with what you are thinking. A little cosmetic work can really improve the appeal of a unit and tenant quality. For the list you have said, 2-4k seems like it might be on the low side. For material for example, with the cheapest rental durability laminate floors, you will probably be close to $3($2.5 for floor, .5 for underlayment) a foot in material after waste. I cheaped out on redoing the floors in my house and really wish I would have spent the extra 75c a foot to get better laminate because that is nothing compared to my effort and even after a professional install, my 99c a foot flooring squeaks all over the place. But that alone for an 800 sqft unit is $2400 before labor.

Cheap things I have done: paint, repaint cabinets, door hardware(crazy what grandma bronze to a brushed nickel can do), cabinet hardware if you have it, and updated outlets(cheap an very easy to rewire). I also have replaced some fans with flush mount ceiling lights. It is wiring, but very easy wiring and if you have a low ceiling, can make it feel multiple feet higher. I wouldn't do it in a bedroom but great in a dining room or kitchen.

I would also encourage you to put a value in place for you time as you work. Even if it is what is McDonalds hiring at, you want to make sure that if you value your time, suddenly an investment no longer makes sense. In the same way that we want to make our money go the furthest, if there is a way to make your time go further, it is worth investigating.

2 Reply

Jordan Baker

OP

Lender · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2021 · 16 posts · 4 votes

4y

Hey Y'all,

Thank you for this input. I will do just about all the labor involved on it except for the wiring of the garbage disposal. That is a good point to the investment of time, but the way I look at it if I am trying to do this longterm the better I get at doing these rehab projects, the more eficient I can be and the beter decisions I can make with future investment properties.

Also I am full time teacher and a mortgage loan officer so truthfully I have the summer off and paid for and when I am working as a mortgage loan officer I do most of that work from home. I also do not mind doing this work as it is good learning experience for the future invetment properties

Here is the scope of work I am considering to move the rents from 925 to 12-1300.

1.the paint is only in the living room as there is a bit of a smokey smell now so I am going to hit that with Shellac primer, and air purifying paint ($350 + my time)

2. I was going to get the life proof flooring and cover the bathroom and the kitchen with it ($600 + my time)

3. I like the idea of painting the cabinets as well to save some money there and looks like again the cost of doing so is going to be ($200 + time)

4. new vanity and fixtures in the bathroom ($300)

5. install ceiling fans in both bedrooms as there is only lights in there now and the ari flow is not great ($220)

6. Install garbabge disposal (300)

7. Instal that higher end laminate granite counter top that malcomb recommended or a similair one ($500-750)

8. margin of error $500+/-

total rehab cost would be around 2,500-3000.

At this rate I believe the ROI would be around 12-15 months if i am not including my time within that costwhich I am okay with at this point.

1 Reply

Nathan Grabau

Realtor · Longmont, CO · Member since 2021 · 577 posts · 631 votes

4y

I can't see any really major issues with the budget you have laid out here. In my experience with home projects I end up much higher than I thought I would be. The timing seems great too that you should not lose that much rent in down time on the unit because you will be able to focus on it and finish quickly during the summer.

1 Reply

Jonathan R McLaughlin

Rental Property Investor · Boston, Massachusetts (MA) · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes

4y

@Jordan Baker I think a dishwasher would be a huge bang for the buck compared to the garbage disposal. That’s a real amenity for most people and it’s highly visible.

2 Reply

Greg Henderson

Flipper/Rehabber · Hattiesburg, MS · Member since 2020 · 59 posts · 25 votes

4y

The biggest bang for my buck has always been:

Paint the entire unit . You wouldn't think the ceilings need paint until you paint it and what a difference it makes! I use:

https://www.homedepot.com/p/BE... for the walls

https://www.homedepot.com/p/BE... for the trim and cabinets

https://www.homedepot.com/p/BE... ceilings

Replace countertops

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Stret...

Backsplash

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Anato...

Watch a 5 minute video about replacing outlets and switches. They're less than a dollar each and make a HUGE difference. If they don't have a ground wire, you can add one for very cheap.

Replace doot knobs

https://www.amazon.com/Bedroom...

https://www.amazon.com/Probric...

Replace cabinet hardware after paint

https://www.99centknobs.com/

Replace ceiling fans and lights. Very easy and cheap.

Replace bathroom vanity

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Proje...

Replace the kitchen and bathroom sink fixtures

Flooring is expensive and will eat up a lot of your budget. You will need tools to undercut door jambs, possibly trim the bottom of doors if the elevation is raised, install 1/4 round or shoe molding, caulk, underlayment if its not attached, floor leveling compound if you have any low spots, grinder if you have high.. its not just dropping down cheap flooring. If its not done right, it will look terrible, break apart, and need to be replaced in a year. Consider tile. The material price is very low since its out of style, but its clean and will last for decades in a bathroom and kitchen. You can watch some youtube videos, buy a leveling system from amazon, and do a great job for $1 a foot.

No one in my market has ever requested a garbage disposal and I don't think anyone would ever pay more money for one.

Lastly, I know a lot of landlords remove dishwashers. They can break or flood, but that's market dependent. I install them in my units.

0 Reply

Alex Talcott

Attorney · Durham, NH · Member since 2019 · 292 posts · 126 votes

4y

painting cabinets has been my favorite cost-effective effort past couple years

0 Reply

Jim K.

Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes

4y

Quote from @Greg Henderson:

Watch a 5 minute video about replacing outlets and switches. They're less than a dollar each and make a HUGE difference. If they don't have a ground wire, you can add one for very cheap.

I would love to know what you're trying to say here. How do you add a working ground wire to an ungrounded outlet "very cheap"?

1 Reply

Jordan Baker

OP

Lender · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2021 · 16 posts · 4 votes

4y

Hey everyone just to give an update on the game plan for this rehab now that it has actually started:

Rightnow paint for cabinets and the unit is running around $300

For the new countertop I decided to use pop and peel tile the high quality type to put over the existing tile and it worked out very well and looks nice including trim: $100

*side bar about the pop and peel tile the have a very sheek black marble one that went great with the color scheme of the kitchen and I went ahead because it saved me about $500 on a new countertop*

New vinyl plank flooring required me to cut some carpet to do it but the cost was not terrible at $700

Electrician had to come in and put in a designated outlet for the dishwasher and the tankless hot water heater for the bathroom vanity since it did not have hot water. $350

Dishwasher and installation: $650

two ceiling fans: $200

New Vanity: $200

Total cost: 2,500

Increase in rent from $925 to $1200

0 Reply

Greg Henderson

Flipper/Rehabber · Hattiesburg, MS · Member since 2020 · 59 posts · 25 votes

4y

Quote from @Jim K.:

Quote from @Greg Henderson:

Watch a 5 minute video about replacing outlets and switches. They're less than a dollar each and make a HUGE difference. If they don't have a ground wire, you can add one for very cheap.

I would love to know what you're trying to say here. How do you add a working ground wire to an ungrounded outlet "very cheap"?

Jim, sorry if I didn't fully explain. It depends on the age of the house, certainly. A great number of houses in my market the ground is connected to the box but not the receptacle. As long as the metal box is grounded and the ground is bonded, a pigtail or a grounding clip is sufficient. If you're replacing the receptacle, you should ground it.

0 Reply

Jim K.

Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes

4y

Quote from @Greg Henderson:

Quote from @Jim K.:

Quote from @Greg Henderson:

Watch a 5 minute video about replacing outlets and switches. They're less than a dollar each and make a HUGE difference. If they don't have a ground wire, you can add one for very cheap.

I would love to know what you're trying to say here. How do you add a working ground wire to an ungrounded outlet "very cheap"?

Jim, sorry if I didn't fully explain. It depends on the age of the house, certainly. A great number of houses in my market the ground is connected to the box but not the receptacle. As long as the metal box is grounded and the ground is bonded, a pigtail or a grounding clip is sufficient. If you're replacing the receptacle, you should ground it.

In my market, where I just bought a multifamily dating from 1925-1935 that was originally wired with knob-and-tube, almost none of the junction, switch, or outlet boxes are grounded. There are, I would wager to guess, a lot more markets just like mine in the Rust Belt.

What you've got going on in your market is slightly outdated wiring, and yes, it can be corrected in a pinch for pennies. What I've got in mine is extremely expensive to fix. My concern is for people reading this thread who are in my market and will not understand why "grounding" would justifiably cost so much more as a line item in my market versus yours.

But then again, the last person who rewired my multifamily couldn't even be bothered to use stress-relief cable clamps in one of the main junction boxes in the basement. Not to mention the Eaton breakers they jammed in Murray boxes and grounds that are not actually grounded anywhere. Maybe every house in the Burgh should come with a warning label.

1 Reply

Matt M.

Specialist · Easton, PA · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes

4y

@Jim K.

We have a lot of knob and tube here also. The best is when someone jumps a neutral to ground to make a GFCI pass a tester. So wrong..

1 Reply

Greg Henderson

Flipper/Rehabber · Hattiesburg, MS · Member since 2020 · 59 posts · 25 votes

4y

Quote from @Jim K.:

Quote from @Greg Henderson:

Quote from @Jim K.:

Quote from @Greg Henderson:

Watch a 5 minute video about replacing outlets and switches. They're less than a dollar each and make a HUGE difference. If they don't have a ground wire, you can add one for very cheap.

I would love to know what you're trying to say here. How do you add a working ground wire to an ungrounded outlet "very cheap"?

Jim, sorry if I didn't fully explain. It depends on the age of the house, certainly. A great number of houses in my market the ground is connected to the box but not the receptacle. As long as the metal box is grounded and the ground is bonded, a pigtail or a grounding clip is sufficient. If you're replacing the receptacle, you should ground it.

In my market, where I just bought a multifamily dating from 1925-1935 that was originally wired with knob-and-tube, almost none of the junction, switch, or outlet boxes are grounded. There are, I would wager to guess, a lot more markets just like mine in the Rust Belt.

What you've got going on in your market is slightly outdated wiring, and yes, it can be corrected in a pinch for pennies. What I've got in mine is extremely expensive to fix. My concern is for people reading this thread who are in my market and will not understand why "grounding" would justifiably cost so much more as a line item in my market versus yours.

But then again, the last person who rewired my multifamily couldn't even be bothered to use stress-relief cable clamps in one of the main junction boxes in the basement. Not to mention the Eaton breakers they jammed in Murray boxes and grounds that are not actually grounded anywhere. Maybe every house in the Burgh should come with a warning label.

Yea a lot of the property is late 60s early 70s. Knob and tube is rare here. I own one property built in 1927 and another 1921 that still has it in the attic but it’s not hot. That electrician that wired your box must have moved here… 10/2 for a stove connected to a 50 amp breaker, double tapped breakers, etc.

1 Reply

B/C class neighborhood renovations for rental property

B/C class neighborhood renovations for rental property

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