Buyer's Agent Performed Hydrostatic Plumbing Test w/out Consent
Investor · Austin, TX · Member since 2015 · 33 posts · 9 votes
Hi All - I am under contract on a house. The buyer's agent, within the option period, had a plumber come out to the house to perform (what I think) is a hydrostatic plumbing test without my consent. What they did was inflate a ball to plug up the main sewer line, removed my toilet, and then filled the sewer system up with water to the slab level. Note that nothing was pressurized.
My first question is - Is this a hydrostatic plumbing test? Per most sources it is. Per other sources, it involves actually pressurizing the plumbing system. Some are calling this a water test while other sources clearly define this as a hydrostatic test. Which is it?
Did they violate section 7A of the Texas Residential Sale's Contract? "Any hydrostatic testing must be separately authorized by Seller in writing"
The test failed and now they are using this as leverage (obviously). What recourse do I have (if any)? I had no idea about the condition of the plumbing until today.
@Nathan Williams. What your position in the Sale? Are you Buyer or Seller?
IMO, this appears to be a HydroStatic Test! Requiring Separately Seller Agreement. Sounds like the Buyer's Agent dropped the ball on getting prior permission.
Questions:
1. If the Buyer had requested permission to do a Hydrostatic test - would you have agreed to allow?
2. Would Buyer have walked if you didn't allow the test?
3. Did you get a copy of the test results?
4. Does the Report call it a HydroStatic test? If Report has a contact number for person, contact them and ask if was a Hydrostatic test?
I'm presuming since you said the plumbing failed the test, you have a leak in the Plumbing Drainage System.
Recommendation:
1. Find out what cost to repair is?
2. How much compensation Buyer is willing to settle for?
NOTE: If you have a Plumbing Drainage System leaks as it seems to infer, IMO, it's better / easier to work out an agreement with this Buyer rather than have them walk and now you have to disclose the Report, probably do the repairs, and find another Buyer, and also explain the issue to them.
3. Additionally, recommend agreeing on a dollar figure with Buyer, (if possible) rather than doing repairs, as you will know what your limit of financial liability is, as opposed to "surprises" when you open up things for repair.
4. If you can confirm was a Hydrostatic test, have your Listing Broker contact Buyer's Agent's Broker about the Issue of NOT getting separate approval for the test.
@Nathan Williams. What your position in the Sale? Are you Buyer or Seller?
IMO, this appears to be a HydroStatic Test! Requiring Separately Seller Agreement. Sounds like the Buyer's Agent dropped the ball on getting prior permission.
Questions:
1. If the Buyer had requested permission to do a Hydrostatic test - would you have agreed to allow?
2. Would Buyer have walked if you didn't allow the test?
3. Did you get a copy of the test results?
4. Does the Report call it a HydroStatic test? If Report has a contact number for person, contact them and ask if was a Hydrostatic test?
I'm presuming since you said the plumbing failed the test, you have a leak in the Plumbing Drainage System.
Recommendation:
1. Find out what cost to repair is?
2. How much compensation Buyer is willing to settle for?
NOTE: If you have a Plumbing Drainage System leaks as it seems to infer, IMO, it's better / easier to work out an agreement with this Buyer rather than have them walk and now you have to disclose the Report, probably do the repairs, and find another Buyer, and also explain the issue to them.
3. Additionally, recommend agreeing on a dollar figure with Buyer, (if possible) rather than doing repairs, as you will know what your limit of financial liability is, as opposed to "surprises" when you open up things for repair.
4. If you can confirm was a Hydrostatic test, have your Listing Broker contact Buyer's Agent's Broker about the Issue of NOT getting separate approval for the test.
A quick search shows both pressure, and simple gravity which yours was. I would assume the pressure variety would require permission as there would be a potential for damage.
In your case I assume no damage was done so there would be recourse for what.....finding a problem? I think not.
@Jim Cummings - Thank you for your reply!
I am the seller.
1. Yes, I would have agreed to allow.
2. I suppose that is an unknown. We went under contract without the addendum to allow the test so I assumed they were not going to walk.
3. No - but excellent point I will try and get that.
4. TBD. However, I spoke to the plumber on the phone and he ensures me it wasn't a hydrostatic test because he didn't apply further pressure other than the water he filled up in the sewer system. I think he is confused on what the terminology means.
I totally agree with your recommendations and that is likely the course I will go. Thank you again.
@Wayne Brooks correct they found a problem. However, they conducted an intrusive and potentially harmful test to my plumbing system without my consent which violates the terms of the sales agreement.
Notwithstanding the Buyer's Agent failing to get written permission to conduct the Hydrostatic test, it's doubtful the test damaged your sewer system.
The typical Hydrostatic test consists of placing an inflatable rubber ball in the sewer clean-out between the city drain line and the house. The ball is inflated to ensure a good seal of the sewer pipe.
The drain line is then filled with water, and let stand for a period of time, typically 15 - 60 minutes, to observe a drop in the water level in the drainage pipe. The only pressure applied is the weight of the column of water.
If the water level drops rapidly, you know you have a large leak, if it drops slowly, there is a smaller leak. All you really know is there is a "Leak" in the drain pipe. You don't know where - further isolation testing and a camera are required to determine the specific location of the leak.
See https://tinyurl.com/yc3ue42w for a more detailed explanation.
Reference one my original question - would you have denied permission to conduct the test? - to which you answered - probably not. However, I'll speculate if they had asked permission and you didn't OK the test - it would have raised suspicions with Buyer's Agent & Buyer you were trying to hide something. Obviously, not the fact, but just my experience.
It's possible the plumber didn't get a "good seal" on the sewer line, so water might have escaped by the Inflatable ball. Not very likely, but certainly possible.
If you are unsure / have doubts about the validity of the results. Suggest you hire a different plumber to conduct the same test. I would invite the Buyer & Buyer's Agent to be present while the test is being conducted to show you are not trying to "Rig" the test.
Good luck.
The buyer's agent has no authorization to perform any tests because he/she is not a party to the agreement. The contract language concerning this matter is unambiguous and if the buyer agent allowed a plumber into the property to perform a test not authorized in writing, and one that is clearly spelled out contractually, he/she has overstepped his/her legal authority in the transaction. I would contact the buyer agent's broker and lodge a complaint. If the complaint is not taken seriously by the broker you can move to the next step in the process. Contracts are in place for a reason. Agent's who don't understand their role can and should be challenged on their actions when they are clearly overstepping that role. In addition to being an investor, I'm also a licensed broker.
@Jim Cummings - Thank you. Your replies were very informative and helpful. I appreciate the time you took to write your response
@Guy Gimenez - Thank you as well. You helped reinforce my position.
Today, the buyer's agent sent over the termination for the contract. I don't think I have any recourse other than writing the agent's broker and submitting a complaint to TREC. I have 7 days to release their earnest money. I'm not sure if it is worth an attempt to collect the earnest money. I am guessing not. Do you guys have an opinion on recourse?
If the termination and release of earnest money is within the buyer's contractual rights, then you should release the earnest money. Regarding recourse, filing a complaint is about all you can do at this point.
If you're willing to provide the agent's name, please message me. I would like to know who it is should I ever receive an offer from him/her. Thanks.
@Nathan Williams. As long as Buyer is terminating within the Option Period - not a lot of leverage left. I would hold out until your Listing Broker had an opportunity to talk to Buyer Agent Broker to discuss.
Paragraph 15 of the 1-4 Contract might give you some leverage for a claim on the Earnest Money. Depending how Buyer failing to get Specific Written Permission to Conduct Hydrostatic Test might be construed as not complying with the contract.
See also Paragraph 18. (C) & (D) of the 1-4 Contract for additional details you need to be cognizant of.
Dependent upon your circumstances, motivation, etc; best advice - Release the Earnest Money, and move on. Fighting over the Earnest Money could tie up your property in litigation (worst case) and prevent you from Selling while things are being settled. Tactical Action - Get the Broker's to talk, threaten to go after Earnest Money, but don't go to the mat over it. It will cost you more in time, effort, and stress than the Earnest Money is worth - unless it's a very sizable sum.
Based on what you have reported, you most likely had an existing sewer leak you were not aware of revealed by the Hydrostatic Test. Recommend you take the property off the market, get another Plumber to test the system and diagnose the issues, fix the system, and then put the property back on market, and get it Sold.
Not Legal Advice - Good luck!
In my experience, there is always some recourse in the TAR residential contracts but it is usually a losing proposition, financially. Title companies don’t want any part of a legal fight and will rarely relinquish earnest money unless both parties sign off. While you’re fighting in court you can’t easily sell the property. Total Catch 22.
So I’ve always found it a better investment to pay to have the property I’m selling inspected, address any major deficiencies before hand then clearly state I’m not paying for additional repairs, or offer a set allowance cap up front. After that it’s take it or leave it.
Lesson here, add leak test to the pre listing inspection.
Hi All - I am under contract on a house. The buyer's agent, within the option period, had a plumber come out to the house to perform (what I think) is a hydrostatic plumbing test without my consent. What they did was inflate a ball to plug up the main sewer line, removed my toilet, and then filled the sewer system up with water to the slab level. Note that nothing was pressurized.
My first question is - Is this a hydrostatic plumbing test? Per most sources it is. Per other sources, it involves actually pressurizing the plumbing system. Some are calling this a water test while other sources clearly define this as a hydrostatic test. Which is it?
Did they violate section 7A of the Texas Residential Sale's Contract? "Any hydrostatic testing must be separately authorized by Seller in writing"
The test failed and now they are using this as leverage (obviously). What recourse do I have (if any)? I had no idea about the condition of the plumbing until today.
The test woudn't hurt anything, it is performed with 10 feet of head, or about 4.3 psi at the base.
Do you want to sell that house or not? Put your contract violation pride aside and negotiate. Will you disclose this issue to the next buyer or will you repair it? What's the cost of that vs. this offer?
Good luck,
Frank
@Frank S. Thanks for your reply. I've talked to over a dozen plumbers and the opinions are so mixed on whether this test hurts the system or not. I honestly don't care to debate that since it isn't productive at this point.
Of course I want to sell the house and of course I will either disclose this or repair it. I don't have a choice. If I didn't disclose or repair it that would be a legal and ethics issue from my side.
My issue is that had the buyer's followed the proper protocol and followed the contract, I would have let them perform the test. Then we could have come to a solution. They want the house and I want to sell the house. It would have been a matter of negotiations. Instead, the buyer's agent jumped the gun, did the test without my permission, didn't explain the options to the buyers and they terminated.
I hope you can understand why I am frustrated and how this is not just a matter of pride.
Thanks all for the helpful comments
I've heard of inspectors frying AC compressors and furnaces after shorting circuits, so this is nothing. See IPC 312.2 DWV test. Code vary across the nation, but it is mostly the same.
https://codes.iccsafe.org/public/document/code/550...
You have all rights to be upset because you are protecting your client's interest and they could've caused water damage if the test was not performed properly. Remind them they are lucky nothing bad happened.
How much less are they asking? If 3K not a big deal, settle at half their price. If 20K, have them walk. Although, that's your client's decision, of course.
Good luck,
@Frank S. It's my own house I am not a realtor. That is the thing that is mind boggling - They didn't bother asking for anything they just walked. Thanks for the information!
@Frank S. It's my own house I am not a realtor. That is the thing that is mind boggling - They didn't bother asking for anything they just walked. Thanks for the information!
Oh, it's your property!! That burns.
Frank