Is Anyone Wholesaling or Doing Direct Marketing Internationaly?
Investor · Mandeville, LA · Member since 2013 · 75 posts · 14 votes
I wanted to see if there was anyone doing direct marketing campaigns, building a lead website, or wholesaling internationally.
I've been thinking of doing this in Central or South America in order to find vacation rentals.
Any advice or thoughts? How different are the legal aspects of purchasing RE abroad?
Mexico does not allow foreign ownership of real estate. They will let you sign a 99 year lease, however the property will never be yours. So marry a Mexican! (unless the laws have changed- this was the case 7 years ago or so...)
Belize is great. My family has owned property there for over a decade. The time to buy was about 10 years ago. Just kidding; Corozal is expanding rapidly, and there's lots of developments popping up everywhere. However, the government is corrupt and not very business friendly. Nothing ever works properly, and its hard to get good help. Very much a place where you basically have to be there all the time to make sure things get done right. And on the coast, because of the coral reef off the coast, everything rusts. And I mean EVERYthing. Plastic rusts. It's a constant battle to keep things operating. Belize International looks like an African third world airport, whereas Cancun looks and feels like any major airport in the US. Leonardo Dicaprio is building an "eco-friendly" resort on his island. The Belizian government sadly gives a rat's behind about their ecology and their history; they're selling off the country to anyone with money, and destroying the amazing natural wonders in the process.
Costa Rica is good; a family friend went down there 10 years ago for a visit. When he came back home he sold his business and real estate holdings in Chicago, packed his bags and has rarely been seen since. He bought and developed property, quite successfully.
Although Montevideo, BsAs and Santiago are my three favorite cities in all of South America, I'd avoid Argentina, Uruguay and Chile, simply because they're quite far away. BsAs is a 9 hour flight from Miami.
I'd recommend Central America; Panama, Costa Rica and Nicaragua are all places that keep popping up in conversations. Plus, they're all within a three hour flight from Florida or Texas.
I wanted to see if there was anyone doing direct marketing campaigns, building a lead website, or wholesaling internationally.
I've been thinking of doing this in Central or South America in order to find vacation rentals.
Any advice or thoughts? How different are the legal aspects of purchasing RE abroad?
Unfortunately, I'm not able to answer that question myself but I'm interested in learning the answer. Do you have any specific countries you're interested in down in Central & South America Harry?
Off the top of my head Costa Rica, Honduras, Belize would be interesting options since CR and Belize are fairly well established in terms of tourism.
I'd also be interested in looking at coastal Mexico for buy and hold. That would me more speculation with the hope that security and drug issues improve in the next 10 years and tourism picks up.
I've lived in Santiago de Chile and Uruguay and would likely start wholesaling or direct marketing in Uruguay since it is a small, manageable market and I have friends that would be interested in partnering there.
What are your thoughts @Dominic Jones?
Off the top of my head Costa Rica, Honduras, Belize would be interesting options since CR and Belize are fairly well established in terms of tourism.
I'd also be interested in looking at coastal Mexico for buy and hold. That would me more speculation with the hope that security and drug issues improve in the next 10 years and tourism picks up.
I've lived in Santiago de Chile and Uruguay and would likely start wholesaling or direct marketing in Uruguay since it is a small, manageable market and I have friends that would be interested in partnering there.
What are your thoughts @Dominic Jones?
If I were you, I would start in Chile or Uruguay. You know people on the ground and as you said you used to live there. The other places, I wouldn't touch until I got systems in place in Chile and Uruguay and were able to close numerous deals with relative ease.
I struggle with my focus sometimes and I know that this is detrimental to running any kind of business. You stretch yourself too thin and are becoming the prototypical "jack of all trades but master of none," which you don't want. Or another way to look at it is, being "good in a lot of things but great at none."
I would love to learn more about what you plan on doing and if I can help in anyway to setup and run the systems, I would be interested in doing so. I want to own an international portfolio and even though wholesaling internationally isn't exactly owning a portfolio in that country, it can lead to it, just as it is helping me build capital to start my portfolio here in the states.
I'm not biased right now to any one particular country, I'm trying to learn and network with as many people as I possibly can and when I get educated enough about the real estate market in different countries and more experienced, pull the trigger. Do you think my suggestion makes sense? and/or did you find it helpful?
Mexico does not allow foreign ownership of real estate. They will let you sign a 99 year lease, however the property will never be yours. So marry a Mexican! (unless the laws have changed- this was the case 7 years ago or so...)
Belize is great. My family has owned property there for over a decade. The time to buy was about 10 years ago. Just kidding; Corozal is expanding rapidly, and there's lots of developments popping up everywhere. However, the government is corrupt and not very business friendly. Nothing ever works properly, and its hard to get good help. Very much a place where you basically have to be there all the time to make sure things get done right. And on the coast, because of the coral reef off the coast, everything rusts. And I mean EVERYthing. Plastic rusts. It's a constant battle to keep things operating. Belize International looks like an African third world airport, whereas Cancun looks and feels like any major airport in the US. Leonardo Dicaprio is building an "eco-friendly" resort on his island. The Belizian government sadly gives a rat's behind about their ecology and their history; they're selling off the country to anyone with money, and destroying the amazing natural wonders in the process.
Costa Rica is good; a family friend went down there 10 years ago for a visit. When he came back home he sold his business and real estate holdings in Chicago, packed his bags and has rarely been seen since. He bought and developed property, quite successfully.
Although Montevideo, BsAs and Santiago are my three favorite cities in all of South America, I'd avoid Argentina, Uruguay and Chile, simply because they're quite far away. BsAs is a 9 hour flight from Miami.
I'd recommend Central America; Panama, Costa Rica and Nicaragua are all places that keep popping up in conversations. Plus, they're all within a three hour flight from Florida or Texas.
Mexico does not allow foreign ownership of real estate. They will let you sign a 99 year lease, however the property will never be yours. So marry a Mexican! (unless the laws have changed- this was the case 7 years ago or so...)
Belize is great. My family has owned property there for over a decade. The time to buy was about 10 years ago. Just kidding; Corozal is expanding rapidly, and there's lots of developments popping up everywhere. However, the government is corrupt and not very business friendly. Nothing ever works properly, and its hard to get good help. Very much a place where you basically have to be there all the time to make sure things get done right. And on the coast, because of the coral reef off the coast, everything rusts. And I mean EVERYthing. Plastic rusts. It's a constant battle to keep things operating. Belize International looks like an African third world airport, whereas Cancun looks and feels like any major airport in the US. Leonardo Dicaprio is building an "eco-friendly" resort on his island. The Belizian government sadly gives a rat's behind about their ecology and their history; they're selling off the country to anyone with money, and destroying the amazing natural wonders in the process.
Costa Rica is good; a family friend went down there 10 years ago for a visit. When he came back home he sold his business and real estate holdings in Chicago, packed his bags and has rarely been seen since. He bought and developed property, quite successfully.
Although Montevideo, BsAs and Santiago are my three favorite cities in all of South America, I'd avoid Argentina, Uruguay and Chile, simply because they're quite far away. BsAs is a 9 hour flight from Miami.
I'd recommend Central America; Panama, Costa Rica and Nicaragua are all places that keep popping up in conversations. Plus, they're all within a three hour flight from Florida or Texas.
Wow, great insight! I lost you when you started abbreviating... what is BsAs?
Anyway... are you saying Argentina, Uruguay and Chile should be avoided solely because of the distance or do you have further insights that you can provide as to why you are saying that those countries should be avoided?
In regards to investing in Belize, in the context of what you said, how has investing been there for you and your family? 10 years down there must mean, you either a) have a dedicated person on the ground at all times, or b) found the right, good people, or c) may be a part of the corruption going on? (hahaa, I kid, I kid).
Definitely taking your words into consideration for future dealings and proceedings. Thanks for your added insights!
"I struggle with my focus sometimes and I know that this is detrimental to running any kind of business. You stretch yourself too thin and are becoming the prototypical "jack of all trades but master of none," which you don't want. Or another way to look at it is, being "good in a lot of things but great at none."'
Amen to that @Dominic Jones, I'm in the same boat. I'm going to wait until I ramp up my business in the US prior to starting internationally. I would prefer to flip land abroad in areas about to develop or that are developing.
@Ken Badziak, thanks for pointing that out about owning in Mexico, I didn't know that. It has kindof been a daydream of mine for a bit. I also have some good friends around Mexico City that may be interested in partnering, would probably have to talk to a lawyer to get details of how that would work out.
Thanks for the tips guys. I'll keep you posted if I move forward. @Dominic Jones, I'd be happy to chat at some point about this as well, even if it is to just kick around ideas.
"I struggle with my focus sometimes and I know that this is detrimental to running any kind of business. You stretch yourself too thin and are becoming the prototypical "jack of all trades but master of none," which you don't want. Or another way to look at it is, being "good in a lot of things but great at none."'
Amen to that @Dominic Jones, I'm in the same boat. I'm going to wait until I ramp up my business in the US prior to starting internationally. I would prefer to flip land abroad in areas about to develop or that are developing.
@Ken Badziak, thanks for pointing that out about owning in Mexico, I didn't know that. It has kindof been a daydream of mine for a bit. I also have some good friends around Mexico City that may be interested in partnering, would probably have to talk to a lawyer to get details of how that would work out.
Thanks for the tips guys. I'll keep you posted if I move forward. @Dominic Jones, I'd be happy to chat at some point about this as well, even if it is to just kick around ideas.
Likewise! I'll send the colleague request and we can keep each other updated on how our businesses are growing here in the states and ideas about investing internationally.
Wow, great insight! I lost you when you started abbreviating... what is BsAs?
Anyway... are you saying Argentina, Uruguay and Chile should be avoided solely because of the distance or do you have further insights that you can provide as to why you are saying that those countries should be avoided?
In regards to investing in Belize, in the context of what you said, how has investing been there for you and your family? 10 years down there must mean, you either a) have a dedicated person on the ground at all times, or b) found the right, good people, or c) may be a part of the corruption going on? (hahaa, I kid, I kid).
Definitely taking your words into consideration for future dealings and proceedings. Thanks for your added insights!
BsAs- Buenos Aires.
As for Belize, yeah I guess you can say we have dedicated people on the ground; my parents bought a property there on the beach after they visited in the early 2000's. But they're looking to move back at this point; even though Belize is practically right next door, getting in and out is amazingly expensive. It's so much cheaper to fly into Cancun that they'd rather spend 12 hours on a bus to fly out of Mexico than to deal with the expense of going through Belize International.
As far as avoiding Argentina Uruguay or Chile, I'm merely speaking from a distance perspective. It's a long long long flight down, and expensive (although not as expensive as flights into Brasil). Personally, I wouldn't mind retiring in Patagonia in Argentina, but that would mean living down there full time.
That being said, the Argentine government and economy is in full-blown collapse mode, so you might be able to find some amazing deals... I remember reading a story about one investor who got his start when he purchased a 200+ room hotel in Buenos Aires for a song when the economy last collapsed.. that was about ten years ago.
Chile has the strongest economy in all of South America, and Montevideo has the highest quality of life of any South American city...
Not to mention the beaches and pace of life in northern Uruguay is amazing...think beaches, camp fire, gauchos, surfing, and steak and wine daily.
I'm heading to Belize in a week for vacation, excited to get a better feel on the ground.
That being said, the Argentine government and economy is in full-blown collapse mode, so you might be able to find some amazing deals... I remember reading a story about one investor who got his start when he purchased a 200+ room hotel in Buenos Aires for a song when the economy last collapsed.. that was about ten years ago.
Chile has the strongest economy in all of South America, and Montevideo has the highest quality of life of any South American city...
Wow! Great information again. I'm wondering if you use any online news sites for this information or if you're just knowledgeable about the area since you've invested in Belize for the past 10 years.
I'm curious to know what sort of investments you have down there in Belize. Do you own apartments, Flip SFHs, what?
Thanks for the information.
Wow, great insight! I lost you when you started abbreviating... what is BsAs?
Anyway... are you saying Argentina, Uruguay and Chile should be avoided solely because of the distance or do you have further insights that you can provide as to why you are saying that those countries should be avoided?
In regards to investing in Belize, in the context of what you said, how has investing been there for you and your family? 10 years down there must mean, you either a) have a dedicated person on the ground at all times, or b) found the right, good people, or c) may be a part of the corruption going on? (hahaa, I kid, I kid).
Definitely taking your words into consideration for future dealings and proceedings. Thanks for your added insights!
BsAs- Buenos Aires.
As for Belize, yeah I guess you can say we have dedicated people on the ground; my parents bought a property there on the beach after they visited in the early 2000's. But they're looking to move back at this point; even though Belize is practically right next door, getting in and out is amazingly expensive. It's so much cheaper to fly into Cancun that they'd rather spend 12 hours on a bus to fly out of Mexico than to deal with the expense of going through Belize International.
As far as avoiding Argentina Uruguay or Chile, I'm merely speaking from a distance perspective. It's a long long long flight down, and expensive (although not as expensive as flights into Brasil). Personally, I wouldn't mind retiring in Patagonia in Argentina, but that would mean living down there full time.
Yeah, flights are very expensive. I'm a member of a travel club so prices for me are a little cheaper but they can still be gouging to the pockets, especially for someone who has small pockets trying to make their pockets bigger at Bigger Pockets @Joshua D. ! Oh!! Lol.
Are your parents agents down in Belize or have you guys found any agents on your team in Belize that you work with all the time?
Just an opinion from down here in Uruguay but it's a buyer's market. I just sold a property to an investor for $400,000 on the Punta del Este side of Lomo de Punta Ballena. 2,000 sqm of land, 370 sqm built. Clear ocean view from every room. Gotta redo some floors, update the bathrooms and you've got a million dollar property in a few years.
Just an opinion from down here in Uruguay but it's a buyer's market. I just sold a property to an investor for $400,000 on the Punta del Este side of Lomo de Punta Ballena. 2,000 sqm of land, 370 sqm built. Clear ocean view from every room. Gotta redo some floors, update the bathrooms and you've got a million dollar property in a few years.
Well done! I was living in Punta del Diablo and things were just starting to take off five years ago or so.
That being said, the Argentine government and economy is in full-blown collapse mode, so you might be able to find some amazing deals... I remember reading a story about one investor who got his start when he purchased a 200+ room hotel in Buenos Aires for a song when the economy last collapsed.. that was about ten years ago.
Chile has the strongest economy in all of South America, and Montevideo has the highest quality of life of any South American city...
Wow! Great information again. I'm wondering if you use any online news sites for this information or if you're just knowledgeable about the area since you've invested in Belize for the past 10 years.
I'm curious to know what sort of investments you have down there in Belize. Do you own apartments, Flip SFHs, what?
Thanks for the information.
I'm just knowledgable in the area. To be clear, I don't personally own any RE in Belize; my folks do. They live in Amergris Caye, north of San Pedro town by about 3 miles. I'm not sure how well a flipping strategy would work on the island; it's more of a buy and hold/ development place. The biggest issue being having a great team, not just good, on the ground unless you plan to be there full time.
Ever hear of "island time"? Belizians take it to a whole new level.
I can get you in touch with my mom if you'd like. She knows the place very very well and would gladly help you out (she even has a small BnB where you can rent out a room), but I think you'll find that Belize is a lot like aviation.
It's easy to make a million dollars there; just start with $10m!
Just an opinion from down here in Uruguay but it's a buyer's market. I just sold a property to an investor for $400,000 on the Punta del Este side of Lomo de Punta Ballena. 2,000 sqm of land, 370 sqm built. Clear ocean view from every room. Gotta redo some floors, update the bathrooms and you've got a million dollar property in a few years.
Just curious, can one get a mortgage down in Uruguay? I also live in Brasil, and the mortgage industry is in its infancy. Most people never heard of it!
Or as a gringo do you need to bring all cash to the table?
Love this thread guys. Keep the great questions and responses coming!
Hi Ken,
Generally mortgages are not involved in real estate deals. I see them offered but in any of the deals I've been involved with, no.
About your question, do gringos need to bring all cash? Good question. That's been my experience but I will try to find out more about what the options are and get back to you.
Ken, that's a good one. Made me laugh.
Not to mention the beaches and pace of life in northern Uruguay is amazing...think beaches, camp fire, gauchos, surfing, and steak and wine daily.
I'm heading to Belize in a week for vacation,
excited to get a better feel on the ground.
The steaks in that part of the world are to die for. Some of my favorite memories of Argentina involve the steaks, bottle(s) of Malbec and tango music around the Ricoletta area...
As for Belize, you'll have this to look forward to...
I am a local real estate investor in Miami and a lot of my clients are international investors from South America. They like to invest in the U.S. because of the stability of the real estate market (as opposed to their home countries) I offer them different ways to invest. With most of them I engage in a debt partnerships at a good rate of return (for example 7% for a mortgage in the first lien position for 3-5 years) so they can be absentee real estate investors. It is a good strategy for me, as both sides win.
We currently invest in Ambergris Caye, Belize, so to answer the ownership questions and market questions for that specific area:
1) Property is held fee simple title, there is no foreign restriction on ownership, and the government insures title. You can buy title insurance, but most people do not.
2) The tourism market is steadily increasing without a concomitant increase in the numbers of rooms, there has actually been a decrease is rooms over the past few years, as people have been moving there full time and taking those condos out of the rental pools. (this is the reason we are developing down there).
3) Southwest airlines will begin flying out of Houston Hobby airport starting Oct 15 daily, this will increase the number of seats going into the Country around 1000 per week, this should hopefully bring down some of the costs in getting to and from the market. JetBlue will also start service as well, we are just unsure of the date.
If you have any more specific questions about this market, I would be happy to answer.
That's excellent info, thanks @Eric Tait!
How difficult is building there? I know it can be very hard to get good materials and labor in remote areas.