1st BRRRR Success(ish)

1st BRRRR Success(ish)

Michael DohertyBusiness Member
Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes

Here's a recount of my first BRRRR (Buy- Renovate-Rent-Refinance-Repeat) deal with specific details/numbers. This post is long and detailed, but for those who spend the time to read through it, I hope it helps.

How did I found the deal:

I found this deal on the MLS. It was a foreclosure and soon after submitting my offer, I found out another investor outbid me. It wasn't until 2 weeks later, my agent informed me the original investors financing fell through and my offer was accepted.

The Property and Location:

The property is an oversized two family house right next to a major Hospital and University in Middletown, Ct. Unit 1 has 3BR 1B and Unit 2 has 3BR 1B with 2 large rooms in the finished attic. From a location standpoint, I was pretty familiar with the area and believed it would be sought after in 3-5 years. I have already started to see many restaurants and breweries popping up in town.

Financing:

Listing: $130k 

Purchase Price: $118k

Financing: Hard Money Lender to fund 90% of the Purchase Price, 90% of the renovations for 3pts and 11.5% interest for 12 months no prepayment penalty. I had only done 2 prior deals (no flips) so the rate was slightly higher.

Rehab Budget: $30k

ARV (estimate): $215k

Rent (estimate): $2,800

  • Scope of work: 
    Convert Unit 2 from electric to gas heat. Unit 1 had already been converted so I knew gas lines were in place.
  • Install new on demand hot water system for 2nd floor unit. 
  • Install Luxury Vinyl Plank flooring (LVP) throughout both units (Home Decorators Collection Blue Cedar Grey from Home Depot)
  • Install new counter tops and cabinets in 2nd floor kitchen
  • New Vanity/shower for 2nd floor unit
  • Install 3 new windows
  • Install Sump pump in basement
  • Update washer dryer hooks (each unit)
  • Paint all ceilings/walls/ trim ( Agreeable Grey from Sherman Williams)
  • New appliances for 2nd floor kitchen (used from Facebook Market Place)

Holding Costs: $8,271

  • 4 months of $1,284 interest only payments
  • Taxes
  • Utilities
  • 6 months Builders Risk/General Liability Premium

After all said and done I spent $28,397 (not included holding costs) and was under budget!

Rent:

I was able to rent the top unit for $1,400 and the bottom unit for $1,375 totaling $2,775.

Refinance:

Because the renovation only took 3 months, I was looking for a lender who would refinance the deal without a seasoning period. After doing some research I came across a lender (found him here on Bigger Pockets) who would do a 75% cash out refi, 30 yr fixed @5.965% for 2.5pts, No seasoning.

When I originally financed the deal with the hard money lender I received two appraisals. The first was an as is appraisal for $120k. It also included a projected appraisal (including the scope of my work) for $220k (5k higher than my ARV!!)

Unfortunately my REFI appraisal came back at $201,500- 17k under the projected appraisal.

My lender then agreed to change the terms to 80% LTV to make this work. Two days before closing they changed their mind and could no longer do the 80% LTV, only 75% LTV. They would not budge and did not let me dispute the appraisal so I ended up dropping them and starting my search over. Moreover, I ended up finding another lender who would finance 75% cash out, 1.5pts, 30 yr fixed at 6.6% no seasoning. Their appraisal it came back @ $200,500- 1k less than the original!!!! At this point I figured I was sh** out of luck and should just eat the difference. However, I ended up writing a very detailed letter to the appraiser explaining why I think certain comps should be used vs others and he ended up increasing the value to $205,000!!!.

So after all said and done here is was the numbers look like:

Hard Money Loan

Hard Money Loan Payoff: $134k

Cash into the deal: $24k (includes 10% down on loan, 10% of rehab costs, closing costs)

Refi: 75% of $205,000= $153,750

Cash out: $153,750- $135k(hard money pay off)= $18,750

Closing costs: $9k (escrowed taxes and Insurance)

Cash left in the deal= $14,250

  • Math behind it: (18,750-9k)= $9,750 (24k-9,750) = $14,250
  • In other words, I was able to walk with a check for $9,750 even though I received $18,750 cash out from the bank. After my initial investment of $24,000- $9750 (check) leaves me with $14,250 left in deal as mentioned above.
  • The house could conservatively sell for $220,000 in its current state. If you were to put a traditional 20% down you would be $44,000 out of pocket w/o closing costs instead of $14,250. THAT is the power of the BRRRR.

Monthly Debt Service

PITI= $1,501

Income: $2,775

Monthly Cash flow before expenses: $774

What did I learn?

Always, Always, Always have a conservative ARV. The appraisal part of the process is the only part that is completely out of your control. Another human is determining your properties value and it is completely subjective. It still boggles my mind that we do not have a automatized system for appraisals yet.

Don’t be scared to fire your contractor at any point in the process. I would personally rather pay a higher rate for a contractor that does not eat up my time/money and can execute the job correctly.

I will most likely use the delayed financing technique described in the forums on my next BRRRR.

Trying to find a lender who does not require seasoning and still has a competitive rate proved to be a challenge

DO NOT let you emotions get the best of you. It's a business, treat it like one. If I didn't get so angry with my REFI lender who changed his terms from 80% LTV to 75% at the last minute- I would be left with a 30 yr fixed rate @5.96% instead of 6.6%.

It still costs money to complete the BRRRR. You need working capital and should have reserves for the unexpected.

What’s next?

I plan on holding onto this asset. Since completely the BRRRR process, I honestly think it is one of the best methods in REI to scale and build wealth. It is NOT a get reach quick scheme, but a way to have a cash flowing asset with all the deferred maintenance complete without having to put the traditional 20% down. I have since partnered with someone and purchased a 3 family. Our intention was to BRRRR but the lack of comps in the area have steered us towards a flip.

Please comment with your thoughts, tips, advice and stories.

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Most Popular Reply

Realtor · Hanover Twp, PA · Member since 2018 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
6y

@Michael Doherty, GREAT job! Also an excellent write-up.

I agree with you about appraisals. For 1-4 units comparable sales will be the method they rely on and it is very difficult to compare small multi-family homes. Many times there is insufficient info about the condition of these comparable sales. Tenants don't like pictures taken when a house is being sold so appraisers are sort of left to guess.

For a 5+ unit the income approach would be the method used. So, it should in theory be more precise to predict the appraisal value up front.

When I do a cash-out refi now, I always walk the property with the appraiser myself. I bring printouts of what I think are good comparable sales and I just tell the appraiser what value I am looking for and why. So, I give the appraiser good info and tell them what I think and why. Since I have started doing this my appraisals have gone well. 

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Realtor · Boston, MA · Member since 2019 · 30 posts · 9 votes
    6y

    When you calculate cash left in deal, I think it would make sense to factor in those holding costs. Would be nice to see if after doing a cash out refinance, if you can re-coop the money spent in the holding costs. Those holding costs are important because you must be able to float that money during the process before you refinance out. 

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Keeshaun King delayed financing from my understanding only works on a cash deal (no prior lender involved). Once you pay all cash to secure the house you can immediately do a cash out refi on the loan to recoup some of your cash back. 

    Again- I do not know all the ins and outs of this process and need to do more research but that's a general overview. Maybe someone on here can explain in more detail. 

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Eric Williams 9k for EACH closing. This is one of the aspects of the BRRRR that people often overlook (myself included). It will obviously be cheaper if you can secure financing NOT using a hard money lender. It's the points that really eat up the cost to close. 1pt is 1% of the loan amount so every 100k is 1k in points. A lot of lenders charge 1.5-3 points so you can see how it add up quickly.

    Keep in mind that the reason it cost me 9k to cash out is because I had to escrow taxes and insurance (as you would with any home purchase). So while I didn't pay many points on the cash out, I had to escrow taxes and insurance. 

    As it relates to the holding costs- your absolutely right, the goal would be to recoup some or all of those costs. HOWEVER, you should have some income coming in to help offset that. In this instance, a lot of my holding costs (taxes, insurance, Interest ONLY for the hard money loan) were covered by the tenants rent. 

    For example. My interest only payment was around $1288 a month. It only took me 1 month to finish renovating one of the units and rent it out for $1400- so right there my tenants income was more than covering the interest only portion of the holding costs. Once you get the other units up and running it will drastically offset the holding costs. Let me know if you have any other questions. 

  • Realtor · Boston, MA · Member since 2019 · 30 posts · 9 votes
    6y

    Sorry for all the questions but really digging into this over weekend. Did you pay the points up front or was it built into the mortgage ? For both acquisition/rehab loan AND cash out refinance loan. Thanks. 

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Eric Williams The points were paid for at closing (out of pocket) for both the acquisition and cash out. It didn't feel as 'painful' paying for the points during cash out because they coming out of the proceeds and you are still walking away with a check, but I can assure you.. the check would be a bit higher without the points.

  • Realtor · Boston, MA · Member since 2019 · 30 posts · 9 votes
    6y

    Gotcha...so the $9k includes the points for each loan? 

  • Gina SternPro Member
    Investor · Boca Raton, FL · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 159 votes
    6y

    @Michael Doherty good job man keep it up!!

  • Daniel MendezPro Member
    Investor · Dallas, TX · Member since 2018 · 254 posts · 47 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Michael Doherty:

    @Daniel Mendez my lender also required an LLC so I created one. It's pretty easy to set up and if you really don't feel comfortable you can have your attorney do it.

    I already created my LLC Michael. It just got approved a few weeks ago.

    So in regards to your lender. Did they, in fact, need you to pay the contractors first and then they would reimburse you? Or did your lender give you money in order to pay your contractors?

  • Realtor · Boston, MA · Member since 2019 · 30 posts · 9 votes
    6y

    @Daniel Mendez I would read all pages in this thread post. Pretty sure Michael said he needed to pay out of pocket first and get reimbursed after. 

  • Real Estate Agent · Queens, NY · Member since 2018 · 10 posts · 12 votes
    6y

    Took out my pen and paper on this one. Thank you !

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Daniel Mendez with my hard money lender they escrow the rehab funds and only released it upon completion of the specified line item. Some contractors will require 1/2 the funds upfront and some may do all the work and then ask for payment- really depends on your contractor. 

    In my case- yes I had to front some of the rehab costs until the job was complete. For example: say the entire kitchen is going to cost 10k. The hard money lender will have 10k in escrow waiting to be released upon completion of the job. Once the job is complete and they 'inspect' it- they will THEN at that point release the funds. 

    My contractor made me pay 1/2 of the job upfront. So in this example I put 5k on my credit card and once the job was complete I notified the hard money lender to inspect the job and release the funds. I was able to pay my contractor the remaining balance as well as reimburse myself. 

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Eric Williams yep exactly! 9k for EACH closing includes points. 

  • James DainardPro Member
    Real Estate Broker · Bellevue, WA · Member since 2015 · 415 posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    Very good overview. Congrats!

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @James Dainard thank you sir! Been following your IG- love the flips your doing. 

  • ANAHEIM CALIFORNIA · Member since 2019 · 1 post · 1 vote
    6y

    Congratulation!!!!   This was so informative! Thank you!

  • Rental Property Investor · Canton, OH · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    @Michael Doherty

    Congrats! Sounds like some minor hiccups, but for your first one, pretty good! I think this experience taught you a valuable lesson early on...that is that lenders are really a dime a dozen. I don't mean that in a negative way, just saying that the appraiser is ctitical. As you do more deals, try getting to know who the appraisers are in the area. If you find a good one to work with, ask him/her what lenders they work with and try and use those banks on future deals. At the end of the day, a 70% LTV with a more generous appraiser can be better than an 80% LTV with a conservative appraiser.

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Account Closed couldn't agree more, appraisers can make or break a deal. It's my understanding though that regardless of the relationship you have with lenders/appraisers- the company and person selected to do the appraisal is 100% random (illegal otherwise). They should have no affiliation or prior relationship with both the client (bank) and you. In a perfect world this would be the case but I am confident that there is some sort of push from the bank to get it to 'appraise' for the amount they are comfortable lending. 

    I would love to hear if you had any more insights on this?

  • Rental Property Investor · Canton, OH · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Michael Doherty:

    @Account Closed couldn't agree more, appraisers can make or break a deal. It's my understanding though that regardless of the relationship you have with lenders/appraisers- the company and person selected to do the appraisal is 100% random (illegal otherwise). They should have no affiliation or prior relationship with both the client (bank) and you. In a perfect world this would be the case but I am confident that there is some sort of push from the bank to get it to 'appraise' for the amount they are comfortable lending. 

    I would love to hear if you had any more insights on this?

    I'm no legal expert (maybe someone else can chime in), but from my understanding, the appraisers and the banks need to be independent of one another, and you cannot pick your appraiser...but that's not to say an appraiser cannot work with specific lenders. 


    Also, I've never heard of appraisers not being allowed to have a prior relationship with someone. I can't remember which BP podcast it was, but they had an appraiser on that mentioned some people took him to lunch from time-to-time. 


    All that said, I do know appraisers have very strict guidelines and ethical standards they need to adhere to, so any reputable ones are not going to do anything that compromises their license.

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Account Closed Interesting... appreciate your input. Have you found more appraisals going your way in terms of ARV after making friends with Lender's that work with specific appraisers?

  • Investor · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2019 · 27 posts · 10 votes
    6y

    Wow. You say Success(ISH)! This sounds like a great deal. So you left a little cash in - still an outstanding cash on cash ROI. I am just now looking at my first BRRRR and as far as refinancing goes - my lender said that I can't refi before 6 months if there is a lien on the property. And the hard money lender puts a lien on it. I have a couple other properties and I asked the lender to put the lien on those properties instead of the BRRRR property, but that wouldn't fly. LOL. Nice job on the whole thing. I hope my first one is as good as that. I'd be pumped. The property I am considering is great - except it has a rodent infestation. And, I am not sure how to estimate the costs to cleans the place of the four-legged varmints. Crazy how such small animals can make such a large hurtle for me! LOL. Best of luck.

  • Michael DohertyBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · West Hartford, CT · Member since 2016 · 449 posts · 476 votes
    6y

    @Jay Schultz thank you, appreciate the kind words. Definitely get a few different quotes on the infestation issue- could be a deal breaker or could be nothing. You could always work those costs into closing and a credit from the seller. 

  • Rick SantasierePro Member
    Real Estate Broker · Granby, CT · Member since 2015 · 694 posts · 317 votes
    6y

    @Michael Doherty great post my friend. Your numbers look really good and I am quite impressed. I may have just found a local lender offering 75% LTV rehab, at 4.25% for the 30 year for investment property, with no points as long as it's in an LLC. We are picking up another SFR, that I am showing my son the ropes on so he can see the BRRRR process in effect.Let's connect soon and grab some coffee.

  • Realtor · Boston, MA · Member since 2019 · 30 posts · 9 votes
    6y

    @Rick Santasiere I am in Boston area. Which broker did you find those terms? 

  • Member since 2019 · 8 posts · 2 votes
    6y

    That is great info. Thank you. My long term goals are to Buy and HOld as well

  • Rental Property Investor · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2019 · 11 posts · 7 votes
    6y

    Congrats Michael! This is so awesome. Thank you for breaking down the numbers. This is very encouraging. I was thinking of doing my first BRRRR. I haven't found a property yet. I was scared to take on a big rehab project since I'm not handy and have no clue.

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