NEW CONSTRUCTION SINGLE FAMILY BREWERYTOWN PHILADELPHIA

NEW CONSTRUCTION SINGLE FAMILY BREWERYTOWN PHILADELPHIA

Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes

Let's not be coy, we overpaid for this lot, but we knew it going in this time...which is a refreshing change for us. We bought this lot as a marginal deal thinking that if all went well we'd be lucky to make $30k and, if it went poorly, we'd break even. If it goes really poorly we'll be paying for our education.  We have a couple other reasons we intentionally overpaid for a vacant lot: 

- We own a 3100 sq ft (increasing to 3600 sq ft) building across the street that we're keeping as a higher end 3-unit rental (rehab kicks off in a month or so, budget of around $250k-$300k) 

- We wanted to learn the new construction process on a smaller project before we kick off a couple 6-unit new construction rental buildings we have lined up. We've been busy assembling land :) 

The kicker is we may have been overly cautious on our comps and could potentially do pretty well on the sale. We paid $85k for the lot and will spend ~$215k on construction. We're expecting to sell around $385k or so as some new construction on a nearby block, in a slightly less desirable location, sold in the $370k range. We're seeing comps creep up in the area and are getting feedback from a couple local developers that we should easily break $400k and possibly get near $450k. I have my doubts but we'll see what happens. As I said, we didn't go into this one looking to make much, it was to improve the area and learn the new construction process for ourselves. If we make some money while we're at it, great! It's also a case of a rising tide lifting all boats; the market has only gotten better in our little pocket of Philly and we may see a decent profit because of that and not our amazing financial/real estate prowess, believe me! 

This house will be 1650 sq ft above ground, 2200 including finished basement, and have 4 beds, 3 baths and a roof deck. Below are renderings my awesome partner @David Ross did. Tagging my other amazing partner @Jeremy T. because he never gets any love on the forums but he's truly the backbone of our little tribe. 

There's all the fun stuff, pictures and numbers, follow along to see how we do! 

Facade rendering: 

Basement rendering:

First floor:

2nd floor:

3rd floor:

Roof deck:

7Reply
97 views

Most Popular Reply

Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2014 · 65 posts · 60 votes
10y

Thanks for posting @Troy Sheets !

If anyone has questions feel free to ask. We'll share thoughts and insights on materials, decisions, and processes throughout the project.

See this reply in the discussion

43 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • Investor · Langhorne, PA · Member since 2014 · 30 posts · 13 votes
    10y
    Troy S. You are a busy guy!
  • philadelphia, PA · Member since 2015 · 15 posts · 3 votes
    10y

    Holy cow that's ambitious! I'm a firm believer in hands on learning so I can appreciate the fact that you guys are learning by doing. There's no substitute for experience.  As someone planning to invest in brewerytown I'll be following along with great interest. Best of luck! I'll keep an eye out for you in the neighborhood. 

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y

    2 weeks in as of today and we're starting framing early next week. Below are shots from day one till current. 

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2014 · 65 posts · 60 votes
    10y

    Thanks for posting @Troy Sheets !

    If anyone has questions feel free to ask. We'll share thoughts and insights on materials, decisions, and processes throughout the project.

  • Rental Property Investor · Poughkeepsie, NY · Member since 2013 · 262 posts · 96 votes
    10y

    Sounds like you guys are doing big things. 

    Congrats

    The renderings are really awesome.  I would like to start doing those for future projects.  What program did you guys use?

  • Glen Mills, PA · Member since 2016 · 18 posts · 2 votes
    10y

    looks great.  I'm from the philly area and that neighborhood is poised for success!  Let me know if you are looking for any partners.  I have a great deal of new construction experience, residential subdivision, and engineering.

    Dewey Jurich

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 177 posts · 80 votes
    10y

    looks great guys! who is the GC? @Troy Sheets @David Ross 

  • Realtor/Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2012 · 114 posts · 38 votes
    10y

    This looks really awesome guys! @David Ross great job on the design! Also, a big fan of your approach and mindset in tackling new construction for the first time. 

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Mark Redmann:

    looks great guys! who is the GC? @Troy Sheets @David Ross 

    We're doing a hybrid approach to GC'ing on this one. We'll be licensed and insured GC's in the next month or so and will GC all of our smaller projects ourselves in the future. The first 6-unit building we'll hire out to a GC with larger multifamily experience for a variety of reasons, the main one being that banks don't want to lend to GC's/developers with no track record on a large project. On our rehabs and SFH new construction we've had no problem getting financing but when you get anywhere near a $1m dollar total cost project, banks get funny!

    For this project we're paying a local GC a flat fee to oversee the project and pull permits. He's giving us all the subs contact info and bids at pass through pricing (no markup) so we're seeing what he'd normally pay (we're paying subs directly) and will have that as a benchmark for future projects. This approach also helps us build a list of subs to start using, along with others we've picked up along the way, for future projects. 

    I have to say, so far, this arrangement is working out really well. The GC has saved us some heartache already with a few things he's caught and the bids we're getting from his subs are all coming in below our estimates. 

    A few things he's caught for us:

    • The sump pit in the basement was almost 1' out into the finished living area. The foundation sub was supposed to put an indentation into the footer (which is 2' wide) so the 2' wide sump would fit under the 36" wide stairs. He didn't and, if it wasn't caught, the sump would be sitting 1' into the finished living space instead of tucking neatly under the stairs. 
    • Power lines needed covering. The top set of lines are high voltage and can arc 10' under the right conditions. We should have called the utility company to cover them weeks before digging started as their lead time to come out is 2-3 weeks. Luckily the lines were high enough that the excavator could still get in safely and dig the foundation but, if it weren't caught on day one and the framers were ready to start on the 2nd floor, we'd be at a standstill. 
    • First floor height above ground. We had no idea there was a max allowed height for the first floor to be out of the ground. I'm sure the foundation sub knows this but we sure didn't! The GC made sure the basement (9' ceiling height in basement) was deep enough that we didn't come out of the ground too far. Apparently the magic number is around 42" for the first floor. I'll have to look a bit more into this as I want to know the specifics for future reference. 

    Lots more lessons to be learned!!! 

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Eric Hrlbock:

    Sounds like you guys are doing big things. 

    Congrats

    The renderings are really awesome.  I would like to start doing those for future projects.  What program did you guys use?

    Thanks Eric! @David Ross would best be able to answer this for you so I'll tag him. 

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2014 · 65 posts · 60 votes
    10y

    Hey @Eric Hrlbock thanks for asking. Try Skechup. You can use the free version and test it out. This is what I do when trying to spatially figure out floorplans and unit configurations. These were done by an offshore designer using Sketchup Professional. I provided him with our CAD files for the permit set.

  • Rental Property Investor · Poughkeepsie, NY · Member since 2013 · 262 posts · 96 votes
    10y

    Great,

    Thanks. 

    I'm gonna play with sketch up. I feel it brings a tangible aspect to a future project especially if investors are involved. Are off shore designers hard to find?

    Are off shore investors hard to find?

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2014 · 65 posts · 60 votes
    10y

    @Eric Hrlbock I use www.UpWork.com and there are many 3D designers looking for work. 

    Offshore investors? I wouldn't touch that one with a 10' pole.

  • Rental Property Investor · Poughkeepsie, NY · Member since 2013 · 262 posts · 96 votes
    10y

    Haha.  Thanks.  Typo maybe lack of sleep.  

  • Real Estate Investor · Audubon, PA · Member since 2009 · 13k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    10y

    @Troy Sheets - I think you might discover that the height of first floor level is partly limited by the width of the sidewalk and the number of steps to walk up to the front door. The steps have to meet code on the height of risers and depth of tread, and the walking area of the sidewalk has to be a certain width as well. If you look at 21st Street between Poplar and Parrish, first floor elevations are not so low. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Mineola, NY · Member since 2014 · 838 posts · 212 votes
    10y

    @Troy Sheets Project looks awesome!! keep us updated!

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y

    Framing was pushed back to Thursday but the delivery was incomplete so we started Friday. Progress after 1 day. Back at it next week! 

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y

    Did I mention my MFH is just in front of this new construction? This is the view from my bedroom window. You can see the parapet walls for the roof deck going up. Exterior framing should be done today and interior finished up this week. Far left side of this picture you can see a new construction home that's almost finished. The building to the right (pet food supplies awning) keeps going up for Sheriff sale and getting stayed. Can't wait till that eyesore gets sold even if we don't get to buy it. It's been vacant for the 5 years I've lived in the area. 

    Early morning view.

    This is the view from the same bedroom window looking to the left. Originally this small 2-story, 2br shell was 1,000 sq ft and sold for $115k! It's being turned into a much larger 3-story with roof deck. Just to the right of that you can see the small 1-story addition on the back of another building we own. That's the one I mentioned previously that will become 3 high end rentals. There are two more new construction projects going on within half a block of our project on the same street and countless rehabs like the one below. Most of the rowhomes in this area are very small, some as small as 720 sq ft. The size of the lots is also (generally) very small and you're restricted from increasing the house footprint for the most part (without zoning which can be long and tedious) so the easiest thing to do is go up, down, or both. Many investors dig out and finish basements rather than add a 3rd story. That can require engineering and underpinning foundations. You can also have trouble adding a 3rd story if there are no other 3-story houses on the block, or so I've heard. Either way, as the saying goes, there's no free lunch.  

  • Real Estate Investor · Audubon, PA · Member since 2009 · 13k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    10y

    @Troy Sheets in the one photo of the new framing, it looks like there is a gap to the left of your framing with the wall of the existing structure on that side; but that does not seem to be the case on the right side. Can you explain?

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Steve Babiak:

    @Troy Sheets in the one photo of the new framing, it looks like there is a gap to the left of your framing with the wall of the existing structure on that side; but that does not seem to be the case on the right side. Can you explain?

    I noticed that too. My best guess is the two existing houses on each side aren't parallel. Framers want to build square boxes so I'd imagine they framed the right side wall as close as possible then squared up the left side wall. It gets closer to the other house as it goes towards the rear of the house so I'm guessing the houses aren't parallel. We lost a good 6" to that plus another 6" on each side for existing party wall double brick. Even though it's a 16' lot, by the time you lose all that and frame walls we've lost a good 2 1/2 feet of interior space. 

    Hope that answers your question and thanks for following along Steve! 

  • Real Estate Investor · Audubon, PA · Member since 2009 · 13k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    10y

    @Troy Sheets that makes some sense. But then how do you finish the exterior of the wall on that left side? Or do you just roof over the gap and make the facade cover the gap so that the left side wall is not visible from the outside?

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Steve Babiak:

    @Troy Sheets that makes some sense. But then how do you finish the exterior of the wall on that left side? Or do you just roof over the gap and make the facade cover the gap so that the left side wall is not visible from the outside?

    The walls (new construction wall - air - existing party wall) are generally separated by a little air gap due to the unevenness of existing party walls. We had the same thing on our Fishtown flip in the kitchen. We measured to the existing plaster wall for kitchen layout pre-construction not realizing it was 8" or so out of parallel with the neighbors house by the time we got to the extreme rear of our kitchen. The framers framed it in square so by the time we got to the roof deck we had a nice size gap to fill. 

    Yes, it's all made up at the roof. We'll have to close the gap with framing, sheathing and roofing material and tie the neighbors roof into our parapet walls. Our parapet walls will sit much higher than the neighboring roofs. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2015 · 44 posts · 28 votes
    10y
    Troy S. If you don't mind sharing who you used for excavation and foundation pour that would be great. Starting to undergo my first new construction project. Actually 2 SF
  • Chicago, IL · Member since 2014 · 710 posts · 200 votes
    10y

    @Troy Sheets

    Cool build.... 

    Let me ask you how long and the cost for permits on a project like this in Philly?

  • Developer · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 902 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @John Weidner:

    @Troy Sheets

    Cool build.... 

    Let me ask you how long and the cost for permits on a project like this in Philly?

     I'd have to go through quickbooks but I know it was almost $500 for the permit to close the sidewalk! I think the rest of the permits were close to $600 or so. 

    IIRC it took close to 30 days for permits to be approved. We were lucky and got approved first time around. It seems most builders, us included, get permit plans kicked back at least once on each project and your ~30 days starts over.  City says 15 business days but it was definitely longer than that. 

Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.