Water, Fire and Mold..Oh My!

Water, Fire and Mold..Oh My!

Contractor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2008 · 13 posts · 4 votes

First, let me introduce myself. My name is Bryan Swallow, I am in the disaster restoration industry as a damage mitigator, as well as an instructor. Over the years I've worked on hundreds of projects, from small damage projects in mobile homes to multi-story commercial properties.

I thought it might be good to start a thread where people can come with questions about what to do, or what to expect when dealing with different types of damage.

Let's start with something very basic and important: Does your property management know what to do in case of emergency?

I recently came upon this situation when called in to do an estimate by the tenant whose child had left the upstairs bathtub running, causing a partial flood upstairs and downstairs. The property management left it to the tenant to handle everything, and refused to notify the property owner.

Unless handled properly, water can continue to cause damage for weeks that can lead to very costly remodeling and remediation repairs. Would you leave the repairs up to the sole discretion of a tenant who has no vested interest in the value of your property, other than their deposit? Does your property management have a plan in place for emergencies, or do they just collect the rent? If you believe they have a plan, how do you know; did you ask or are you assuming?

Having contigency plans in place cost little to nothing to set up, and can save you thousands the first time you need it.

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  • Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    17y

    Based on the policies I've worked with, a child leaving a bathtub overflowing should have been an insurable cause of lause and I've always seen mitigation covered as part of the insurance claim. Contacting my insurer would be my first course of action.

  • Contractor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2008 · 13 posts · 4 votes
    17y

    Exactly TIm, and landlords that handle the rental themselves can take steps to do this. Most standard policies are written to cover "sudden or accidental" releases of water.

    The issue is, if you've hired a property management company, do they have procedures in place to protect your property. Unless they have POA and the insurance information, they would not be able to file a claim in the homeowner's stead. If the tenant has a thousand dollar deposit down, and the repair bill is estimated at twice that or more, would you realistically expect them to take care of it for you?

  • Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    17y

    Right, and I've covered claims where a child caues the sudden and accidental release of water - it depends adjuster to adjuster but your scenario is something I would have covered while in the industry.

    I see what you're saying though and agree completely - set up a system to be notified by your prop mgmt company in the event of problems - especialy in an area like mine where prop. mgmt is an unlicensed industry. I have to admit, your story is the first I've heard of a prop. mgmt company that refused to let the landlord know of the problem. I'd have to see their service agreement but I would imagine that this was probably a violation of that agreement, if nothing I'd sue the crap out of a property manager for that and file a claim and provide my insurer all info they would need to subrogate against the property manager's liability insurance (provided they have that).

    Nice to have you here. Not a lot of folks here on the restoration side of this business. Now we both can scare them with stories of what we've seen...lol

  • Contractor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2008 · 13 posts · 4 votes
    17y

    Funny how things work out...We got called to a property yesterday to review damage for exactly the same thing we are discussing here - a child left the upstairs bath tub running and flooded most of the house. This is a tenant/landlord situation.
    After giving our estimate, the landlord said he wanted to review with his insurance company(AmFam) first.

    Today he told us that his agent says there is no coverage, because he has a landlord policy that only covers defects and failures of the plumbing, tenant caused damage is not covered. Accidents are covered only if it is owner ocupied.

    Yikes! Do you know what your policy limitations are?!?

  • Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    17y

    Wait a second....the AGENT made a coverage decision? No no no no.... Agent's do NOT make coverage decisions. That is the role of the adjuster. I have yet to meet a single agent who understood the policy like an adjuster (unless he/she was an adjuster before).

    Is this an Arizona AmFam policy?

  • Contractor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2008 · 13 posts · 4 votes
    17y

    The agent can advise his client, based on what information he is given, on specific wording that may or may not include coverage for a claim. The adjuster, as you know, has no role unless a claim is submitted. If the prop owner had a simple homeowners policy that excluded tenants, and possibly voided coverage if property was changed to a rental, the agent would advise as so.

    I suspect, however, that a claim was turned in and reviewed by a desk adjuster who, in turn, denied coverage based on the homeowners own description of loss.

    We are no longer involved with this project, so I don't know all the details, but with all the changes you can make to your policy to keep the price down, I have no doubt this was an option that was regrettably chosen.

  • Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    17y
    Originally posted by Bryan Swallow:
    If the prop owner had a simple homeowners policy that excluded tenants, and possibly voided coverage if property was changed to a rental, the agent would advise as so.


    True, and it wouldn't be the first time I've seen an investor lose thousands to save 10 bucks.
  • Contractor · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2008 · 13 posts · 4 votes
    17y

    Quick update for all you investors and property managers- New York city has recently revised and updated its guidelines concerning fungi (mold) in the indoor environment.

    If your state does not have specific guidelines concerning mold remediation/cleanup, they probably defer to the NYC guidelines. You can find these guidelines by google-ing "new york city guidelines mold". The link will be on the nyc.gov website, just to make sure you find the right one.

    Print out a copy for yourself, it is free to access. It will help keep you informed and prepared if the need ever arises. If you have questions, post 'em here and we can discuss and clarify them.

  • Real Estate Investor · Fort Washington, MD · Member since 2008 · 33 posts · 2 votes
    17y

    I wasnt so lucky with my water/mold issue. Although, I have insurance, I was not covered by the flooding since I didnt have flood insurance incorporated into my clause. And now, I have to pay thousands for a sump pump installation, mold remediation, and re-installation of drywall, prime & paint.

    If only the city would repair, place roofs on abandoned homes, many investors in the Baltimore City area wouldnt have these waterproofing issues.

    Yes, I have contacted the City about this, and they tell me due to budget cuts, they cant attend to all abandon homes, unless it has severe structural damage that could affect the inhabitable home...whatever...

  • Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    17y

    Not the city's responsibility. The time of year you buy abandoned property is a key factor to helping minimize water damage. Late spring I have to be extra careful. Once you get a property under contract and it has a bad roof, get a tarp on the roof. It's cheap insurance while you wait for closing.

  • Contractor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2008 · 183 posts · 17 votes
    17y

    I think Zainab who is in Baltimore my be talking about row houses like we have here in Philadelphia. If the neighboring house has a leak, your house has a leak. Absentee landlords and people who are in the home but can not keep up maintenance cause damage to the homes good citizens own.

    When my folks lived in St Petes, the city would come fix things like this, or pick up garbage in a yard for example. In return the city would lean that house for repayment of services. If the bills mounted unpaid, the city would take possession of the property.

    I thought this was a good solution to the problem and I wished we saw it in Philadelphia. Maybe Baltimore too? Might be a nice way for responsible homeowners and landlords to get into some property, good for the cities too.

    Diane Menke

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