Integrity...does it exist with Landlords?

Integrity...does it exist with Landlords?

Renter · KY · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 0 votes

Sorry this is long but I need others input.
Hang in here with me please.

We are first time renters. We found a home in a nice area, listing says "Beautiful Home ...great for a family"...boasts all our needs in a home.
Neighborhood is family friendly and we had mutual connections of other known people with the landlord we will call H.
H is in charge of the home but not the owner. Family member of his is the home owner who lives in other state. The family member does all the foot work of finding and application of new tenant and H takes care of repairs needed and picking up rent.

Very down to earth. H seemed like "good people."

When we were taken through the home by H we were told that the current renters were not taking care of the home and _it_was_obvious. The carpet was stained like someone walked around spilling who knows what and never bothered to wash it up, very dirty dirty walls, black water in the toilet, screens busted out of the screen doors, the fridge was new but you about died when you opened it from the smell of rotting food...you get the picture.
We could see past all that and see that underneath all the *dirt* was a beautiful home.
We negotiated-of course all verbally-because we trusted the guy! H gave us no reason NOT too-he assured us that the carpets would be professional cleaned, toilet replaced, deck power washed,screens repaired and that we could paint to our liking, he even offered to pay for some of the paint.

He as well said we could pay the security depo in payments, and no need to pay rent until we actually moved in after painting.

We signed the lease still being led on that all this was the case and he even said "let me know how much paint you will need and I will get it for you or save your receipt if you buy it " as I signed the dotted line.

SO We get a call that the home is ready and that all we have to pay is the depo up front(no longer a payment option) and we can pay rent once we get moved in. Mind you this is a week before the 1st of the month(when bank needs the money for house payment on the home).

Key pick up day comes after H calls and assures us the home is ready and we walk into filth.
Carpets not cleaned. Screen door still busted.
We ask if the carpet cleaning is on the schedule and are told by H "oh we will have to ask family member(the owner) about getting that done. They are actually in town this weekend and will be here any minute."

SO to our surprise the owner walks in meets and greets tells us what they DID do...cleaned the fridge, mowed and weeded the landscaping (which was a big feat in itself), unclogged the upstairs plumping assured us they would clean up the mess that was left due to that fix(but left the mess for us) clean. Owner also says "Oh by the way the shower in the down stairs bathroom leaks terribly so we are going to replace that ASAP." Looks at H and H says "oh you going to give me more work are you?" Jokingly it seemed he was saying it but....

We then ask about the obviously horribly dirty carpets and the owner looks down and says "well I don't have a steam cleaner..do you?" I tell them no...and the owner says "Well, they have been vaccumed." Smiling the whole time like it was not a big deal. H was standing there and said nothing.

SO at this point we tell the owner we are here to paint and they hesitate for a moment but H steps in and assures the owner we have discussed no crazy colors and do not touch the wood work. Fine.

He then asks us when we plan on paying for the rent. I say I can pay it now I have it. The owner says OK smiles and wait s for the money. I guess I needed to say "H said we can pay it after we are done painting and physically make the move." But I did not. I paid the rent.

SO we go spend $200 in paint. At week's end of painting cleaning our butts off, I call H and say "hey we have the paint receipt here for you." Right off he says " well we will have to ask owner about paying for that." SO I knew we were screwed out of that $200.
I told H then I was getting confused on who to call about house issues at this point. H assures me to call him or his family member owner. Also note here the new shower the owner says the home needs is not in either.

SO I call the owner tell him that H said he would pay for paint and the owner is not happy to hear that. He said he did not mind us painting but that was our choice and he was not paying for paint. I address the shower issue and he at first blew me off then apologized and said he was hoping to do it while he was home but time got away from him so it did not happen. He assures me he will get in contact with H and get it repaired.
I also tell the owner I am confused on who is in charge here with house issues and owner also says well me but you can call H since I am not in state.

I steam the carpets myself, we have painted paneling(which if you have ever you know what a B$%# that whole process is), room after room, scrubbed up the plumping repair filth (they did not even put the wall cover back over the exposed pipes!, fixed the screen doors, gotten rid of nasty left over furniture from previous tenants(WHICH we also were told would be hauled away for us).

We get a call from owner stating he has called H and shower repair is on the schedule. Asks then if we painted two specific rooms in the home and we said yes to one not yet to another. Owner then says we cannot paint the room we did not touch yet. They are "emotionally attached" the the specific paint theme in that room. Then tells me to call owner if any decisions need to be made about the home in the future. Was firm in voice but not warm. I assured the homeowner that we would leave the home in better condition than the previous tenants and would treat it like our own. Told owner it was a beautiful home under all the dirt now that we have it cleaned.

Took pictures of everything.

Now the feel good warm fuzzy feeling is gone on all sides of this rent.

****** experience for us first time renters.
We are the 3rd tenants of this home(verified it myself with the owner).

We do however have a great home all newly painted, cleaned all the nasty dirt away and are ready to move in this weekend.

Any tips on how to handle future interactions here with the two landlords?
We are now left with a leaking shower and no trim due to the water damage in the bath room. Worried if it will ever get fixed.

Thanks if you have made it this far.

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Developer · Garland, TX · Member since 2008 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
15y

TJ, sorry this has happened to you.

As landlords, we are taught to screen for good tenants, but I've often wondered why so few tenants screen for good landlords. How? Ask for references and talk to them. Get all agreements in writing. You are entering a very important relationship, do what you can to make sure it is a good fit. If a qualified prospective tenant asked me for references, I'd be happy to give them.

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  • Real Estate Investor · Waynesboro, VA · Member since 2009 · 22 posts · 6 votes
    15y

    Just like any other fields of endeavor, you have individuals of integrity, who see what they do as a profession and handle themselves as professionals. Their responsibilities often include upgrading the housing stock,providing clean, safe, affordable housing to their clientle,.,and so on. Then there are the others. I think you've met one of them...Much of this may have been avoided with the use of a simple inspection list, tied to the lease. A room by room walk-through, spelling out what the expectations were, delineating what was to be done and what the timeframe for completion was. This tends to eliminate the he said, she said from the rental process. I wish you better luck the next time...

  • Renter · KY · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    15y

    You are right D.L.. Honestly, I had one with me the day we signed the lease to pull out and request to use/implement. I struggled mentally with the decision(as to offer it or not) as on one hand, H was so kind and believable, I felt by suggesting to use the checklist,[it] would damper the good feeling/mood/relationship we were headed with.
    Lesson learned...

  • Developer · Garland, TX · Member since 2008 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    15y

    TJ, sorry this has happened to you.

    As landlords, we are taught to screen for good tenants, but I've often wondered why so few tenants screen for good landlords. How? Ask for references and talk to them. Get all agreements in writing. You are entering a very important relationship, do what you can to make sure it is a good fit. If a qualified prospective tenant asked me for references, I'd be happy to give them.

  • Renter · KY · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    15y

    I wish I had this advice sooner Jon. It does make sense to me to do that work as a tenant, to screen the landlord, considering the type of relationship.
    We prided ourselves on not being your "typical renters" to all the homes we looked at and had great references to back us. I never once though of doing the same with the landlord.
    First time renter blues.....

  • Real Estate Investor · Sunnyvale, CA · Member since 2010 · 79 posts · 53 votes
    15y

    Hi,
    sorry to hear about your situation.
    Seems like your stuck where you are for a while, although you don't clarify how long your lease is.


    So this would be your main contact for getting things done.
    Document, document, document.
    Although the previous agreement was verbal, carefully write it down point by point. Then present it to H and ask him to provide a response on each point.
    If his response is verbal, write it all down and send back to him for his confirmation of what is now being said.
    For repair requests - make them in writing and ask for a target date for when it will be fixed. Follow up for when it's not done on time -in writing.

    No doubt, the response might be along the lines of "We're a happy family here, we don't need this level of documentation."
    You are not a happy family, this is a business transaction and this is YOUR HOME. Explain that previous verbal discussions seem to get confused or points forgotten, so you feel better having things written down so that it's clear who needs to do what. I'm sure they will want to make sure that you feel comfortable and happy with their services.

  • Contractor · Arcade, NY · Member since 2011 · 44 posts · 31 votes
    15y
    Originally posted by TJ Kandel:
    We negotiated-of course all verbally-because we trusted the guy!

    As I read through your account, this is what screamed at me more than anything. I can't tell you how many times I've done the same thing. Usually, it winds up with me getting burned.

    I've taken to conducting myself by a pretty simple rule: If something involves money either now or in the future, then treat it as business.

    That means to write things down, document changes, have both parties sign off on modifications of a material nature that could burn you later. In this case, you made substantial changes to the payment arrangements for initial monies being paid. Luckily it came out well for you since you were able to come up with what was required when needed, but sometimes it's not so well timed.

    You also signed the lease as written. In the courts I've been in, when you have two competing records of an agreement one being verbal and the other being written, generally, the written one wins.

    Not saying any of this to beat you over the head about a prior mistake or misstep, but take the advice to heart moving forward. You have entered into a contract with another party who is, at best incompetent based on your account, and at worst dishonorable. Protect your own interests. Document everything as it relates to this relationship. Hopefully you may never need it, but if things go south for whatever reason, you will be very happy you exerted the extra effort.

  • Renter · KY · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    15y

    Matt R
    Thank you for your reply.
    Lease is for a year. I like your idea and I am going to write down the statement you made to have on hand to use
    "Explain that previous verbal discussions seem to get confused or points forgotten, so you feel better having things written down so that it's clear who needs to do what."

    That is EXACLTY what I need to say come future issues and with the existing shower issue.
    THANK YOU!!

    Brad B
    You hit the nail on the head ..we are talking about a large chunk of money here and why would I not treat it as such?
    I got it..document document document...keeping a note book here on out...
    Thanks so much!

  • Involved In Real Estate · Rochester, NY · Member since 2011 · 138 posts · 11 votes
    15y

    TJ-

    Sorry to hear about your situation. And yes, there are many good landlords out there!! I get EVERYTHING in writing. I also PROVIDE everything in writing. It has saved me already!

    Hopefully the situation gets better for you. Good luck!!

  • Renter · KY · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    15y

    Thanks for the well wishes Kathy...and thanks for the faith in other landlords....we know what to do NOW should there be a next time in this venture of renting for us ;)

  • Investor · Diamond Bar, CA · Member since 2009 · 446 posts · 233 votes
    15y

    Just put everything in writing. There is never any way to know who you are dealing with - landlord or renter.

    There is no such thing as "good people" in Real Estate - I have had to learn that the hard way.

    Young, old, anyone.

    I had a 70 year old guy and his wife lie to me, let me spend money on due diligience, several thousand, and then try to weasel out of the deal.

    I have had peers lie to me in front of their parents and family - right in front of family.

    I could give you a ton of stories - the reality is that there is no more shame in this world.

    Be Firm, Fair, Friendly in all dealings and do it all in writing.

  • Residential Real Estate Broker · Clinton, MD · Member since 2008 · 297 posts · 178 votes
    15y

    TJ -- The suggestions made are great. I always walk through a property during lease and give the new tenant an inspection checklist. I want to attract and keep tenants like you.

    I have one additional suggestion. Since repairs may or may not be made, you may want to "remind" the property manager about the shower and suggest that if doesn't have time to get to it in the next day or two, can he suggest a plumber and then deduct the cost from next month's rent (sending him a copy of the plumber's receipt).

  • Commercial Real Estate Lender / Syndicator · Dallas, TX · Member since 2011 · 888 posts · 309 votes
    15y

    Not familiar with laws in Kentucky, and I obviously don't know what licenses H holds. Can H legally be the property manager? He clearly does not own the property, and I highly doubt he is doing it gratis. Not that this means much, but I'd hold it over his head if things were not getting "done" as promised.

  • Specialist · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 852 votes
    15y

    Holy Novel Batman!! LOL! :mrgreen:

  • Renter · KY · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    15y

    @ Rob....LOL...I warned readers it was!..LOL..

    Jason...sorry to hear of that story of the gramps and grams being so ..so evil..jeesh...never to old, eh?

    I like the firm fair and friendly motto...trying that on already ;)

    T.Ferrante I like that Idea too..thanks so much

    Carlos...I do not think H holds that title..just trying to help out family is all he is doing..well.. it comes across like that anyway...

  • Commercial Real Estate Lender / Syndicator · Dallas, TX · Member since 2011 · 888 posts · 309 votes
    15y

    It's not about someone's title, it's about actions. Leasing, renting, listing, procuring prospects, negotiating, or offering to perform any of those acts on a property you do not own, may require a license in the State of Kentucky.

  • Renter · KY · Member since 2011 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    15y

    ooohhh. I follow now Carlos...thanks...will hold on to that and look into it if needed....

  • Real Estate Investor · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2010 · 63 posts · 40 votes
    15y

    Always have everything in writing. When renting, the rental lease agreement is to protect both the landlord and the renter. The Lease should explain exactly what is expected of both the landlord and the renter. Look online at the Landlord/Tenant Act for your state. It's very clear.

    The landlord is required by law to make repairs in a reasonable amount of time, meaning approx. within 3-4 days. I would recommend you speak directly with the owner of the property in the future and bypass the H guy. If you don't have a lease, get one to safeguard your interest. Good Luck

  • Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    15y

    I'm taking the devil's advocate on this one. You brought this all on yourself. "We negotiated-of course all verbally-because we trusted the guy!" Really? You trusted a guy you never met involving a business transaction worth thousands of dollars and your living situation?

    There are plenty of great landlords out there. There are plenty of jerks too. This guy just sounds savvy to me. You loved the home and he used that against you to get you to do all the work on your dime. Lesson learned. Now enjoy your home and get everything in writing for all agreements outside the realm of the lease.

    I certainly wouldn't deal with the idiot relative any longer and I'd paint that room with a nice dark, rich color. Attached to a paint color? Give me a break.

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