Agent is “wholesaling” property on MLS

Agent is “wholesaling” property on MLS

Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes

Wow, this one is a doozy. In all of my 10 years I have never seen anything like it.

Friday a client of mine discovered a property for sale that he has had his eye on for almost 4 years. Back then, it was listed for $300k as a short sale, and to be honest it may have worked for him at that price, although it wasn't worth it for him to go through the short sale process, only to be denied because he wanted to come in with a lowball number. Nevertheless, here we are 4 years later and it has finally run the foreclosure course and hit the market. I tried to get the lockbox code through our centralized showing system, but oddly I was directed to contact the agent. This is uncommon, but happens from time to time, so I called the agent, no answer, and then texted her. A minute later she responded with the LB code. I thanked her for the quick response, and told her my client will likely be interested so I asked her to give me a call when she had a chance. It's now listed at $225k. We spent, almost 2 hours touring the building, taking notes, discussing repairs, discussing the renovation plan etc etc. When we finished I immediately called the agent as they wanted to put an offer in. No answer. I sent another text letting her know my intentions in hopes she'd get back to me. When I got back to the office I pulled the property up on the MLS for the first time and everything appeared to be normal. At this point the only oddity we had noticed was that when it was listed on Zillow about 45 days ago at $150k, there was a price increase to $225k about 20 days later. Uncommon again, but Iv seen it before. As I start digging into the MLS and public records I find another MLS listing for the same property. In fact there were 3 total, the one from 4 years ago, the one listed for sale now, and a mysterious 3rd that was saying PENDING. My heart sunk into my stomach as I hate to find Pending listings on good opportunities, so I open it up and look around. First thing I notice is it's a carbon copy of the Active listing. The second thing I noticed was, my MLS shows the information for listing agents, and when properties go Pending or sold, they lost the buyers side agent information. I noticed the "Buyers" agent was the same agent as the "listing" agent on the New Active listing. Res flags and warning bells are going off now. I start lining up the dates. 4 days after the first listing goes Pending, the new listing is created. The seller is Hubzu, if anyone has any experience working with them, 100% chance that they do not close a deal in 4 days from execution of agreement. From this point I contact the original listing agent and inform her of what I found. Luckily she responds late on a Friday, but simply says that agent shouldn't be listing the property like that, and that she'd look into it Monday. At this point I'm pretty sure Iv solved the case. My guess is they are "wholesaling" this property, but what blew my mind was that they actually had the audacity to list it on the MLS. I sent a few more texts to the "new sellers" agent but was not able to get any answers. Later that night at 10pm I finally get a response. She replies, "it is for sale.... my partner is flipping the house....that is what you see a pending sale". Hmm. I reply "so they do actually own it then?" She replies Yes. I say that's weird, they should update the MLS, blah blah blah, and then she stops responding. Realizing what's happening I send a message to her saying my client is getting a little concerned with the shady ness of the deal, and that he's only willing to pay $150k, let me know if they'll accept that, otherwise we are just moving on." No answer. The next day I decide to research her brokerage, and broker of record. The office listed on the MLS doesn't exist. The broker of records cell phone number begins with (555). I was able to track down an 800 number that connected me to someone at charge in the office and I explained I had an interested buyer, couldn't get ahold of the agent to get answer and a seller disclosure which is required in my state, etc. He asked my to Text the address and agent info to him. He is a lot more responsive, although he isn't giving me any actual information. I continue to downplay my buyers interest, because at this point I'm going way far out of my way to track down this info, and I don't want to tip them off how interested my buyer is in this property, Incase they do not actually own it, and realize it's value and follow through with the sale. Finally, the broker or office manager responds to my text messages telling me " my buyer should probably move on to any property". I keep it cordial and inform him we kind of just want to get the story at this point, and he repsonds with "again, move on". So at this point I'm sure he got the story, and realized I'm on the them. What I'm not 100% sure of at this point is whether they actually settled or not. I'm praying that they have not, and that I can cut in and stop their attempt to flip the paper on this thing for $75k. I contact a title company because in this county they e-file title so the new owner would be recorded immediately. The title company informs me that the bank still owns the property. That's pretty much where we are now. What do I do? I NEED to stop their sale if it's still under contract. They are obviously intending on flipping it without making any repairs. My buyer intends on actually renovating and renting it out, and making the neighborhood a better place, faster, and not trying to make a quick buck. I'll admit we both dropped the ball not seeing the original listing 45 days ago. We have had our attention in 3 other deals and simply didn't have the time or resources to take on anymore. I know it's illegal to market properties on my MLS if your not the owner, my fear is that I can't stop their sale. Is the fact that attempted to flip it without owning it enough for the bank to cancel the contract with them? I am extremely scared of them actually closing on this deal, first of all it'll cost my buyer more money with zero benefit, but also now that I have basically pestered them the past 2 days, I'm afraid they either won't sell to us, or will just stand firm on a ridiculous price. Iv kept all of my communication professional, and like I said I have not indicated he'd be willing to pay much more than they paid, but if they had half a brain they'd be able to realize how high his interest is from how much we've been trying to get some answers. Anyone deal with this before? Any advice? Hoping to connect with the banks agent first thing tomorrow and lay out the facts, get them to cancel and slide in. I have a feeling it won't be that easy. All you "wholesalers" who see nothing wrong here need not reply, I don't need a debate about how many laws were broken here. To be clear, they were selling the house, not the contract. Looking forward to hearing what you veterans think.

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Real Estate Agent · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2018 · 247 posts · 247 votes
7y

I would submit a complaint against all the agents involved to your local Association of Realtors. At the very least, what they're doing sounds pretty unethical. And if they're marketing the property on the MLS without any sort of listing agreement or consent of the true owner, then they're also breaking the law. I would also report those involved to whatever your state agency is that governs real estate laws and licensing.

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  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y

    Hard to follow me?  sorry.. there is a lot going on, but its a standard "wholesale scam at its finest.  basically buyer puts foreclosure under contract.  Buyer lists property for sale, but does not own property.  Buyer then receives offers on property for more than they offered to purchase for.   Then they know to follow through with purchase with a huge payday in the backend.    If "buyer" does not receive any offers, they simply walk away, and move onto the next scam. The buyers agent told me the buyer "owned" the property.  They do not.  I just pulled up the sellers agreement.  Maybe you all can tell me if this is good enough language for the "seller" to terminate.  

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Chris C.:

    Yep. That does sound like a headache. I've had issues with hubzu before in the past and try to avoid them.

     Hubzu is not the issue.  They are the seller.  Its the buyer trying to sell a home they don't own.

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y
  • Real Estate Agent · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2018 · 247 posts · 247 votes
    7y

    @William C. the only way you’re going to stop the sale is to take all the evidence you have and report it to your state licensing division. They’re the ones who actually have the legal authority to step in with actual consequences. If the deal closes, the state can take it to court to get them to nullify the sale if it was executed under false pretenses. 

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y

    @Cason Acor I find it hard to believe We’d be able to win a court battle trying to reverse a sale. Nor will it be worth the time and money for my buyer at that point. It’d be easier to just buy it for the price the wholesaler would agree to, and chalk it up as a “cost”. But if you have seen it before or have been in this situation I am all ears. I just feel the seller (the bank) would be more likely to nullify the current contract based on the fact these buyers are clearly flipping it, and marketing it while not the owners.

    I’m basically giving live updates...which might be adding to the confusion.

    Agent for buyer just responded to my buyers latest offer. Agent for buyer replied “Thanks I received the message..please tell your buyer she declines and has full asking at this time..thanks”

    So to summarize for those confused. Buyers agent (who is also a buyer in a deal) listed a home for sale on the MLS while they were still under contract. "Wholesaling" as some would call it. She just admitted they are receiving offers on a property they don't actually own.

    A. I don’t believe for a second they have an offer for full asking.

    B. I just keep adding to the evidence of wrongdoing. It’s been established they don’t own it by a title search, and then by her broker. Yet she still admits to fielding offers.

    C. I am trying to get her to talk about it as much as I can, because every text I get is further proof of the fraud they are trying to pull.

    I'm trying to look at it from an unbiased perspective to make sure I'm not making unfair accusations. It appears it was an auction on Hubzu. And the auction has ended, and this "buyer" was the "winner". What I find to be wrong, or fraudulent, is to then immediately relist 4 days later, on the MLS for $75k more, in an attempt to line up buyers before you ever have to close. And then to lie, say you own it, and the continue to negotiate offers, even after it's been made clear by your broker that your breaking the law, is just mind boggling. If these "buyers" simply closed on the auction, THEN relisted, all the power to them. They capitalized on a market inefficiency. Problem is that's not the case. And by marketing while under contract, you can limit your exposure as an "investor" by guaranteeing a backend buyer, before ever having to close on the deal. And if you fail to find an end buyer prior to settlement, you simply back out of the deal and move on. And most likely get your deposit back because these banks never want to fight over $1000 deposit check.

    So with all that said, and all the rants above, including my OP, I hate to admit it but I can see how this may play out in the buyers favor, and they succeed in purchasing his thing only to relist the next day for $75k more. I’m hoping and praying that the way they have remarketed it, breached their contract with the seller, and the fact Iv been able to make it clear to the bank that there is another buyer, willing to pay even more, that they do the right thing, and Net the seller the most money, while allowing the buyer to buy, and cutting out the scum in the middle. We shall see. I really wish this wasn’t a house my buyer tried to buy 3 years ago as a short sale.... I also admit we both dropped the ball by missing the auction in the first place. That’s what happens when you have too many deals going on at once, you get distracted. Things slip through the cracks. The more I think this through, the more I can live with the outcome, and the more I’ll have to place the blame on my buyer and myself. But I still think wholesaling like this in general needs to stop, ESPECIALLY at the expense of Sally homeowner. It’s kinda hard to make a case this “seller” US Bank is going to suffer great losses if they don’t accept the higher offer from the real end buyer.

    It’s also why “real estate investor” is essentially a 4 letter word.

    I really do appreciate all of the input. That’s why I love this site.

    Id love to hear from a legitimate, fair, honest wholesaler to chime in and tell me what they think should be done in this situation.

  • Greg H.Pro Member
    Moderator
    Broker/Flipper · Austin, TX · Member since 2013 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y

    While this is against the MLS rules in all the Boards I have been a member of, it is doubtful this is a crime in your state or even a violation by the State RE Commission

    While the seller may have a problem with it, they will not cancel the sale.  Most likely, an email to "stop" would be the stiffest penalty

  • Greg H.Pro Member
    Moderator
    Broker/Flipper · Austin, TX · Member since 2013 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @William C.:

    @Lori Greene hoping I don’t need to go down the attorney route. I think once I bring light to the situation and the agent and the bank finds out what they are doing they’ll drop the agreement of sale. We’ll see.

     Why do you feel you can/should go the attorney route?  You are your client is hardly an "injured" party.  You have ZERO standing

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Greg H.:

    While this is against the MLS rules in all the Boards I have been a member of, it is doubtful this is a crime in your state or even a violation by the State RE Commission

    While the seller may have a problem with it, they will not cancel the sale.  Most likely, an email to "stop" would be the stiffest penalty

     -Said the wholesaler

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Greg H.:
    Originally posted by @William C.:

    @Lori Greene hoping I don’t need to go down the attorney route. I think once I bring light to the situation and the agent and the bank finds out what they are doing they’ll drop the agreement of sale. We’ll see.

     Why do you feel you can/should go the attorney route?  You are your client is hardly an "injured" party.  You have ZERO standing

    Greg yes i mentioned that above a typical knew jerk reaction IE hire an attorney.. this OP client is NOT In contract. so whats an attorney to do.  those  just default to call an attorney just are not experinced in real estate.

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Greg H.:
    Originally posted by @William C.:

    @Lori Greene hoping I don’t need to go down the attorney route. I think once I bring light to the situation and the agent and the bank finds out what they are doing they’ll drop the agreement of sale. We’ll see.

     Why do you feel you can/should go the attorney route?  You are your client is hardly an "injured" party.  You have ZERO standing

    Never said we were injured.  Never said we'd sue.  But deceived, yes.  My buyer can sue anyone for anything, doesn't mean he'll win.   Didn't I imply I wouldn't be going that route?  

    Nevertheless they explicitly breached the contract the seller makes them sign.  At least in 2 ways, maybe even more.  The seller has every right to cancel and accept our offer for $30k more.  Why wouldn't they?

    What about the message I have in writing saying they own the property?  Is that not considered fraud?   Deceit?  

    If not fraud, then what?  

    Trust me, I won't be getting an attorney involved, nor will my buyer.   He wants the property.  If your read the entire thread you'd see that I actually can see how this plays out in the scum bags favor.  But thanks for your input.  I have faith that when I speak with the sellers agent tomorrow she'll be happy to cancel their contract on 2 maybe 3 different breaches, and accept our backup offer.   

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Greg H.:
    Originally posted by @William C.:

    @Lori Greene hoping I don’t need to go down the attorney route. I think once I bring light to the situation and the agent and the bank finds out what they are doing they’ll drop the agreement of sale. We’ll see.

     Why do you feel you can/should go the attorney route?  You are your client is hardly an "injured" party.  You have ZERO standing

     As a broker....what would you do in the sellers agents position?   Sweep it under the rug, or get your seller top dollar?

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y

    This is my last post for the night, hoping I wake up to some good news, and if not we'll just move onto the next one.  

    Just shooting from the hip here, but if the "agent" is also a partner in the deal as confirmed by text messages and broker.  The state licensing commission will be compelled to step in.  It was mentioned earlier.  And as I ponder this is seems to make the most sense.  Why even have licensing requirements, if you are not going to enforce the rules.   Agents cannot lie about who owns a property, that's class number 1.  Oh I completely forgot to  call the broker out as a liar as well.  He blamed the mistake on her being a "new" agent.  I happened to look up her deal history when researching this debacle and she has sales in 2017 and 2018, albeit very few.  3 years licensed is hardly new in my book.  She knows exactly what scam she is running.

    Iv had enough. Its my mission on earth to bring all scammers, liars, and fake wholesalers down.   As well as scum bag agents who are out for a quick buck. I am putting my flag in the sand today.  I actually put it in the sand last week after listening to a Gary Vee podcast about speaking the TRUTH, even when its not in our best SHORT term interest.  As an agent and investor, my truth is going to be to expose the scum.  I happen to think this is not a coincidence this is all playing out a week later like this.  Really wish I would have written a post about it then, would have been a lot more believable.   

    Amazingly I started writing these "Truths" about real estate in my iphone in Notes....Looks like I can prove it, its dated Thursday, we discovered this property at lunch on Friday.  There is a reason this deal was brought into my life.  You all heard it hear first.

  • Flipper/Rehabber · Montgomery, NY · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    How did the selling agent (the one you contacted who claims to be the owner but is really just under contract to buy from Hubzu) have a lock box code and can give you access. Did you mention to the actual selling agent representing Hubzu/the bank that this person (their buyer) is giving access to view the property? If I was an agent, I had a house I was selling under contract and found out my buyer was holding their own showings (and not even present at them) I would be speaking to the owner and shutting this down immediately.

    I have been part of deals that were shady and should have been shut down and resold to me for more... however I learned that this doesn't always happen and the seller will most likely sell it to the current buyer in light of what is going on.

  • Greg H.Pro Member
    Moderator
    Broker/Flipper · Austin, TX · Member since 2013 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y

    @William C.

    To answer in order

    -It appears you referred to me as a wholesaler which could not be further from the truth. I am just a guy that like Jay has be at this for decades and tries to be be pragmatic 

    -Fraud and deceitful by the agent/buyer.  Probably/sure but that happens or can be interpreted every day in this business 

    -My point was that you nor your client is the injured party therefore has no standard information to bring suit. Your client had no rights to the property. At the end of the day, they should have made sure they were the high bidder 

    -Will they cancel?  I highly doubt it. Keep in mind “it ain’t personal “ to the Asset Manager and they all ready have an acceptable offer and a willing and able buyer as far as they are concerned. 

    -If you buyer is still ready to pay $30k more and wants the property, why not make the offer to the agent and just “play the game”? I get the principle of it but at the end of the day standing on principle may not get the property 

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Brian Pulaski:

    How did the selling agent (the one you contacted who claims to be the owner but is really just under contract to buy from Hubzu) have a lock box code and can give you access. Did you mention to the actual selling agent representing Hubzu/the bank that this person (their buyer) is giving access to view the property? If I was an agent, I had a house I was selling under contract and found out my buyer was holding their own showings (and not even present at them) I would be speaking to the owner and shutting this down immediately.

    I have been part of deals that were shady and should have been shut down and resold to me for more... however I learned that this doesn't always happen and the seller will most likely sell it to the current buyer in light of what is going on.

    The fake owner as I'll call her from now on, gave me the LB combo. Yes, shes giving out the sellers LB, and no, she was not present for the showing. Furthermore, she knew EXACTLY what she was doing wrong. I first called our centralized showing desk for the info and it was not in their system. Weird. The MLS read "contact agent directly". She knew it would set off a red flag if she had showing instructions in the system. Again, not a new agent making a 'mistake' This is a veteran scammer. So we spent 3 hours in the thing, my buyer has his contractors come back and go through. We run the numbers, blah blah blah. It wasn't until I got on the MLS when I discovered the scam....It's just flat out misrepresentation, Oh and it's also another breach of their contract with the bank.

    I hear you regarding the sale. I fear the worst as well. I'll do my best to put up a stink, all the way to the real estate commission if that's what it comes to. I'm hoping that if fake agent has financial interest in the deal as a partner which her broker indicated, that I'll be able to use that to bring it to a stop. Otherwise the 'buyer' which is an LLC, can claim the fake selling agent was acting without their consent...which is obviously more lies, but would be tough to prove in court. And again, this will never end up in court, at least not from my buyers or my end.

    The owner is a bank, if it were an actual person, I probably wouldn't even be on BP, Id be knocking on the door of their house and this would be an easy win for my buyer and I.  Might be hard to convince a bank to cancel the sale of a foreclosed property.  So I'm prepared for that outcome, and preparing my buyers as well.  I'm hoping the real listing agent does the right thing, acts in the real sellers best interest, acts in everyone's best interest, and cancels the contract.  Allowing them to win only perpetuates this scam.  I'm not even saying my buyer has to be the one to purchase the place.  The fake owners claim to have multiple offers, so put it back up for sale and let the market decide.  If we allow these scammers to get away with this stuff, they'll continue to do it.   There is only one way to put a stop to it, and that's put a stop to it.  I'm tempted be the first person to start running midnight infomercials. and facebook Ads telling everyone the truth about how these 'no money' down real estate gurus work.  I can't even logon to that site anymore without seeing 5 ads in my feed from the next guru with all the answers to  overnight real estate riches.  I am more passionate about putting all these scammers out of business than I am about actually selling homes.  I'll get off my soap box for now and keep everyone posted.  I am trying not to be overzealous and let the real listing agent get back to me.  I sent a 2 emails this weekend as the situation changed and new information came to light.   I am empathetic that she probably has 100 listings and this is the last thing she feels like dealing with.

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Greg H.:

    @William C.

    To answer in order

    -It appears you referred to me as a wholesaler which could not be further from the truth. I am just a guy that like Jay has be at this for decades and tries to be be pragmatic 

    -Fraud and deceitful by the agent/buyer.  Probably/sure but that happens or can be interpreted every day in this business 

    -My point was that you nor your client is the injured party therefore has no standard information to bring suit. Your client had no rights to the property. At the end of the day, they should have made sure they were the high bidder 

    -Will they cancel?  I highly doubt it. Keep in mind “it ain’t personal “ to the Asset Manager and they all ready have an acceptable offer and a willing and able buyer as far as they are concerned. 

    -If you buyer is still ready to pay $30k more and wants the property, why not make the offer to the agent and just “play the game”? I get the principle of it but at the end of the day standing on principle may not get the property 

    I understand your point of view, and appreciate the input.  I am certainly biased in the situation, and can see how it may go both ways. 

    I am not claiming my buyer had any right to the property.  Scammers need to be stopped, bottom line.  

    I disagree agents are flat out lying about ownership on a daily basis.  There is no interpretation needed.  "Do they own it?"  "Yes."  That's pretty easy to interpret.   

    We've made an offer, $30k more than they are paying.  They declined, as the have a "better offer in the table".  More lies and deceit.   Another attempt to drive up the sale price before they even own it. I refuse to allow my buyer to offer anymore at this point.  He is just giving them what they need, justification to close on the deal.  Otherwise they just cancel, come on lets not be naive, we know how this game is played.  

    And now I have to walk a tight rope making sure I don't tip them off that I'm on to their scam, so that if they do succeed they will actually work with my buyer?  I mean, I've been successful so far.  They declined my offer as of late last night, well after her broker informed her she was breaking the law, and the fake listing was removed.   So trust me, I understand the 'game'.  Seems like a pretty unfair game in my opinion. 

    So as she continues to negotiate on a property they do not own, you see nothing wrong here?

  • Real Estate Agent · Souderton, PA · Member since 2016 · 591 posts · 414 votes
    7y

    UPDATE: 

    Real agent asked me to place back up offer.  She is working to have the contract cancelled, and will move to backup offers or relist the property.  

    Still not out of the woods yet.  But is probably the best response I could have asked for.

  • Real Estate Agent · California DRE Licence #01311699 (inactive) · Member since 2017 · 5 posts · 4 votes
    7y

    Sounds to me like you're doing everything right for your client.  Isn't that supposed to be our first priority? Also, I can't agree with you more on bringing down all the scammers like these.  They are the ones making a bad name for all of us, agents & investors alike.  I really hope that the real seller's agent does the right thing & cancels the contract.  Good luck with this & Great Job standing your ground!

  • Real Estate Agent · California DRE Licence #01311699 (inactive) · Member since 2017 · 5 posts · 4 votes
    7y

    That's Great!! Good luck!

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    7y

    the reality is this is just wholesaling.. its how wholesalers operate or are taught to operate.. get something in contract . 

    then re market it like you own it.  Some states are really cracking down on this.. licensed or not.. 

    I know were i do a lot of work in Oregon.. I got a flyer from a wholesaler .. sent it to the state for their review and they opened a case on it.  So that route works.  when your selling a property as an agent you must disclose that your a principal in the transaction at least in most states I work in..  simple statement in the listing and when you do your contracts..

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    7y

    I got tired of the is this legal is this not.. also the equitable interest theory.

    this is the reply I got from the state.. this was a wholesaler sending out a flyer just like you would make

    picture of property description etc etc.   So you can see this stuff can be state specific and its up to the public

    and real estate agents to notify the state..    For me I could care less I will never buy from a wholesaler directly

    I just wanted to know.. Why I have licenses and pay my dues and do my education when others can just mimic being an 

    agent and dont have to be licensed.. why have a real estate industry at all.. either we play by the same rule book or 

    bunch the whole department of real estate and licensing etc etc.    Right ?

    "Hello Jay,

    Thank you for getting back to me. The advertising copy you attached to your email came out perfectly and will be very helpful. Thanks!

    The Agency is well aware that unlicensed “wholesalers” are rampant in our jurisdiction. Addressing the problems is like trying to put out small individual fires in a forest that is burning. The Agency’s investigations are complaint driven, so we rely heavily on the public, and our licensees to bring these individuals to our attention.

    Thank you again for the information, if I have further questions for you during the investigation I will certainly reach out.

    Best regards,

    Frances Hlawatsch | Financial Investigator

    State of Oregon - Real Estate Agency

    530 Center Street NE, Suite 100, Salem, OR 97301"

  • Real Estate Investor · FL · Member since 2011 · 586 posts · 360 votes
    7y

    As a broker, I would get rid of that agent immediately. You have every right to be frustrated and I would take the time to report the agent and the broker to your state licensing board. That being said, you have no right to cancel the sale between the bank and the wholesaler and the bank probably doesn't either. I would be really surprised if the bank cancels the deal or if they even have a right to. 

  • Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    "What do I do? I NEED to stop their sale if it's still under contract."

    -------------------------------

    Now you know why I hold real estate agents in contempt.

  • Josh C.Pro Member
    Property Manager · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    I get your upset, but perceptions change depending on which side of the transaction you are on. Had you been telling us you wholesaled in this exact manner and made 75k you’d be the BP hero of the week.

    One of the podcasts was from a more experienced wholesaler saying he puts all of his on the MLS prior to him closing. If the agents can and do close and it's a deal at 225k I know it stings, but seems like they profited on an opportunity. Like we all try to do.

    They didn’t lie to the bank saying it’s only worth 150 did they? The bank has brains. I’d take much more offense if the seller was a 85 year old widow like I see everyday. The uneducated sellers it what bothers me. Not big banks.

  • Real Estate Agent · Virginia Beach, VA · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    My broker requires I either have all owners' signatures that are currently listed on city records or provide the documentation with the listing (trust document, SPOA, etc.) that proves they have the true owner's permission to sell the property.  Perhaps the purchase agreement is sufficient documentation for that second broker to allow the new listing to proceed while the first still states Pending?   If that is allowed, then you likely don't have an argument.  A call to the regulatory agency should be able to answer that questions.    

    If it's not allowed, then I'm no attorney, no legal advice, but it seems to me the most common sense way to proceed and the best hope that the original contract is released is to write an email to the real estate board, cc'ing the original listing agent, new listing agent, both brokers, and the actual seller if you have their information, briefly explain that it appears an agent/broker is allowing their agent to list a property without the true owner's permission, against the terms of the original seller's contract (attach contract clause and pdf files of listing history supporting your claim). Explain that you have placed a genuine offer to the true owner's agent for much more than the current buyer who appears to be wholesaling the property through the MLS without permission from original seller, and you feel that transaction appears to be a blatant violation of the code and the rules of the MLS. I would imagine all licensed parties, especially the brokers, would then work very hard to ensure everyone becomes compliant as quickly as possible.
     

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