If buyer-seller can't agree on $, will agents sacrifice their %?

If buyer-seller can't agree on $, will agents sacrifice their %?

MS · Member since 2015 · 56 posts · 20 votes

Buyer gave me a low-ball offer.  Then they came up to $95k all cash, saying that's the best they could do.  OK.... Well, I said $99k was the lowest I would go, considering the buyer's agent commission % is really coming off the top, right?  That would leave me with $96k.  I've determined I could budge another $1.5k, but I need $94.5k after everything's said and done.  Period.  So that means $97.5k is the lowest offer I can accept.

Even if the buyer & seller won't budge, the buyer's agent could simply agree to a 0.5% commission, close the deal, and buyer & seller would both be happy.  But there's really a whole range of percentages that the buyer's agent could agree to that are likely NEVER considered to be on the chopping block.  If a buyer's agent could drop to 1.4% commission in this case, then the buyer would only need another $900 which seems reasonable.  Everybody would be sacrificing to make the deal work.  Does anybody ever try negotiating the agent commissions when you're within a couple percent price difference??

I've come down as far as I realistically can.  $10k below asking.  Is asking the buyer to come up $1000, and the buyer's agent to come down $1,000 too much to ask for?  I mean... really, it comes down to how invested the buyers agent actually has been.  How much work did they really do?  What is their time worth?  $35/hr for 56hours = $1,960.  Buyer coming up $1,500 to cover that and buyers agent dropping commission to 2% could save her from another 56 hours of work...

Like I said, tho... there's a whole range of variable percentages that get us all to my rock bottom price.  Can I get anymore outside the box than this?!?  I'd imagine most negotiations aren't this tight.

4Reply
660 views

Most Popular Reply

Property Manager · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
4y

If you ever need a Realtor in Baltimore then please call someone else!

See this reply in the discussion

80 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • Port Chester, NY · Member since 2016 · 210 posts · 157 votes
    4y
    Quote from @Jason V.:
    Quote from @Mike A.:

    @Jason V., you're nuts dude.  On a 100k transaction, would you work for $500 bucks before brokerage split AND taxes?

    This mindset is based on old systems, ways of thinking.  For example -- tax preparation.  H&R Block was lobbying to keep free tax prep services out of the DIRECT hands of taxpayers.  Now, you can e-file both federal and state tax returns online with multiple places for a flat rate fee of ZERO DOLLARS!

    I think the well is gonna dry up for more and more realtors in the long term. Of course there will be creative ways for hustlers to "skim" a little off the top, or even a lot off the top of their braindead clients... but things are moving more toward direct communication. The buyers agent fee is "upfront" with the listing broker, but not the buyer him/herself. The seller's phone number is not upfront with the buyer when listing on the MLS, etc. There will be platforms which remedy this problem of a buyer being able to communicate directly with the seller. Zillow/Trulia are one such example, which doesn't really with, atm, because most buyers agents don't want to negotiate their commission directly with a FSBO seller *and* their own client. I actually had ONE buyer's agent contact me before *and* after losing on MLS, wanting to negotiate toward 6% commission, because he's wasted 4 months with his clients looking for a sub-$100k home just like the one I was selling. Instead of just take his clients there, he spent half an hour chit chatting, texting, etc.... time that he'll never get back.

    And for the record, I used to do REAL work (HVAC change outs, installs) for the cheapest price, compared to anyone else in the country.  Still made enough after marketing, sales, contact negotiations, prep, etc. for like $2,000 profit shared between partner and myself.  All for 8 hrs of work, half of it dripping sweat in an attic.  Using real tools, not just words that can be automated or tweaked in an "ad lib contract".

    Being my own listing agent, working director with the broker allowed me to see things that most gone seekers never will. How buyers agents want to negotiate upwards on their commission before even considering that they'll show a property to their current... How wholesalers operate (tricky, tricky skimmers, yet I can't deny the hustle!).... How the MLS works.... Laws and whatnot.... It's worth it for everyone to DIY. In this sale, I saved $2,775 by not working with a traditional listing agent... and perhaps more importantly was the more *fluid* communication I was able to have with the buyers agent. 1 agent's ok. But 2 agents in the middle is just too much for fill in the blank H&R Block work, guys. And delays actual negotiations and understanding. Don't threaten me with a good time working for peanuts, because I only do what I love. $$ is really inconsequential in what I do.

    EDIT:  A lotta you guys remind me of the waiters, waitresses who complain that they aren't paid a minimum wage... but then a law is passed that forces restaurants to pay them a living wage, they FIGHT AGAINST IT!!  Why?  Because they make way more from the tips than half the jobs out there (at least when comparing after tax dollars, since most of them don't claim all their tips).  Very similar.

    Netting 3% on one $1,000,000 home for example is the average yearly income in Mississippi.  If I sold one of those a year, or two $500k homes even.... Then I'd be able to show EVERY client EVERY home they were interested in, and in a tight contact negotiation, I promise you I wouldn't hesitate for long and offering to knock a whole 1% off just to make a deal and move on to the next cause.  Realtors who complain about potentially negotiating they're commission simply can't be worth a flip.  If you weren't KILLING it over the past couple years as a realtor, then I promise you... You're gonna need to find a new job, because with higher interest rates, more foreclosures, less buyers, the future is really gonna put a hurting on you.


    Respectfully, I think anyone who thinks like this is living Pluto if you think anyone is going to rep a buyer's agent for a half a point is ludicrous.  Doubtful, when I was using a real estate agent they would take half a point gross.  
  • Specialist · Easton, PA · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    4y
    Quote from @Matthew Irish-Jones:

    @James Hamling lol, I guess you are not a good tipper.

    The average server salary in WNY is 14-25K per year. Anyone receiving tips is, bar tender, server, bus boy, etc… is paid a lower hourly wage and earns the majority of their income from tips.

    Cooks, chiefs, dishwashers receive higher hourly rates.

    None of this really matters. It’s a question of where you want your money to go. Some people want to give political donations, they want to feed the homeless, church, animal shelters, whatever… I prefer to give my money to hard working people trying to move up in the world. I remember being one and generous tips made a big difference.

    On the other hand I certainly agree in the inflationary environment labor for low skills has certainly gotten out of whack. I really can’t blame that on individuals that work though. Should they not be trying to make as much money as possible?

    I still respect the people that show up to work everyday as opposed to the people sitting home on the couch collecting unemployment.

     I’m with you, Matthew.  As I’ve come up in the world and have a few dollars, I prefer to tip well also as I’ve been that guy in the past. 
    I get my haircut by the same girl, every 3-4 weeks, she knows my name, knows exactly what to do. It takes her 20 mins, and I tip her $10 every time. I appreciate what she does, and I know some times she’s at work and they have no customers. 

  • Bruce WoodruffPro Member
    Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
    4y
    Quote from @Matthew Irish-Jones:


    What do you tip? Personally, I love to tip. Tips are usually involved in industries with low hourly pay. Hotel maids, waiters, bar tenders, taxi drivers, valet service, etc…. These are some of the hardest working professionals around. I’m always more than happy to leave large tips. I prefer my money to go to hard working professionals. Especially the ones that have families, are working the night shift, and still find the inner strength to smile and provide good service no matter the pressure they are under.

    Exactly. And especially since the Covid/Inflation/Recession crap we've been living through the past few years, I find myself naturally wanting to reward good behavior from those in the service industry. These folks keep everything running and with little to show for it. Usually ok pay, but no pensions or 401s

    And I believe it is now common for tips to be divvied up at the end of each shift between the wait-staff, the busboys, cooks, etc...
  • Real Estate Agent · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2017 · 814 posts · 466 votes
    4y
    Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
    Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:

    @Josue Vargas is right. Even an average agent is worth every penny. A really good one is priceless.....

     See the "average" agents where I'm at are horrible - they are average joes, that became a RE agent in 2020/2021 when houses sold themselves. I have to direct them on what to do...example...I want to know if the house ever flooded - I had to tell him to look at ALL the past disclosures from this house, look at the past disclosures of the neighboring houses. Simple stuff that you would assume they would automatically do to answer my question. 

    So simple to pull comps - lets see what sold in the same area, that's the same size and a 3/2. Simple. 

    Let's fill out some paperwork that can be downloaded from free on the RE commission website. 

    Let's try and schedule a time to show the house. I can do this myself on my own schedule as well. Only person I like is a really experienced inspector, just in case I miss something or don't know exactly what to look for. 

    I had an agent that I contacted to put an offer in on a MFH house (this was someone, at the time, I had a exclusive agreement with) - come to find out when I was making my offer he was representing another buyer for the same property! Seems unethical to me. Don't know how he can have my best interest in mind when he has another buyer and he knows what we both offered. Now did he do anything explicitly wrong...maybe not. But he told me this guy had "deep pockets" etc. Same guy advised not to make a offer on another MFH unless it was 15k over ask...the place sold for 5k under ask...I always came up with my offer price, was never advised on what to offer or what might get the house. 

    Another reason I won't sign an exclusivity contract. I have several agents that I use now AND it works so much better. They know if they bring me something good, they will get a solid offer. If they can do something for me while I'm working out of the country, they get the deal. I'm tired of most of the BS from "agents" that don't put in the time or effort to make a 4-5k commission several times a year. This is another reason I have turned to off-market properties - because using an agent has proven to be a waste of time. 

    Maybe I've just had "bad" agents in the past - but they have offered nothing to me to justify a 3% commission. I am a RE agent myself now and life is much easier, and I save money and time. 

    I would love to have a GREAT agent though, I hear about them but have yet to come across one. If I ever do, they will get every deal from me from then on out. 

    Now I am speaking for my local agents - I have met some awesome agents out of the state!

    Looks like you figured it out. Not all Agents are up to the task for investors, it is hard and very, very time consuming, but lucrative at the end IF ITS A GOOD FIT. Definitely MLS or such public sites are not the best bet for an investor. I would recommend, to anyone, to talk to an Agent/broker/lawyer that understand investing and off-market deals.

    Good luck to you.  

  • Member since 2022 · 485 posts · 216 votes
    4y
    Quote from @Jason V.:
    Quote from @Mike A.:

    @Jason V., you're nuts dude.  On a 100k transaction, would you work for $500 bucks before brokerage split AND taxes?

    This mindset is based on old systems, ways of thinking.  For example -- tax preparation.  H&R Block was lobbying to keep free tax prep services out of the DIRECT hands of taxpayers.  Now, you can e-file both federal and state tax returns online with multiple places for a flat rate fee of ZERO DOLLARS!

    I think the well is gonna dry up for more and more realtors in the long term. Of course there will be creative ways for hustlers to "skim" a little off the top, or even a lot off the top of their braindead clients... but things are moving more toward direct communication. The buyers agent fee is "upfront" with the listing broker, but not the buyer him/herself. The seller's phone number is not upfront with the buyer when listing on the MLS, etc. There will be platforms which remedy this problem of a buyer being able to communicate directly with the seller. Zillow/Trulia are one such example, which doesn't really with, atm, because most buyers agents don't want to negotiate their commission directly with a FSBO seller *and* their own client. I actually had ONE buyer's agent contact me before *and* after losing on MLS, wanting to negotiate toward 6% commission, because he's wasted 4 months with his clients looking for a sub-$100k home just like the one I was selling. Instead of just take his clients there, he spent half an hour chit chatting, texting, etc.... time that he'll never get back.

    And for the record, I used to do REAL work (HVAC change outs, installs) for the cheapest price, compared to anyone else in the country.  Still made enough after marketing, sales, contact negotiations, prep, etc. for like $2,000 profit shared between partner and myself.  All for 8 hrs of work, half of it dripping sweat in an attic.  Using real tools, not just words that can be automated or tweaked in an "ad lib contract".

    Being my own listing agent, working director with the broker allowed me to see things that most gone seekers never will. How buyers agents want to negotiate upwards on their commission before even considering that they'll show a property to their current... How wholesalers operate (tricky, tricky skimmers, yet I can't deny the hustle!).... How the MLS works.... Laws and whatnot.... It's worth it for everyone to DIY. In this sale, I saved $2,775 by not working with a traditional listing agent... and perhaps more importantly was the more *fluid* communication I was able to have with the buyers agent. 1 agent's ok. But 2 agents in the middle is just too much for fill in the blank H&R Block work, guys. And delays actual negotiations and understanding. Don't threaten me with a good time working for peanuts, because I only do what I love. $$ is really inconsequential in what I do.

    EDIT:  A lotta you guys remind me of the waiters, waitresses who complain that they aren't paid a minimum wage... but then a law is passed that forces restaurants to pay them a living wage, they FIGHT AGAINST IT!!  Why?  Because they make way more from the tips than half the jobs out there (at least when comparing after tax dollars, since most of them don't claim all their tips).  Very similar.

    Netting 3% on one $1,000,000 home for example is the average yearly income in Mississippi.  If I sold one of those a year, or two $500k homes even.... Then I'd be able to show EVERY client EVERY home they were interested in, and in a tight contact negotiation, I promise you I wouldn't hesitate for long and offering to knock a whole 1% off just to make a deal and move on to the next cause.  Realtors who complain about potentially negotiating they're commission simply can't be worth a flip.  If you weren't KILLING it over the past couple years as a realtor, then I promise you... You're gonna need to find a new job, because with higher interest rates, more foreclosures, less buyers, the future is really gonna put a hurting on you.\

    Cyclical down turns have always forced out poor performers in any industry.  I’m not going to comment on the house but more general market comments. 

    You talk about the $3k saved but do you not value your own time? I grew up around real estate/title (family business) I've been investing since 25 and even my first home build (forever home until retirement home) we bought and settled same week I paid for a wedding. Why? Because we were in early, 8 months from purchase agreement to settlement - house appraised $75k higher than purchase price. The good buy was worth stress. I say all that to say I could very easily not use an agent, have access to MLS. I use an agent because it saves me my time. THat's true on all purchases. but last one turned out to be bank owned and was complex. The agent saved me a lot of headaches there.

    Industry is moving more digital, more open ended but it just means good advice will be more important because ti will move faster. 

    Anyway on an easy transaction sure agent might not be worth much. On a complex one? You’ll be happy. Finally, an agent that knows their market and has relationships is worth gold - such as getting a home before it lists on market etc… 

    Anyway ultimately I value my time. I have a day job. I don’t want or need a second job. 


Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.