Potential renter has a pit bull. Am I liable?

Investor · Cottage Grove, MN · Member since 2015 · 8 posts · 1 vote

I have a dilema. A potential renter has a pit bull and I'm a little nervous. What is my liability if I allow pets, and her dog bites someone? The unique thing is she is a Sheriff's deputy and has better credit than I'm used to receiving in this part of town. I'd really like to accept her, but the dog has me wondering.

Anyone dealt with this breed?

0 Reply

169 views

Most Popular Reply

Michael McDevitt

full-time CPA & part-time RE Investor · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2016 · 102 posts · 46 votes

10y

The breed isn't the problem, It is jerky owners who make their dogs vicious. I highly doubt a deputy is that kind of dog owner. As long as your insurance company has no problem, she should be a good tenant. Of course, the dog may still damage your property (pet urine, chewing, etc). make sure you get a large enough deposit!

5 Reply

See this reply in the discussion

33 Replies

Jump to latestLatest

Sort by

Evelyn Roper
Investor · Oklahoma City, OK · Member since 2016 · 98 posts · 51 votes
10y
Check with your insurance company as many will deny coverage if you have pit bulls. I believe that if the dog bites someone on your property you could be held liable.
2 Reply
Account Closed
Rental Property Investor · Portland, OR · Member since 2015 · 338 posts · 332 votes
10y
She's a sheriff's deputy? This is likely one of the most responsible pet owners/tenants you will ever have.
It's hard feeling like the lone voice on BP advocating for these sweet dogs. Can they bite? Yes. But so can any dog.
This was JUST written about in another thread.
https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/52/topics/353338-insurance-options-for-duplex-with-a-tenant-who-has-a-pitbull
4 Reply
Troy Longtine
OP
Investor · Cottage Grove, MN · Member since 2015 · 8 posts · 1 vote
10y
Thans for the replies. I read the other thread and I do have State Farm. I'll still give the agent a call to discuss. She sounds like she could be a great tenant, so I hope I'm covered. Renters insurance for her is also a good idea.
0 Reply
Michael McDevitt
full-time CPA & part-time RE Investor · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2016 · 102 posts · 46 votes
10y
The breed isn't the problem, It is jerky owners who make their dogs vicious. I highly doubt a deputy is that kind of dog owner. As long as your insurance company has no problem, she should be a good tenant. Of course, the dog may still damage your property (pet urine, chewing, etc). make sure you get a large enough deposit!
5 Reply
Vic French
Real Estate Investor · Petaluma, CA · Member since 2016 · 60 posts · 27 votes
10y
I would advocate checking with your insurance company about liability coverage. Get an umbrella policy. Beware, these days insurance companies can cancel you after a big claim. Stay protected at all costs, do your due diligence and trust your gut.
1 Reply
Tim Kersting
Hayward, CA · Member since 2015 · 21 posts · 11 votes
10y
to reiterate @Account Closed sentiments.
I live in an area where a lot of people have pit bulls, I also have one. Unfortuantely, people often get these dogs because they 'look' tough and train them to be tough. This overshadows their true nature which is to be part of a pack.
Pit bulls (like any other dog) will protect its pack (family) when it feels there is a threat, however, proper training will keep them from unexpectedly turning on someone...no matter what the media would have us believe. Training will tell it what IS a threat and what is not.
My pit bull is one of the best dogs that I have had the privilege of being owned by. I have 8 or 9 nieces and nephews that crawl on him, pull his tail and ears, and he doesn't even flinch at them because he has been trained right. I trust him with young children as well as adults he just met even when I'm not around because of his training.
Now getting off my high-horse...I agree the insurance broker should be consulted and if it was me, I would want to meet the dog and see what kind of training its had as well as its temperament. Because just because someone has a job that requires responsibility doesn't mean they are a responsible person.
Just my 2 cents...
4 Reply
Arlen Chou
Investor · Los Altos, CA · Member since 2014 · 942 posts · 1k+ votes
10y
@Troy Longtine as @Evelyn Roper stated many insurance companies will not cover you, so this is the first question you need to address. If they say they will then the next thing you should do is step away from the personal aspect of the decision and base it on business. Is this property a SFR or a multi? If it is a multi, then your answer should be no. It is not based upon the individual dog or tenant, but the precedence you set for other existing and future tenants. Don't spiral down the path of making exceptions for individuals. Set your rules and always follow them. It will keep you from potentially getting into a lawsuit at a later date. This may sound heartless and cold, but you have a business to protect. If you accept this tenant and this dog, you will be creating a situation where every "dangerous breed" dog should then legally be acceptable in your building. I personally allow dogs in my buildings but they must be under a certain weight and cannot be a "dangerous breed" as defined by ANY list found in publication. I also charge more rent and require a higher deposit. I am sure that there are plenty of really nice and sweet pit bulls. However, I am not willing to risk getting into a lawsuit to go against perception.
Good luck to you and let us know what you decide.
-Arlen
1 Reply
Stephanie MedellinBusiness Member
Mortgage Broker · CA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 642 votes
10y
State Farm, at least in NY, does not discriminate against certain breeds.
Responsible owners generally have responsible dogs. Any type of dog can bite a person. I really don't believe these dogs are any more likely to bite than any other type of breed. They used to be known as nanny dogs because they are generally very good with small children.
You can also require the tenant get a renters policy with extra liability.
I should add that I have an English Staffordshire Bull Terrier (the proper name of the breed for my specific dog). She was a stray off the streets of south LA, but she is one of the sweetest dogs I've ever met and loves people and children, even those she has just met. So I am a bit biased and hate all of the breed discrimination. Any large dog can be dangerous. I've been bitten by an unfriendly dog in someone's home and it wasn't a "pit bull."
[email protected]
Stephanie Medellin, Loan Factory58 Reviews
Website View Page
3 Reply
Account Closed
Investor · Singapore · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 3k+ votes
10y
So many assumptions. Pitbulls bad, Pitbulls good, Sheriffs deputy good etc. The truth is that insurance companies that are in the business of statistical risk assessment refuse to insure them. I am a dog owner and very fond of dogs but if I am out walking my dogs and see a pit bull or mix, I cross the road!
2 Reply
Account Closed
Rental Property Investor · Portland, OR · Member since 2015 · 338 posts · 332 votes
10y
Funny you comment on other people's assumptions, but in the very same post, you admit that you make assumptions about an individual based on the group she belongs to and cross the street when you see her.
The OPs question was about liability, which is addressed via insurance. It was not about how to screen applicants or do due diligence or follow landlord tenant law. There are already many threads on these topics and if the OP wanted that info, he would have asked.
Just because some landlords are afraid of certain breeds and refuse to rent to them doesn't mean doing the same is the best decision for other landlords.
Screen human. Screen dog. Security deposit. Property insurance. Umbrella policy. Renter's insurance. I require all these things anyway, even for people without dogs, except the "screen dog" part.
Happy to share how I screen dogs if you're interested.
0 Reply
Max T.
Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
10y
Charge extra rent if you choose to accept the dog.
0 Reply
Account Closed
Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
10y
The question of
What is my liability if I allow pets, and her dog bites someone?
If the plaintiff's attorney could show you had a dangerous condition on the property and that you failed to notify the other tenants, as well as failed to correct the problem, you would be liable.
Landlords have a duty to inform and protect tenants from unsafe conditions. If someone on your property gets hurt, then obviously you have an unsafe condition. Did the landlord know about? Maybe they did or maybe they didn't, but I personally would not want the courts to deciding what I knew at the time of an incident. Like they say, "If the money is there, you got to share". I doubt the dog owner will have any money to pay for the damages.
Furthermore there is a chance you insurance would not even cover landlord's claim simply by proving they had failed to perform their duties.
I buy real estate to make money, and if a deal carries unnecessary risk I pass.
1 Reply
Stephen E.
St Thomas, Ontario · Member since 2013 · 575 posts · 408 votes
10y
@Troy Longtine Your question is are you liable. The answer is yes. If the tenant's dog causes severe bite injuries to a passer by the bitten individual is going to get a lawyer and the lawyer is going to sue the people with money. You as a landlord are perceived as a person with money, much more so than a sheriff's deputy tenant whose pet dog happens to be a pitbull. Therefore you will be sued, and this is why insurance companies that cover landlords and so take on the landlord's liabilities often will not write an insurance policy if you allow pitbulls onto your property. As @Account Closed said above, this is not personal for the insurance companies, it is a statistical calculation based on the data. These "sweet dogs" are capable of inflicting horrific injuries and they have a very unpredictable temperament. That is why the province of Ontario banned them outright on public safety grounds some years ago. There are lots of tenants out there that do not have pets that present these kinds of concerns. Why on earth would you allow one in that does? The idea in this business is to make money, not lose it. This tenant can't pay you enough rent to come anywhere near justifying you taking on this risk.
2 Reply
Account Closed
Rental Property Investor · Portland, OR · Member since 2015 · 338 posts · 332 votes
10y
Robert's comments apply to any dog, not just "pit bulls." There are landlords who won't rent to pet owners because they worry about damage or liability.
I guess it depends on your area, but around here, most people have pets. And most pet owners, not all, are responsible. Just as most parents, but not all. Personally, I'd much rather rent to a responsible dog owner who's grateful to live someplace that accepts her dog and who pays a premium for the privilege, and who makes sure to leave the unit in excellent condition so she can get a much needed reference on her next place, than to a permissive parent whose kids draw on walls and spill nail polish on hardwoods.
Stephen E. has used anti "pit bull" language in this and other threads and seems to make it his personal mission to scare as many landlords as possible into banning the breed, just as his misguided province of Ontario has done. Maybe it's personal for him, I don't know.
Ultimately it's your choice, but at least inform yourself. People can sue all they want, but if the renter's insurance covers the dog (make sure it does; mine did when I was a renter) and if the landlord's insurance covers it, and especially if you have an umbrella policy (which should a given), you're at no more risk than if you accept any other dog. That's what insurance is for.
Screen the person, not their race. Screen the dog, not its breed.
0 Reply
Stephen E.
St Thomas, Ontario · Member since 2013 · 575 posts · 408 votes
10y
Originally posted by @Account Closed:

Stephen E. has used anti "pit bull" language in this and other threads and seems to make it his personal mission to scare as many landlords as possible into banning the breed, just as his misguided province of Ontario has done. Maybe it's personal for him, I don't know.
Actually I can't recall having posted on pitbulls before but if I have and I said they were too much of a risk for landlords then that would be my view. Its not personal, its a business decision and its driven by risk. The province of Ontario is by and large seen as a pretty well governed place. The legislature has not decided to ban any other dogs, just pitbulls. Why could this be?
1 Reply
Account Closed
Rental Property Investor · Portland, OR · Member since 2015 · 338 posts · 332 votes
10y
I'm not getting into a back and forth about the merits of lack thereof of breed specific legislation. Ontario is not the only place, but if you look for stories about how BSL has destroyed families and stolen then euthanized children's best friends, you will find many.
In fact, most of us will find what we're looking for. The media is very good at scare tactics and horrific stories because capitalising on fear is an effective sales tactic.
I rent to good people with good dogs because when done right, it's good business. Too many family pets are euthanized after being relinquished to shelters when they can't find a place to live.
0 Reply
Gail K.
Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
10y
Frankly, it is understandable why the OP would be concerned over a tenant with this breed of dog. A landlord may very likely ask the question of any potential tenant with any large breed of dog that may, from news reports, be untrustworthy (and I write this as a previous owner of a Boxer, a Dogo and a current Pit mix, all rescues as well as previous rescued retired greyhounds).
Perhaps the OP might have some of his concerns answered if he could meet the dog prior to continuing with the application. This might help him judge the temperament of the dog.
Providing fencing (privacy fencing would be useful) in the rental unit might also increase the sense of security.
Everyone thinks their pet is the "sweetest" animal around; even those testifying in court after their sweet pet has attacked another dog or human. This is pretty common.
Gail
0 Reply
Tim Kersting
Hayward, CA · Member since 2015 · 21 posts · 11 votes
10y
Originally posted by @Gail K.:

...all rescues as well as previous rescued retired greyhounds).
Everyone thinks their pet is the "sweetest" animal around; even those testifying in court after their sweet pet has attacked another dog or human. This is pretty common.
Gail
I used to have a retired/rescued greyhound. ...awesome dog, I miss him.
Funny how passionate we get about our furry friends. This thread heated up!! Lol
We do tend to only see our family dogs good traits...I very much agree with that.
The fact is, regardless of how biased we may be one way or the other...dog vs. no dog, pot bulls vs. "other breeds"...it IS a business decision and a liability that each person involved has to be comfortable with. some may believe it is in their best interest to allow pets. Some only allow pets of a certain type or up to a certain size. Some don't allow them at all.
At the end of the day, our comfort level determines our decisions and we justify those decisions with logic.
0 Reply
Matt Geerts
Investor · St. Thomas, Ontario · Member since 2015 · 692 posts · 312 votes
10y
Yes, all dogs bite. Yorkshire terriers have never killed a person.
Pit bulls were responsible for 64% of fatalities. The runner-up was Rottweilers at 9%.
Show me a good pit bull and I'll love it and wrestle and play with it. The fact is, they kill people. A lot more people than any other, or in fact all other breeds combined.
With that said, if an applicant has a Yorkie he can move on to the next landlord. No pet deposit in Ontario means no pets in my houses.
0 Reply
Derek Lacy
Insurance Agent · Maitland, FL · Member since 2015 · 397 posts · 244 votes
10y
Pit bulls kill an American every 17 days on average. They account for 82% of dog bite fatalities. Since 2008 half the fatalities are the owner. Dogsbite.org. State Farm wishes they could roll back the no breed list, at this point they have to charge 20% higher for liability because of their increased dog bite claims. It is projected to be 50% by 2030. But as we say in Indiana, it's a bit like closing the barn door after the horses left. If you move forward in renting, charge enough rent so that when your premium goes up 3-4 times after a dog bite claim you still are in the black.
2 Reply
Bob CollettPro Member
Property Manager · Brecksville, OH · Member since 2014 · 486 posts · 464 votes
10y
As suggested, ask your insurance company, and require renter's insurance. Foremost lists specific breeds that are excluded. Also check with the neighbors... if the neighbors have a problem with the breed, then you will have a problem. This based on real life experience... police calls... complaints to building department... etc., etc.
Good luck.
0 Reply
Troy Longtine
OP
Investor · Cottage Grove, MN · Member since 2015 · 8 posts · 1 vote
10y
Wow!. I don't know that I've had a post on any forum draw so much quick response. Thanks for all the replies. I'm going to check with my insurance agent today.
0 Reply
Brandt Smith
Cypress, TX · Member since 2016 · 132 posts · 49 votes
10y
@Troy Longtine lots of responses based on "pit bulls aren't a bad breed, the owners are the problem" mindset. That is great and probably true. Setting that aside, I won't allow pit bulls for these reasons:
- Insurance companies may not cover you.
- You can be sued if the animal attacks. It is harder to defend if it is considered a "dangerous" breed.
- Pit bull owner tend to be a problem. Some are great but a lot of people are drawn to pit bulls because they are such effective fighters / guard dogs, not because they are great loyal dogs. You don't want that type.
- You can't say yes to this tenant but no to another. That is setting yourself up to be discrimitory.
0 Reply
Stephanie MedellinBusiness Member
Mortgage Broker · CA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 642 votes
10y
"Pit bulls" are not even a real breed of dog.
[email protected]
Stephanie Medellin, Loan Factory58 Reviews
Website View Page
0 Reply
Account Closed
Investor · Singapore · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 3k+ votes
10y
Originally posted by @Account Closed:

Funny you comment on other people's assumptions, but in the very same post, you admit that you make assumptions about an individual based on the group she belongs to and cross the street when you see her.
I am making the same statistical risk adjustment that the insurance companies do. I have no idea if that particular dog and owner are good bad or indifferent. Why should I expose my dogs to the risk unnecessarily? BTW, I have had a dog almost attacked by a pitbull. One got out somehow and charged towards us and our dog. I stepped in front of my dog and kicked out and yelled at the pitbull to make him retreat. It could have ended very badly for my dog. So yes, I will cross the road and not feel bad about it one bit.
0 Reply

Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.