Opinion: Do we need a dishwasher?

Opinion: Do we need a dishwasher?

Johnson City, TX · Member since 2017 · 59 posts · 135 votes

My husband and I begin construction this weekend on what we have termed "little houses" in Kyle, TX. They are one bedroom, one bathroom, 450 sq ft SFH for rental investments.

We're at the point where we're wondering if a dishwasher would be necessary in these homes. 

Upon researching, we suspect that our homes will be most attractive to students, single professionals, young couples or retired folks.

The lack of one would mean one less thing to purchase and install initially as well as one less thing to have to fix down the road. 

Personally we both agree that if we were part of the above category we would not miss one. But we are a family of four and I run the dishwasher daily. 

We're going for a high end look. Stainless steel appliances, granite counter tops, etc. Nice, clean and modern.

What are y'alls thoughts?

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Mindy JensenPro Member
BiggerPockets Money Podcast Host · Longmont, CO · Member since 2014 · 7k+ posts · 10k+ votes
9y

@Molly Morlino , I don't consider myself to be high maintenance in any way, but the only apartment I ever rented had a single sink and no dishwasher and I hated washing dishes in that apartment and resented that it didn't have a double sink or a dishwasher. Not something I looked at or even considered before I moved in, but I specifically did not renew my lease because of it and put a dishwasher on the top of my MUST-HAVE list when I bought my first place a few months later.

I had just graduated from college at that time. If space and cost isn't an issue, I'd put one in.

Although I don't know you'll find many $400 stainless steel dishwashers. I thought they were more than that. 

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  • Colleen F.Pro Member
    Investor · Narragansett, RI · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    9y
    Its higher end to have them and if you go for a 24 inch they cost similiar to a cabinet. An 18 inch is more expensive and the drawer ones hard to fix with the special cabinet base driving up the cost. I have people who like them and those who are fine without them. what does the competition have? They are more water efficient if you use them. if it works in the layout why Not? if you don't do dishwashers do a double sink.
  • Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    nice upgrade, renters will love it, 

  • Johnson City, TX · Member since 2017 · 59 posts · 135 votes
    9y

    While it is a small kitchen it's not necessarily a space issue... There's plenty of cabinet space.  It's also not a cost issue... I recently purchased a Whirlpool for my home that I love and it was $400.

    Side note:  We're going for a 30" single sink

    I guess my real question is... Will it be necessary at all?  Will it be used?  I suppose if it's not used it won't ever break, LOL

    That's a great point regarding the water efficiency... I didn't think about that.  We are paying the water bill so that is something to consider.

    I really appreciate the responses - thanks!

  • Mindy JensenPro Member
    BiggerPockets Money Podcast Host · Longmont, CO · Member since 2014 · 7k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    9y

    @Molly Morlino , I don't consider myself to be high maintenance in any way, but the only apartment I ever rented had a single sink and no dishwasher and I hated washing dishes in that apartment and resented that it didn't have a double sink or a dishwasher. Not something I looked at or even considered before I moved in, but I specifically did not renew my lease because of it and put a dishwasher on the top of my MUST-HAVE list when I bought my first place a few months later.

    I had just graduated from college at that time. If space and cost isn't an issue, I'd put one in.

    Although I don't know you'll find many $400 stainless steel dishwashers. I thought they were more than that. 

  • Johnson City, TX · Member since 2017 · 59 posts · 135 votes
    9y

    @Mindy Jensen - Thank you for your experience!!!  Seriously, so helpful.  Lowes has "my" dishwasher that I bought maybe 4 months ago for $429 right now (I paid $398).  We expect to purchase them at the end of May = Memorial Day = Sales.  Not worried :-)  It's very quiet!  I love it!

  • Natalie KolodijBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Tax Strategist| National Tax Educator| Accepting New Clients · Member since 2014 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    9y

    I would HATE not having a dishwasher. 

    I would say pinpoint your market a little better...in college I rarely cooked. It was lots of frozen foods, take out, ect....so really only plates now and then to wash which wasn't bad. 

    IF you forego the dishwasher I'd say make sure the sink is 2 sided and has a garbage disposal in one side. And maybe if you set up the counter to accommodate/have a built in drying rack.....it might be more appealing? Think Hipster saving water chic. 

  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    9y

    I have never done a "Tiny" house - our smallest SFH is about 850SF - but I would not do a house without a dishwasher. It is a ridiculously cheap upgrade, considering that it takes the place of a cabinet. If you walked around on the street and asked 100 people if they'd rather have a 24 (or 18) inch cabinet or a dishwasher, I guarantee 95 of them would say Dishwasher.

    Skyline Properties
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  • Architect · Papillion, NE · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 840 votes
    9y

    @Molly Morlino

    I vote... dishwasher!  If it is there; it will get used.   You really need a 2-bowl sink for washing dishes.  One to wash and the other to rinse.   A dishwasher seems to be the common requirement now days.  I personally hate washing dishes.  When I bought my house the first thing I did was install a dishwasher before I moved in.  $300 and 8 years later it still running and I only have 11 linear feet of cabinets.

    I would stay with a standard 24" wide unit for easier replacement.  Narrow or 18" wide ones are hard to find and could cost more.  I am a fan of black over stainless steel.  White is a no go for me.

  • Johnson City, TX · Member since 2017 · 59 posts · 135 votes
    9y

    Love all of the responses... Thank you everyone!  This really helped!

  • Investor · PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 602 votes
    9y

    I avoid dishes altogether by using paper plates and bowls and plastic utensils. I find that handwashing pots and pans is usually a requirement either way because a dishwasher doesn't clean them well enough.

  • Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    I managed a 120 unit building,, mostly 1brs and studios.  biggest turn off was " NO DISHWASHER" to prospective tenants,, 

    Second was single bowl sinks,, the studio's had that and it was like a dirty dish "HOLDING CELL"

  • Rental Property Investor · Katy, TX · Member since 2015 · 175 posts · 111 votes
    9y

    I have some tenant that wont use the dishwasher. It all depends on the demographics. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Red Bank, NJ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    Wow- you guys have completely changed my thinking on this. Adjustments are being made!

  • Johnson City, TX · Member since 2017 · 59 posts · 135 votes
    9y

    @Patrick M. - They've changed my mind, too!  We were totally leaning towards no dishwasher and were pretty confident in our decision.  I'm so glad I posted here and asked!

    @Deanna McCormick - A two bowl sink *and* a dishwasher, correct?

  • San Diego, CA · Member since 2015 · 273 posts · 226 votes
    9y

    we just rehabbed 4 units and went from a double sink w/o dishwasher to a single sink with dishwasher. The single sink is fine with a dishwasher, in my opinion. 

    Around here adding a dishwasher increases rent ~$70 per month. Generally, the people I know who rent expect cheaper rent if there's no dishwasher or just won't rent a place without a dishwasher. 

    I'd vote single sink and dishwasher to maximize space and utility. 

    We also got the stainless whirlpools for $400 (stainless interior as well). Gotta love appliance sales!

  • Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    9y

    Every able bodied person comes with a dishwasher at the end of each arm. I recently purchased one of these new high-end machines for an ungodly amount. First time using it, I select "Normal" cycle and the timer reads 3.5 HOURS. THREE AND A HALF HOURS to wash some friggin dishes! Express is 60 minutes. I was thinking express would be like 15 minutes and normal maybe 30-45 minutes. 

    Sorry, not sure what you should do. Just wanted to vent a bit about how ripped off I feel buying this ridiculous machine.

  • Rental Property Investor · Red Bank, NJ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Aaron Mazzrillo that was always my thinking, but as I started reading into it as this discussion progressed it would seem that there may actually be a water saving. My tenants pay electricity- but I pay water and it is a fortune in my town.

    We are going to sit down and try an rework our plans to incorporate them.

  • Real Estate Agent · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    450 sq ft?  OH MY.  I think you will need the storage space more.  If the washier is 2x2.5 ft, it would be 1% of the apartment.  Unless this this an A neighborhood and it would lower the rent not to have it, I would pass.  I have dishwashers in my family size units.  A few years ago, i was putting washers and dryers in the better units.  The smaller and desirable neighborhoods, I don't include either. 

  • Investor · Simpsonville, SC · Member since 2016 · 135 posts · 73 votes
    9y

    Ideal 1: Dishwasher and double sink even in a small space.  You can always have a cutting board that fits over the sink to extend prep space.  Options are good and these amenities keep good tenants for longer ... I have much less turnover in these units.

    Second choice: Dishwasher and single sink

    Third choice: double sink only

    Last choice: single sink only

    Best of luck!

    Amy

  • Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    If possible a double sink is preferred by anyone using a kitchen. 

    If possible and you have enough counter area to permit a double bowl I'd say its a WIN

    But for sure I'd put in dishwasher if you can.

    Why double sink,, what do you have in your house,, would your kitchen be as useful if it had a single bowl.. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Orlando, FL · Member since 2016 · 463 posts · 220 votes
    9y

    If part of your target demographic is young professionals, definitely put in a dishwasher! They tend to work long hours and will use it vs. having to hand-wash dishes. Plus, this generation pretty much expects such amenities as standard. 

    I am just finishing a rehab and put in a new dishwasher because of those reasons. Higher-end tenants expect them, and higher-end rentals have them.

  • Rental Property Investor · Red Bank, NJ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    Just purchased ours today after reconfiguring our plan for the cabinets. One will have to be an 18" but it works with the one bedroom. Thanks @Molly Morlino for starting the thread and to the others for your input.

  • Johnson City, TX · Member since 2017 · 59 posts · 135 votes
    9y

    We went to a refurbished/scratch/dent store today and I bought two brand new dishwashers (no scratches, no dents, still plastic on them) for $350 and $400 - One is a Whirlpool that I have in my home and love and the other is a Kitchen Aid (which I never would have bought retail).  Also picked up two very nice counter depth refrigerators and a stove.  Very pleased with the purchase!  I saved 50% over the entire purchase.  If you're in the Austin, TX area check out Affordable Appliances Plus.

  • Rental Property Investor · Douglas County, MO · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Deanna McCormick:

    If possible a double sink is preferred by anyone using a kitchen. 

    If possible and you have enough counter area to permit a double bowl I'd say its a WIN

    But for sure I'd put in dishwasher if you can.

    Why double sink,, what do you have in your house,, would your kitchen be as useful if it had a single bowl.. 

    Anyone using a kitchen? Hardly.  I put a deep single bowl sink in my own home and I wouldn't want anything else. Double bowl sinks are not big enough for the pots I use, so my kitchen would not be nearly as useful if it didn't have a single bowl.

  • Deerwood, MN · Member since 2014 · 184 posts · 122 votes
    9y

    Why, if you are building, wouldn't you have separate water meters and let tenants pay the water bill. Seems like a bigger issue to me if water is expensive.

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