Reasonable fees for cleaning and smoke cigarette smoke damage

Reasonable fees for cleaning and smoke cigarette smoke damage

Member since 2019 · 3 posts · 0 votes

I am new to this. I purchased a home that had a small cottage on the parcel that had a tenant in it. We decided to keep it as a rental and let her stay. We formed a new rental agreement and had her sign. We also were nice and dropped her rent $50 a month.That was March 2015  She soon after started paying rent late, like between the 5th and the 15th,and we let that slide, even though the new agreement says we can charge 5% every day it is late past the 1st. 

Then August 2018 she only paid $200 with a note that she was short but would catch up soon. Same in September. In October she paid rent and an extra $100 towards back rent. I told her I was ok if she paid a little on it each month. She never did pay any more extra towards back rent. Then Feb. 5th she stopped me in the driveway to say she was giving her notice. Later in the month I asked her for and exact move out date and she said she didn’t know, could be 2 weeks, could be 2 years. On March 5th when she hadn’t paid rent or back rent I posted a 72 hr notice on her door. We have since had conversations where she has told me I can “ keep her deposit to cover the back rent and she will pay me the balance or Marchs rent on the 30th when she moves out. I asked her what about the damages and cleaning fees for smoking in the rental when it’s stated and she signed acknowledging she is not to smoke in the property. She claims she will clean it and there are no damages and she wants money for what she referred to as “sweat equity” that she put into making a garden in the yard with raised beds that she has since ripped out and left holes in the yard or mounds of dirt. My questions are. 1 what is reasonable to charge for damage from cigarette smoke, and do I have to take her word that she has done the cleaning of it appropriately or not. Can I now tack on the late fee she should’ve been charged. 

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  • Rental Property Investor · Corvallis, OR · Member since 2018 · 840 posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Julie Doran The ship sailed on past late fees, and you should have definitely not been as forgiving as you were. I would not trust anything this tenant says based on your post here. I would also keep any and all security deposit towards back rent and damages. Smoke smell does not get covered well with just paint from my experience. I had to use shellac once and bought a mask and eye protection as its pretty smelly stuff. In the future, post for every violation, every time. I have paid the price many times for being too nice, trust me.

  • Mindy JensenPro Member
    BiggerPockets Money Podcast Host · Longmont, CO · Member since 2014 · 7k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    7y

    @Julie Doran , I agree with Todd about the late fees. I'll go further and say you need to start the eviction process now, because you're never getting the back rent. This tenant has proven to you that she will not pay your rent on time, or even in full for the last 8 months.

    Get an attorney involved. One who has experience in evictions, and once the attorney is involved, follow their advice.

    Be warned that she may destroy your property, so if you have pictures or videos of the condition of the home when you purchased it, give those to the attorney as well.

  • Member since 2019 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    7y

    I am definietly keeping the deposit for owed rent but that only covers part of it and leaves nothing for painting or cleaning the cigarette damage. I am being told the process to take care of it is scrubbing all walls and surfaces including appliances with a specific cleaner for this purpose, then to treat the walls with a product like killz and then a couple layers of paint. Then there’s also holes in the walls. I have definitely learned my lesson about being too nice! Have you ever filed a small claims against a tenant? Were you successful in recovering anything in Oregon?

  • Member since 2019 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    7y

    I was able to obtain the move in condition check list from the property management company that originally rented to her. It is in her own writing and words the condition of the property.

  • Investor · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2016 · 41 posts · 12 votes
    7y

    I am curious about the costs aspect. We got an estimate of around $11K in damages for an apartment occupied by a heavy smoker. Around $7500 was for damages done to a small kitchen put in a few years ago (water damages to lower cabinets and uppers coated with a film from smoking mixed with grease from cooking).   

    The $3500 remainder in remediation is for: 

    1. Cleanings of walls, ceilings, windows, window frames, registers/vents, installed microwave with exhaust fan and light fixtures.  

    2. Treating and then sealing walls and ceiling.  

    3. Replacing all trim 

    4. Sealing wall around vents 

    4. Replacing the newer light fixtures and window blinds. 

    5. Sealing smoke smell within wood shelving for three clothes closets, linen closet and storage closet. Linen and storage closet had custom shelving. 

    6. We will be replacing the three ceiling fans - I assume the cost to replace all the fan blades would be about the same as just remove and replace the whole fixture since we are not doing this work ourselves. 

    7. Replacing all outlet covers and switch plates for areas previously upgraded/repaired. 

    This was an in-place tenant that stayed on with us for several years. We are not charging for damages items that are normal wear and tear items such as paint, carpet and very old window blinds. We are not charging for damages done to very old light fixtures and fans since we would have replaced them despite the smoke damages. 

    Does $3500 seem like an appropriate cost for this? It seems about right to me, but curious how the Judge will react to this amount. 

    Vent cleaning was not included in the estimate, we will be using another provider for that. 

  • Investor · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2016 · 41 posts · 12 votes
    7y

    @Julie Doran We have the tenants original lease also. In that lease it specifically mentions tenant is responsible for cigarette smoke damage ours has a general damage clause. I'm curious how being the 'new owner' effect if we can hold tenant responsible for damage prior to the sale. Most of the damage does appear to be after the sale, so that's our focus. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    7y

    @Julie Doran this is a giant mess. I recommend you hire a property manager because you have no business self managing. Being fair or giving some slack on paying rent on time is okay, but this is absurd.

    You’ll never get any money for the smoking damage, you’ll never get that back rent and the deposit won’t cover it. You’ll likely be out of thousands in rent and cleaning/repairs when it’s all said and done.

    The school of hard knocks appreciates your tuition donation.

    There is no room for sob stories and too much sympathy in rentals. If they don’t pay rent, you evict. Everything else is irrelevant. They’ll tell you they got cancer, someone died etc etc. rent is still due.

    Hopefully you learn from this.

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