Trouble Tenants...I'm Overwhelmed

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Trouble Tenants...I'm Overwhelmed

Account Closed
Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 56 votes

I own a SFH in California which I rented out October 2018. Since day 1, the tenants have been contacting me on a daily/weekly basis requesting repairs.

Some of these repairs are warranted (replaced the water heater, fixed broken windows, fixed faulty sprinkler valves) while others I feel are not (most recently the light bulb in the garage isn't working). 

I've spent well over $5,000 in repairs since they've moved in (it's only been 9 months)  and honestly I'm sick of this. What's worse is that they find fault in many of the repairmen I send over. These are licensed individuals whom I have been working with for over a decade who are loved by all other tenants except these.

Most recently, there's apparently a slew of electrical issues in the house, including a few outlets that don't work, the A/C not cooling, along with the faulty lightbulb in the garage. I sent my electrician to take a look and over the course of a week, between he and his team, they fixed the issues...or so I thought. This morning the tenant contacted me and told me they're still having issues and that the electrician didn't fix everything and that he didn't show up when he said he would. I told them it's their responsibility to make sure all the issues are addressed with the electrician before he leaves to prevent consistent visits over the same problems and to follow up with him if he didn't make the visit.

They proceeded to get mad at me and my electrician, saying that it's not professional for the repairmen to forget what he needs to fix, that I'm blaming them, etc. I've been trying my best all these months to give them the benefit of the doubt and I've worked diligently to fix everything they've brought up within a few weeks time max, but I'm sick of making repairs, I'm sick of being contacted nonstop, and I'm sick of these people hating on my repairmen.

Not sure what my question is here, perhaps I just need to rant to fellow landlords, but any advice you can give with regards to dealing with such tenants would be appreciated.

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Jim K.
Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes
7y

@Account Closed

There's obviously more to this story, and I'm not seeing the ability to look at things from the tenant's side that every successful landlord needs to cultivate. So let me be the tenant's devilish advocate here and don't take anything I say here personally.

Let's look at what you've stated you needed to do in this house in the nine months that you've been renting it out:

1. Replace the water heater.

2. Fix broken windows.

3. Fix faulty sprinkler valves

4. Fix outlets that don't work

5. Fix (central?) A/C

6. Fix one or more lighting sockets that don't work.

7. Remove tree with roots that infiltrated the sewer line, deal with pile of woodchips left by tree removal.

OK, by any reasonable definition, I think you have to admit the house has been a piece-of-s*** for these tenants and was beat to hell when you rented it to them. Because that's a lot of problems cropping up in a very short amount of time.

Did you just buy this place prior to October 2018 and not do a thorough snagging of it? It sure sounds like it. You can't buy a POS cheap, inadequately snag it, dump tenants into it, and not be prepared for the POS to manifest its POS-ness. 

(Well, you can, but you'll lose money every time doing it.)

1. Did you scope the sewer line before you bought the place?

2. Did you check the electrical board?

3. Did you stick a wiring tester in each of the outlets?

4. Did you make sure the lighting sockets weren't faulty?

5. Did you check the age of the water heater?

6. Did you inspect the sprinkler valves?

7. Did you look at the busted windows?

8. Did you run the A/C?

Now, let's talk about your electrician. I'm afraid he's not passing the sniff test.

Your electrician couldn't fix circuit wiring that didn't work, couldn't check and replace outlets, couldn't check and replace lighting sockets/fixtures, and isn't answering the phone when they call him about the fact that they live in a giant fire hazard. If you think that's harsh, well, I'm not an electrician and I can do all that -- it's not rocket science. But you're telling them it's their responsibility to make sure your house is good and fixed for you, and not to whine to you about it. And of course you've mentioned here that everyone else who rents from you thinks that this electrician-of-obviously-questionable-competence is God's gift to alternating current.

A does not equal B does not equal C here.

The windows...you can't rent a house with busted windows. Did the tenants bust them? Or are you complaining that they should have lived happily paying rent for busted windows?

The wood chips -- It was YOUR tree, YOUR contractor didn't clean up after himself. Send a guy down there with a rake or go down there yourself -- - your tenants don't pay you rent to rake out a large chipped tree's worth of wood chips your contractor left behind. Trust me, they don't think of themselves as your free landscaping crew.

In their minds, they feel you should have known the roots were infiltrating the sewer line before they rented it out to you, and now you're hoping they clean up the rest of the mess that they should have never had to deal with, and you should never have put on them.

Just step back and look, once again. They're pissed off because you rented them a POS with a  bad water heater at the end of its service life, bad windows, electrical problems, sewer-line problems, busted sprinklers. You're sick of the situation? You think they're not sick of worrying what the next problem the POS you rented to them is going to throw at them?

I'm not one of those BPers who insist brightly that running rentals is a 100% people job. It isn't. But when you deal with unhappy tenants, you have to be able to put yourself in their shoes. You need to be as harsh on yourself as they are likely to be. Otherwise, you'll never understand their point of view.

I'm sure the analysis I've presented above is unfair to you at certain points, maybe at all points. But what I wanted with you was give you a picture of what it might look like from your tenants' point of view. The goal was not to be accurate, but to run some of your statements through a tenant filter.

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  • Anna Sagatelova
    Property Manager · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2019 · 446 posts · 566 votes
    7y

    Hi all, PM here weighing in with my two cents.

    I see how there is legitimate frustration on both sides. When tenants get a bad "first impression" of the property, they are then more likely to nitpick and nag. Many tenants are used to an apartment mindset, where there is an on-site maintenance staff and all requests, minor to major, are generally addressed within a day or two, sometimes within hours. It isn't your fault if that's their expectation here, but as landlord it is your duty to explore and understand their point of view if you want to curb the frustration on both sides.

    Getting maintenance calls nonstop is one of the biggest reasons why owners who are otherwise capable of running their own rentals turn to property management companies. PMs get between you and the "headache" - it's our job. Of course, we have had tenants tell us the same thing - they don't like a vendor (who we know is licensed, does quality work, and is almost universally beloved by everyone else who has worked with them), they insist a repair should have been done differently, etc. But at least you don't hear it directly.

    I agree that in this case, you should try to see their point of view and repair the relationship. Find out if they want to stay, and if so, why? But if there is any ambivalence there, let them out of their lease, and start over. And do consider hiring a "middle-man" to field the phone calls in the future.

    I hope this situation works out for you! It sounds like you are trying to do the right thing.

    6Reply
  • Colleen F.Pro Member
    Investor · Narragansett, RI · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y

    Offer them out of the lease.  If they don't want out try to reframe the relationship. Tell them you are sorry  there have been issues, it happens. Let them know how you will work from now on.  I would say they can email you or leave a message 9-5 on non urgent issues.  Define urgent issue for calls and those are the only ones that will get immediate attention. The rest you will respond with 48 hrs to schedule repair or not. Don't answer when they call. Voicemail can be a good buffer.

    Have you shared that your workmen find them rude?  Make it clear that you expect them to be respectful to your tradesman. You aren't asking them to police the repair man but before someone leaves they are responsible to say, yes it works. 

    It sounds like they are high maintenance tenants and the house has had some issues.  At this point everyone is frustrated.  It is up to you what you repair vs replace and the timelines for work.  Some things like electric are a priority but if wood chips take a week they aren't a health risk. If  they need to be taken care of by you that isn't an emergency. On the electrical,  if there are a lot of electrical issues and everything worked at the start I would question if they are overloading in some way.  I had a tenant put like 12 items on one outlet , blow the outlet with an obvious fire then tell me it wasn't his fault.  I would check with the electrician to make sure that isn't part of it.   Good luck!

    5Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 56 votes
    7y

    @Jon A. @Anna Sagatelova @Colleen F. Thank you all for the feedback, you've given me some great food for thought and I will have a discussion with them and will let them know they can opt out of the lease at any time.

    2Reply
  • Matt M.
    Specialist · Easton, PA · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    I agree with what @Jim K. Said also. When I buy a house (I’m a contractor mind you), not only do I do a rehab as needed, but I check and fix anything and everything. I do the same for my clients, probably why my big investors have been happy with me for 10-15 years. Even on a turn over I look over and check Everything. You have to or you’re faced with crap like this. In the long run it’s the best option, it’s easier to work when the house is empty, and you know everything is on the up and up. My wife says I’m to anal about our properties, but they are my babies, and part of my retirement.

    When I first started out in business I worked for an investor that would do next to nothing for years, want things fixed for pennies, then cry the blues when the bills were big $. I don’t work for those types of investors anymore.

    4Reply
  • Jason Ray Richardson
    Rental Property Investor · Brookhaven, MS · Member since 2017 · 186 posts · 108 votes
    7y

    Sometimes you get tenants that want everything fixed to perfections. I bought a house and inherited tenants, they used to call for every thing. Even when the fan wouldn't "work", it was just they didn't pull the string. The former owner said that they did that all the time to him too, but they paid great. So I wrote in their lease that if items are under 250.00 that they have to handle themselves. Now they only call me about serious issues. You might just have bad tenants or you just need to set better expectations at the time the lease is resigned. 

    3Reply
  • Julie N.
    Real Estate Investor · Unionville, CT · Member since 2016 · 260 posts · 167 votes
    7y

    @Wesam S. Sounds like you have your work cut out for you. Whenever I buy a home I do a full work up on mechanicals and everything with the House. I fix everything prior to the tenant moving in so I can avoid exactly what you are experiencing. It’s a pain and expensive, I know but it saves me the headache in the end.

    2Reply
  • Account Closed
    Rental Property Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2019 · 637 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Wesam S. Sounds like a motivated landlord🏠💰

    2Reply
  • Ella Leanne
    Member since 2019 · 1 post · 1 vote
    7y

    do right by your tenants, perhaps?

    1Reply
  • Ned J.Pro Member
    Investor · Manteca, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    The house has issues.....but so do the tenants.

    Wood shavings? Really? Spend 10 min and rake them up and move on...... a tenant bitching about that is gonna be trouble. As a tenant would I be ticked off and ***** about it to myself and my wife? Sure.... but I'd just go take care of it rather than call my landlord...not worth the effort.....

    If you can honestly look yourself in the mirror and say "all these things were properly working and in order prior to move in", then you have nothing to feel guilty about.....stuff happens and sometimes you have a bad run of repairs in a short time...it happens. But be honest with yourself..... was it really inspected and ready to rent or did you overlook some stuff and cross your fingers as it being "good enough"?

    As far as I'm concerned, this tenant relationship is OVER....... best to end it and move on. Offer to let them leave, if not, serve notice to not renew at the end of the lease. Once they are gone, thoroughly inspect and repair as needed and start fresh. Yes it may result in lost $$ up front, but in the long run, its time to suck it up and move on. Trying to "work it out" with these people is a waste of time. The stress and aggravation isn't worth it..... It will never be good enough for them, no matter how much you try.....time to move on.

    3Reply
  • Maugno M.
    Flipper / Landlord · Tyler, TX · Member since 2016 · 255 posts · 126 votes
    7y

    @Andrea Townsley Nope, he says it was remodeled. It is not a brand new home for everything to be up to par. Thats not slumlord but whatever floats your boat. School of hard knocks like they say here. You cant be going around catering to every little demand tenants make. Set expectations from the start. 
    How the hell is he supposed to know there are roots in the drainage ?

    @Account Closed You messed up too by catering to them on your repair crew. It should be you and only you that decides who does the maintenance on your property. if they don't like it, that's there problem. IT IS YOUR PROPERTY and you get to run the business the way you see fit.


    2Reply
  • Bill Kramer
    Contractor · Evansville, IN · Member since 2019 · 142 posts · 208 votes
    7y

    Time to send a repairman in to get a final list together of every complaint they have. It's gonna be a long list, but the tenants need a chance to vent it out. Then review that list and act accordingly.

    I have done this many a time with problem tenants. We make sure this is their last chance to complain, and anything after that will be treated as tenant damage. And have them sign off on it. Suddenly, the complaints will stop.

    From now on, give your tenants a move in checklist to find any and all defects to filled out within 1 week of move in. This will go a long ways towards nipping it in the butt.

    8Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 56 votes
    7y

    @Ned J. @Maugno M. @Bill Kramer You guys bring up some good points. While I'll take the blame for not doing a well enough job of combing through the house in detail prior to accenting tenants, they definitely have given me a hard time on many small, trivial things that I personally feel I should not have been bothered with. So yes, the house does have issues and it's my fault for not doing a worthy inspection, but as Ned has said, they've got issues to. 

    I've taken everyone's recommendations here and will talk with them soon.

    0Reply
  • Craig Bellot
    Property Manager · CT · Member since 2014 · 687 posts · 329 votes
    7y

    Sort the list of repairs by priority and then get to them when you get to them.  

    In Bridgeport CT we once in a blue get these high maintenance tenants.  It could be that they are on top of things, and you can use that to your advantage to keep the property in shape.  

    If they are complaining about trivial things, you ask them to take care of it themselves and see what they say.

    It's ok to say no sometimes. 

    1Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 56 votes
    7y

    @Craig Bellot I've definitely struggled with saying no as I'm not 100% sure as to what I should say no to. On the one hand I try to do my best to put myself in their shoes and see things from their perspective, but on the other hand I look at things very practically. I get that they were mad that the tree cutter left a pile of wood chips, the guy should have cleaned everything before leaving. But on the other hand did it really warrant complaining about it for a week telling me that their kids were getting allergies? They wanted me to call the guy back and have him clean everything (which I did) but that was one situation where I wanted to say "no, you can clean a small pile of wood chips yourself", especially since they're the ones doing the gardening.

    0Reply
  • Thomas Dougherty
    Member since 2019 · 135 posts · 25 votes
    7y

    I did not respond to the request of minor repairs.

    If they come to me personally, then I will tell them to continue to the store to buy a light bulb.

    If I need to fix it according to the lease, I will fix it within 24-48 hours.

    2Reply
  • Richard Ring
    Flipper/Rehabber · Member since 2019 · 61 posts · 22 votes
    7y

    @Wesam S.

    OMG....seriously

    Get a PM

    1Reply
  • Collin Schwartz
    Rental Property Investor · Papillion, NE · Member since 2017 · 398 posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Wesam S. Requests like this almost had me quit. At my second duplex Inhad bats, roof caving in, break ins, drug overdoses, and many other issues.

    My advice is do not take anything personally, regroup and figure out what next step is. This stuff will continue to happen but as long as you learn to

    1. Repair (apt) better on front end. Or allocate more funds for repair.

    2. Screen residents better

    3. Realize this is a business and that not all issues will be like this as long as you treat it like a business...

    You will be fine. Many give up at this point. Network with others, educate and learn from your mistakes.

    Best of luck!

    5Reply
  • Richard Ring
    Flipper/Rehabber · Member since 2019 · 61 posts · 22 votes
    7y

    @Wesam S.

    Your tenants are trying to find a excuse to.take you to court.

    I would get new tentants ASAP

    The min their lease is up

    As I mentioned before , get a PM

    Distance yourself from your tenants

    And then have it written in the lease

    Any that breaks ( a light bulb ) under

    $100.00 is on them

    Nesl

    3Reply
  • Richard Ring
    Flipper/Rehabber · Member since 2019 · 61 posts · 22 votes
    7y

    @Wesam S.

    The bottom line:

    Get a new repairman

    He should be able to fix everything without the tenants over his shoulder

    Or you could do this as well

    When the tenants leave over everything with a fine tooth

    Comb so where do move in

    There is no.issues

    2Reply
  • Spencer Hoogveld
    Rental Property Investor · Jefferson City, MO · Member since 2019 · 17 posts · 9 votes
    7y

    These tenants are nitpicking, bottom line. You've responded to all of their request, however they keep finding more issues to complain about. These type of tenants are ones you want to stay away from because they'll never be satisfied, despite your efforts. The wood chips posed a threat to their kids, really? No they're just being dramatic and enjoy either making you miserable or finding excuses to withhold rent.

    If this lease is almost up, I'd recommend not renewing when the time comes around.

    2Reply
  • Chris Purcell
    Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2010 · 739 posts · 372 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @David Avetisyan:

    California is a different beast, especially if the property is located in a rent control neighborhood. Tenants are protected by all sorts of laws and getting rid of them isn’t easy. 

    My suggestion: Next time they complain, let them know you are willing to let them out of their lease. 

    It is my impressions that the tenants are mistaking your kindness for weakness and it’s time you start channeling your frustrating correctly. Put your foot down and take control of your property. Don’t let them bully you into doing things. 

    To your success! 

    This is great advice.  Ive been having issues with a tenant where the repairs are brought up days after rent is due, and rent not being paid on time due to “repairs”

    I told this tenant she was happy to find another place and I started sending her listings. 

    She ended up apologizing and it’s been good since

    Put your foot down and tell them to go find a place they will be happy in, because clearly they are not happy with yours.  I think you’ll have a different tone

    2Reply
  • John MorganPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Grand Prairie, TX · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    Raise the rent a few hundred bucks on the best lease and see what happens. They seem like a pain.

    3Reply
  • Joshua A Kloos
    Member since 2018 · 50 posts · 56 votes
    7y

    @Jim K.

    Heeeyyyy, be nice. This sort of situation is a nightmare for both the tenants and the building owner. 

    I do agree with you it is a little strange that the issues are all popping up at once. I'd wager the previous tenants just never mentioned the issues and there was not a detailed walk-through prior to the current tenants moving in. 

    @Account Closed

    I have had this happen before when I worked in maintenance. For future note, it could have been a case of over promising and under delivering. If the tenants expectations are too high OR one of your employees has thrown you under the bus (said something negative about you), things can easily spiral out of control. 

    If they are paying rent on time, maybe just weather the storm and take what you can from the experience to never experience this sort of frustration again. 

    On the bright side, man, you have a ton of repairs done AND you were able to collect rent for all of the months it may have needed to be vacant! 

    PS There are some cool answering services who will screen calls and forward them to you for after hour emergencies if it is deemed to be an emergency by the standards you give the answering service.They run as low as $75/month. 

    Might be worth the investment! 

    Good luck!  

    3Reply
  • Mike G.
    Real Estate Agent · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2016 · 589 posts · 275 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed ya got 3 months left. Ride it out, bite your lip and non renew their lease. Make sure you cross all the T's and dot all your i's in your exit strategy with them and get them out. then after they are gone repair the place and do a better screening job before renting again. A great home inspector is worth its weight in gold and then some, so use the time now to vet and locate a great home inspector. That is what i would do, oh and another thing. Take this time to make sure your lease is armed with as much ammo to benefit you to get bad tenants out in the future should you come across any again. 

    2Reply
  • Jonathan W.
    Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2019 · 512 posts · 301 votes
    7y

    @Wesam S. Sounds like a rough year for the house. You may be overwhelmed but I see profit ahead. Too many problems from all sides. Tenants may be hard asses but they aren’t wrong in a lot of the cases.

    I’m confused as to why you repaired a window they broke and didn’t charge them? You should have pictures and move in documents stating what damage exists. It sounds like not only are the tenants fed up but because you’ve attended to a problem or two that is probably their responsibility, they are going to come to you for solving all the problems.(like fixing windows they broke)

    Other problems are clearly problems that need to be address and you did.

    the wood chips is unacceptable. Yes they could have cleaned it up and as a tenant I would have. But every moment I raked the chips up I would have thought my landlord sucks and other **** thoughts about you. Contractors leaving a mess is unacceptable and you have to remedy their messes ASAP because it’s not the tenants responsibility.

    I will tell you though I highly doubt these tenants will renew their lease, though if you let them break windows and don’t charge for it or if you let them tell you how you need to repair the house then they might want to stay lol.

    Lay down the law, study what your standards are and be firm. After reading a lot of this bread I can’t tell if the tenants are being hard because they are hard asses with certain expectations or if they are fed up after being told to clean up your contractors messes and maybe fed up after talking to you about other things you’re suppose to take responsibility for but didn’t.

    There are two sides to every story but I think you need to up your game sir. Read another landlord book or two. I know I still am and it makes a difference in my game everyday I pick it up and read. Law down the law when you are right and spend the money to remedy when you are wrong.

    Also maybe get a new electrician lol

    2Reply
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