Tenant wont sign the lease

Tenant wont sign the lease

Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes

Did you guys ever had an issue in Florida like that?

Tenant wont sign a lease. Always pays on time, but wont sign the lease.

(I bought this house from the tenant, she asked to stay at the house after the sale till she finds another house)

I agreed but its been 3 months already. 

First she was telling me how her sister passed away and she had to fly out of country.

Of course she did not have access to her phone nor internet.

Now she says her email is not working properly and something is wrong with her phone (I think its a bunch of bs)

Should I worry? Are there any weird laws in Florida where if sellers stays on as a tenant, can I lose the property? Or anything crazy like that?

I guess I just dont understand why wont she sign the lease...

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Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
7y

Without a written lease, by FL law the tenant is on a month to month lease.  If you want to cancel, give her 30 day notice, before the first of the month.  Actually, with a squirrel tenant I’d rather have them on a month to month so you Can cancel with 30 days notice.

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  • Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    7y

    Without a written lease, by FL law the tenant is on a month to month lease.  If you want to cancel, give her 30 day notice, before the first of the month.  Actually, with a squirrel tenant I’d rather have them on a month to month so you Can cancel with 30 days notice.

  • Rental Property Investor · Bradenton, FL · Member since 2017 · 45 posts · 28 votes
    7y

    Per Florida law, if the tenant pays monthly she's on a month-to-month lease.  For month-to-month leases you only need to give a 15-day non-renewal notice (refer to F.S. 83.57).  If she's not out in 15 days, you can evict for holdover and get possession back.

  • Real Estate Agent · Clearwater, FL · Member since 2017 · 99 posts · 66 votes
    7y

    @Mary Jay

    They won't sign it, because they are stalling! Excuses are constant, they have no interest in leaving! I have a similar situation, with a signed month to month lease. I was trying to work with the tenant, to get him approved to purchase the home. I set him up with my Mortgage lender, who said he was going to need 3-6 months, in order to get his credit score up. The lender was working with him, to start the process. Long story short, after 3 months and a ton of excuses, nothing has been done to better his credit score. So New Years day, I gave him notice to be out on the 31st of January. On the Month to Month it is a 15 day Notice as Karen had stated. 

    Your description of the situation, was so similar to what I have been dealing with. Its a constant line of excuses and stalling! Good luck on getting them out, hope you don't have any issues!

    Brian Beatty, Real Estate Agent

  • Realtor · PInellas County Largo, FL · Member since 2016 · 902 posts · 810 votes
    7y

    All the responses are correct, and this situation is why I always recommend not allowing a seller to occupy post-closing, and if the buyer would, they need to sign the lease before closing.

    Since you're already in this situation, I would just serve the 15-day non-renewal notice.  And be ready to take it further to an eviction; it sounds like she is in denial and is going to try to stay there forever!

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y

    thank u guys!

     I guess I just don’t understand what motivates them. If you don’t communicate with the landlord   you r going to be kicked out.  I know they want to stay in the house but  if I can’t get a handyman in  I don’t need a tenant like that. 

     If they want to stay in the house don’t they understand that they need to communicate with me and let me take care of the house ? 

     I just don’t understand what is  going on in their head 

  • Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    So if I read this right, the OP bought a house, possibly due to the owner not being able to pay for it?  the sellers sister passes away and she lost her house and you guys are saying what  terrible tenant she is? Maybe put yourself  in her shoes and approach the issue with a bit of compassion.  Has she paid rent?   Why are you so upset that she wont sign a lease?  

    'Is this person elderly?


  • Contractor · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 1 vote
    7y

    i say be the better person and have a talk with her letting her know the options you can take if she doesn't comply with your requests.  Im sure there can be a diplomatic solution to this rather than getting the sheriff involved.

    u definitely have the upper hand.

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Mary M.:

    So if I read this right, the OP bought a house, possibly due to the owner not being able to pay for it?  the sellers sister passes away and she lost her house and you guys are saying what  terrible tenant she is? Maybe put yourself  in her shoes and approach the issue with a bit of compassion.  Has she paid rent?   Why are you so upset that she wont sign a lease?  

    'Is this person elderly?

     Her sister passed away in October. I have given her October, November and December to get over it.

     Is three months not enough? Is that so time consuming to sign the lease ? 

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Mike Shal:

    i say be the better person and have a talk with her letting her know the options you can take if she doesn't comply with your requests.  Im sure there can be a diplomatic solution to this rather than getting the sheriff involved.

    u definitely have the upper hand.

      I can’t have a talk with her because she’s not answering my calls and she’s not answering my text or my emails. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    @Mary Jay

    No, three months is not enough to “get over” the death of a loved one. Is this person elderly? 

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Mary M.:

    @Mary Jay

    No, three months is not enough to “get over” the death of a loved one. Is this person elderly? 

     yes...late 50th- early 60th

  • Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    You might see if a local non profit that helps people might be able to help her. Not sure how you could approach it but it seems like she is in a bad place and needs compassion and help - not agressive tactics 

  • Contractor · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 1 vote
    7y
    Originally posted by @Mary Jay:
    Originally posted by @Mike Shal:

    i say be the better person and have a talk with her letting her know the options you can take if she doesn't comply with your requests.  Im sure there can be a diplomatic solution to this rather than getting the sheriff involved.

    u definitely have the upper hand.

      I can’t have a talk with her because she’s not answering my calls and she’s not answering my text or my emails. 

    That's a problem.  She's playing you then. Basically she's telling you do what you got to do because she knows how things are done in Florida.  The system is heavily favored for people in your situation... and they will move swiftly to resolve it for you, so I would I say initiate the process.  

    Here in NYC it's different. it can play out for a long time and some people take advantage of that.

    Good luck

  • Investor · Wellington, KS · Member since 2016 · 256 posts · 188 votes
    7y
    You don't need a lease. Send her your conditions and rules with the notice required by Florida law. You have much more leverage and control with month to month compared to a term lease. If you want her out to raise the rent, go ahead and raise it now. The worst that would happen is she decides to move out. More likely she will pay the higher rent increasing your NOI.
  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Mary M.:

    So if I read this right, the OP bought a house, possibly due to the owner not being able to pay for it?  the sellers sister passes away and she lost her house and you guys are saying what  terrible tenant she is? Maybe put yourself  in her shoes and approach the issue with a bit of compassion.  Has she paid rent?   Why are you so upset that she wont sign a lease?  

    'Is this person elderly?

     I am upset because she does not answer my calls/email/texts so :

    1) I cant send a contractor in. Before I bought the house the inspector during inspection said that there is some mold on the garage (garage is attached to the house), so I need to address it ASAP. Since she left out of country for a month then for 2 months she does not communicate back, I cant send the contractor in to address the issue. My asset is deteriorating...And I am upset about it.

    2) My insurance company wants me to do a picture of smoke/fire alarm and I cant do it because she wont communicate with me. So if I send a contractor she wont open the door probably.

    She was not loosing her house. She just wanted out of the house, so she and her husband could buy something smaller. The market rent is 1.5K, but since her mortgage was 1.2K the deal was that her rent will stay the same. 

    I agree with others saying that she is playing me. When I was buying the house (FSBO) she would answer texts and emails, but once I bought it, all of a sudden she has to go out of country to her sisters funeral ( I honestly doubt there even was a sister or sister's death), then she has no email access while she is out of country, then when she comes back her email and phone do not work correctly. What is the probability of both not working correctly? What is the probability of both not being fixed for few months? I think she is lying.

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Victor N.:
    You don't need a lease. Send her your conditions and rules with the notice required by Florida law. You have much more leverage and control with month to month compared to a term lease. If you want her out to raise the rent, go ahead and raise it now. The worst that would happen is she decides to move out. More likely she will pay the higher rent increasing your NOI.

     Thats a very good suggestion. Where do I get those conditions and rule with the notice? Can I download it from somewhere? 

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Mike Shal:
    Originally posted by @Mary Jay:
    Originally posted by @Mike Shal:

    i say be the better person and have a talk with her letting her know the options you can take if she doesn't comply with your requests.  Im sure there can be a diplomatic solution to this rather than getting the sheriff involved.

    u definitely have the upper hand.

      I can’t have a talk with her because she’s not answering my calls and she’s not answering my text or my emails. 

    That's a problem.  She's playing you then. Basically she's telling you do what you got to do because she knows how things are done in Florida.  The system is heavily favored for people in your situation... and they will move swiftly to resolve it for you, so I would I say initiate the process.  

    Here in NYC it's different. it can play out for a long time and some people take advantage of that.

    Good luck

     I agree with you, I think she is playing me.

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Brian D. Beatty:

    @Mary Jay

    They won't sign it, because they are stalling! Excuses are constant, they have no interest in leaving! I have a similar situation, with a signed month to month lease. I was trying to work with the tenant, to get him approved to purchase the home. I set him up with my Mortgage lender, who said he was going to need 3-6 months, in order to get his credit score up. The lender was working with him, to start the process. Long story short, after 3 months and a ton of excuses, nothing has been done to better his credit score. So New Years day, I gave him notice to be out on the 31st of January. On the Month to Month it is a 15 day Notice as Karen had stated. 

    Your description of the situation, was so similar to what I have been dealing with. Its a constant line of excuses and stalling! Good luck on getting them out, hope you don't have any issues!

    Brian Beatty, Real Estate Agent

     Thank you! 

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Wayne Brooks:

    Without a written lease, by FL law the tenant is on a month to month lease.  If you want to cancel, give her 30 day notice, before the first of the month.  Actually, with a squirrel tenant I’d rather have them on a month to month so you Can cancel with 30 days notice.

     agree

  • Glendale, AZ · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 238 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Karen A.:

    Per Florida law, if the tenant pays monthly she's on a month-to-month lease.  For month-to-month leases you only need to give a 15-day non-renewal notice (refer to F.S. 83.57).  If she's not out in 15 days, you can evict for holdover and get possession back.

     Thank you!

  • Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    You have no idea what is actually going on. She could be dead for all you know. 

    I dont understand how being agressive and confrontational at this point in the game will help you. 

    The name of the game is getting folks to do what you want. To do this you need to build rapport. You wont get this in the manner you are progressing as evidenced by where you are. 

    So, if this were me? I would first, find and read the tenant/landlord code in the rentals area. Second, hire an attorney so you can ask questions if needed and have them write letters if needed.   Third, once you understand the law, contact her via text and posted notice that you will have a contractor come to mitigate the mold on x date and time.  Be there to let the contractor in. 

    Once you mitigate the mold issue (i doubt it is a huge emergency but maybe it is) then get your atty to write you up a month to month agreement and a letter explaining the local laws and send it to her via certified mail. 

    In all of this try to not get involved emotionally. Dont get aggressive.  if she does not have money and is unresponsive, call the local elderly person charity and ask for assistance.  You can also call the police and ask for a wellness visit. 

    But please get an atty before you do anything. 

  • Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Mary M.  The tenant needs to move out and is ignoring the landlord/owner.  The OP isn't being aggressive, she wants the house, the one she PAID FOR.  The squatter's problems are not relative and she isn't elderly and it isn't     

    @Mary Jay job to get involved any more than she has.  Mary has been more than patient and charitable and I hope she can get possession soon without having to loose any more of her hard earned money.

  • Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    Well, my take is shes paying rent (thats a great thing). You ultimately have the rights to the house, with proper notice you can let yourself in to have work done, you have the keys. Just need to check your states laws first.

    A lot of the time people avoid problems as if they will just go away on their own. Even more so when under stress. The death of a loved one takes time to heal, she probably just doesnt want to talk to anyone right now including you.

    Id give proper notice that id be doing work on the house at such and such date, and just plan to be there to open the door for the contractor. I wouldnt stir up the pot until either A.) she refuses to let anyone in, or B.) she doesnt pay rent. 

    I learned from my first tenants (which wasnt that long ago), that i cant assume anything and jump to conclusions. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    @Bob B. where did I say the OP should not proceed in the legal manner allowed to her? 

    I laid out the path for her to do so.  But calling the tenant names, etc won't help.  Trying to build rapport with the tenant might. 

    I always try to use the other parties motivations to get what I want -   this works YMMV   :) 

  • Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Mary

    @Mary M.

    @Mary M. "You might see if a local non profit that helps people might be able to help her. Not sure how you could approach it but it seems like she is in a bad place and needs compassion and help - not agressive tactics"

    How is the OP being aggressive? The squatter is ignoring the property owner and obviously not wanting to have any type of rapport.  She has demonstrated her intent to live rent free and not honor her word.   I hope she gets control of her property soon.  

    It's a very pretty day here and I'm going to take a boat ride, on my boat paid for by my honest and appreciative tenants that I have great rapport with. 

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