Investing in baltimore?

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Investing in baltimore?

Haseeb Ahsan
Silver Spring, MD · Member since 2017 · 2 posts · 0 votes

Hi I'm trying to add another property this year in baltimore county and rent it out. I've seen a few in Brooklyn Md and Dundalk. Any experience with those areas? what's the current rent range? 

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Nicole A.Pro Member
Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y

Another thing to note is laws and requirements can differ in Baltimore City and the County. I have some properties in Dundalk and it's easy to find a cashflowing property, especially with all the 2 and 3 unit properties in the area. What you need, though, is to be able to pick good tenants because Dundalk is full of bad tenants if you're the type to just accept anyone. Also, lots of tenants in Dundalk may not have checking accounts or be very tech savvy, so don't expect a whole lot of them to pay rent via online methods.

All my units are 2 bedrooms/1 bath apartments and their rents include water. My rents for 2 bedroom apartments go anywhere from $810 - $835 per month. I see 1 bedroom apartments in Dundalk typically going for around $700/month.

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  • Account Closed
    Severn, MD · Member since 2016 · 7 posts · 3 votes
    9y

    Brooklyn and Dundalk are actually areas on the rise, especially Brooklyn. Rental rates are expected to raise within the next 2-3 years with the completion of Port Covington and an inflow of workers into surrunding areas. Current rent ranges are mediocre, but I'd recommend getting into the market soon before the cap rates actually begin to rise.

    3Reply
  • Ian Barnes
    Rental Property Investor · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2014 · 247 posts · 321 votes
    9y

    @Account ClosedBrooklyn isn't on the rise at all, Curtis Bay maybe if your trying to use the Port Covington trade, which by the way won't even be up and functional for at least 5 years. What will become ultra hot is the Riverside Park area directly north of Port Covington, but then again prices are much more expensive there right now compared to Curtis Bay.

    1Reply
  • Rich Baer
    Real Estate Investment Attorney · Kingsville, MD · Member since 2016 · 643 posts · 408 votes
    9y

    @Haseeb Ahsan

    Neither area is on the rise. Dundalk is a much better rental area than Brooklyn. If you have to go with Brooklyn stay in AA County (not Balt City). With few exceptions all Baltimore working class neighborhoods rent for $900 to $1100 depending on size, condition and how much you want to stress your tenant.

    3Reply
  • Russell BrazilBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes
    9y

    @Matt Schelberg has some rentals in Dundalk I believe.

    [email protected]301-893-4635Podcast Guest on Show #192
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    2Reply
  • Haseeb Ahsan
    OP
    Silver Spring, MD · Member since 2017 · 2 posts · 0 votes
    9y

    thanks guys for the info! Any advice or recommendations for financing and contractors? 

    0Reply
  • Account Closed
    Sunnyvale, CA · Member since 2016 · 71 posts · 21 votes
    9y

    @Haseeb Ahsan, I've been doing a lot of reading on Baltimore because I too am not familiar enough yet. Here's. what I've found, and hopefully more knowledgeable people can jump in to add to or correct what I say. 

    It seems like the nice places like Fells Point, Charles Village, most of South Baltimore (Locus Point, Fed Hill, etc), Canton, are all expensive and offer poor options for cash-flow. South Baltimore may be a good speculative option due to endevelopment at Port Covington, but that's a long and expensive gamble. 

    The trendy and gentrifying neighborhoods might include Station North, Reservoir Hill, and Woodberry among others.  Hampden and Canton sound like they've already done most of their appreciation. Not sure what else to say besides I haven't found anything on market that makes cash-flow sense. I talked to some Realtos and their suggestions were Dundalk and Washington Village. I wasn't too impressed when I looked at either. 

    I found some deals that seem to cash flow, but they seem to be in areas with a bad reputation, like Cherry Hill.  I did a lot of reading on this neighborhood. They have unbelievably high unemployment, it's a food desert, and high poverty rates, but a 1985 home for $65k renting at $1100 is otherwise tempting. Trulia lists it as a low crime area, but it has such an awful reputation. It's hard to tell if its turning around. Less than a dozen murders in the past 3 years...

    I think it was Ned Carey on BP that said the further from the city center also means lower crime. Another poster said to up the 1% rule in Baltimore to 1.25% because of the astronomical property taxes. I am aiming for 1.5% RTP. 

    So basically I'm still searching for my target neighborhood but am researching north-west Baltimore like Windsor Hills.  I'm also open to suggestions for neighborhoods. 

    5Reply
  • Darren Bailin
    Baltimore, MD · Member since 2016 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    9y

    cherry hill absolutely not! check out the surrounding areas of JH hospital. Still a rough area, but a lot of recent investment activity and has the stability of a world renowned teaching hospital that always has residents/fellows rotating in.

    0Reply
  • Mark Moyer
    Real Estate Agent · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2017 · 47 posts · 16 votes
    9y

    Be sure to check crime stats in some of those neighborhoods.  Areas like Brooklyn have seen a dramatic increase in violent crime (homicides especially).  Every neighborhood has good blocks.  If you can identify those good, stable blocks you can be part of solution helping to further stabilize the neighborhood.    

    0Reply
  • Nicole A.Pro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    Another thing to note is laws and requirements can differ in Baltimore City and the County. I have some properties in Dundalk and it's easy to find a cashflowing property, especially with all the 2 and 3 unit properties in the area. What you need, though, is to be able to pick good tenants because Dundalk is full of bad tenants if you're the type to just accept anyone. Also, lots of tenants in Dundalk may not have checking accounts or be very tech savvy, so don't expect a whole lot of them to pay rent via online methods.

    All my units are 2 bedrooms/1 bath apartments and their rents include water. My rents for 2 bedroom apartments go anywhere from $810 - $835 per month. I see 1 bedroom apartments in Dundalk typically going for around $700/month.

    8Reply
  • Geo Rockwell
    Baltimore, MD · Member since 2017 · 2 posts · 2 votes
    9y

    @Nicole,

    I have a rental in Catonsville and currently live in Federal Hill.  I would love to pick up another rental in Federal Hill, but a cash flow one is hard to come by with the high taxes.  I grew up here so I know all the areas very well.  Columbia seems more appealing than Dundalk because of quality of the tenants.  What areas have you been most successful in? And how much cash flow do you usually look for? 

    Thanks for the help!

    1Reply
  • Nicole A.Pro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    Hi @Geo Rockwell

    Columbia is appealing, but as you might know, you may also have a lot of trouble finding anything that cash flows there. Sometimes you might see a condo for a good price, but then of course once you learn of the monthly condo fee, it's not a deal. You might be able to find a good deal on a foreclosure/short sale that happens to be in good shape. I think it'd take a bit of time to find a cash flowing deal in Columbia. I live in Columbia and do plan to one day make our home a rental. By this point in our mortgage, rent will cover probably it all, but nothing beyond that. Once we finish paying it off, it'll be a nice little sum of cash each month.

    While the typical tenants in Dundalk tend to be of "less quality" than Columbia, there are some wonderful people there. Like I said in my last post, you simply need to screen well and not settle. I will be vacant for a little longer than accept an application that is not meeting my standards. Also, the other key is to file for the eviction process immediately so that tenants understand they can't play games. OR, you could hire a property manager! 

    I just recently moved 4 of my units to a PM. I'm excited to see how things go.

    So, I do recommend Dundalk. All my units currently are there. And there has been some growth in Dundalk too, so that could be a good sign.

    After all of my expenses/savings, I'm currently cash flowing around $552 per property. Each of my properties is 2 units each.

    Another town that might be good to check out for possible cash-flowing properties is Laurel.

    5Reply
  • Jason Chan
    Washington DC · Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 3 votes
    8y

    bump, i'm curious if any of this has changed - i'm also interested in brooklyn, bmore for cash flow and rental opportunities but it seems like the prices have recently risen. Does anyone have suggestions in terms of neighborhoods (or smaller sub neighborhoods) to target? i'm new to real estate and here on BP to learn from the wealth of strategic, tax and legal advice here. is brooklyn still attractive? (for context, i grew up in the DMV and went to school at UMD...left the area to work in NYC and now SF where things are completely unaffordable..thus i want to build credit and generate cash flow asap..). also, how would a neighborhood like brooklyn compare with something like fort washington in PG county near the MGM and national harbor..? thanks!!

    1Reply
  • Mark Cruse
    Investor · Fort Washington, MD · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    8y

    I'm in Brooklyn and Curtis Bay. I hope they do rise one day because it's needed.

    1Reply
  • Ian Barnes
    Rental Property Investor · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2014 · 247 posts · 321 votes
    8y

    @Jason Chan Nothing has changed other than uninformed investors buying up properties in Brooklyn because of the price tag.  It still has tons of crime, drug dealers, junkies etc, that is one of the few places I avoid investing in along with Winchester and Sandtown. Now Brooklyn Park in Anne Arrundel is a lot nicer but the prices are higher.

    4Reply
  • Ryan Koehler
    Arlington, VA · Member since 2013 · 115 posts · 40 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ian Barnes:

    @Jason Chan Nothing has changed other than uninformed investors buying up properties in Brooklyn because of the price tag.  It still has tons of crime, drug dealers, junkies etc, that is one of the few places I avoid investing in along with Winchester and Sandtown. Now Brooklyn Park in Anne Arrundel is a lot nicer but the prices are higher.

     Ian - do you have a similar opinion on Pigtown?

    0Reply
  • Ian Barnes
    Rental Property Investor · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2014 · 247 posts · 321 votes
    8y

    Would only do south of Washington Blvd and closer to the stadium, rest of Pigtown is for the suckers.  You get caught in an economic downturn in Pigtown, your in trouble. Ridgley's Delight is much better option if you can find something there.

    2Reply
  • Daniel Kauffman
    Fairfax, Virginia (VA) · Member since 2017 · 47 posts · 47 votes
    8y

    Currently a property in Pigtown sells for about 50-70% of what a comparable property commands in the Federal Hill area. The Pigtown area is only 1-2 miles from the inner harbor, but it's definitely on the border between nice and rough neighborhoods. I believe that the Pigtown area will get nicer over time, and that it's well positioned for improvement over the next few years. There are a lot of investments being made near the stadiums along the "entertainment corridor" like Hammerjacks, and Top Golf. I recently purchased a nicely updated 3 bedroom 2 bath property near M&T Stadium for $200K. My recommendation is to visit the area yourself and draw your own conclusions. 

    2Reply
  • Ramsin Jacob
    Realtor · San Jose, CA · Member since 2018 · 184 posts · 71 votes
    8y

    I've had my eye on Baltimore.  Brooklyn is definitely not the place.   

    1Reply
  • Jason Chan
    Washington DC · Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 3 votes
    8y

    Thanks!! @daniel kauffman

    0Reply
  • Kevin Taney
    Member since 2018 · 10 posts · 20 votes
    8y

    Brooklyn certainly has more impoverished people than Brooklyn Park, which you can use your imagination what the surroundings are like.  You will best understand the neighborhood's by driving through the area at various times a day.  Visits can either save you a ton of money or make you money based on what you see.

    There has been quite a bit of development on the edge of Glen Burnie into the Brooklyn Park area with high focus and dependency on the Port Covington development.  This is driving up the price of surrounding real estate which makes it closer to a gamble than an investment (which certainly may cut into cash flow).  There has been $45 million sunk into a large apartment/condo complex due to open this fall.  These are supposed to be of the higher-end units.  A big indicator will be if and/or how quickly these units fill.

    2Reply
  • Ariel Adams
    Member since 2018 · 1 post · 0 votes
    7y

    I would definitely recommend Pigtown/Washington Village. I’m from Baltimore and that area has changed tremendously within the past years. Some parts are still a little sketchy but you can tell the area is changing. There are a lot of renovations going on in the area and I don’t see the deals staying on the market to long around there. Also there is a trickle of development and business coming to the area. I would say it deserves a closer look at the very least. As for cherry hill/Brooklyn those areas are not coming up just yet. If you have time to buy and wait you may see some benefit. The parts of those areas closer to the water will have a view of the waterfront project at port covington so it may be worth the wait ... but it will be a wait!

    0Reply
  • Ozzy SirimsiBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 782 votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    @Haseeb Ahsan, I've been doing a lot of reading on Baltimore because I too am not familiar enough yet. Here's. what I've found, and hopefully more knowledgeable people can jump in to add to or correct what I say. 

    It seems like the nice places like Fells Point, Charles Village, most of South Baltimore (Locus Point, Fed Hill, etc), Canton, are all expensive and offer poor options for cash-flow. South Baltimore may be a good speculative option due to endevelopment at Port Covington, but that's a long and expensive gamble. 

    The trendy and gentrifying neighborhoods might include Station North, Reservoir Hill, and Woodberry among others.  Hampden and Canton sound like they've already done most of their appreciation. Not sure what else to say besides I haven't found anything on market that makes cash-flow sense. I talked to some Realtos and their suggestions were Dundalk and Washington Village. I wasn't too impressed when I looked at either. 

    I found some deals that seem to cash flow, but they seem to be in areas with a bad reputation, like Cherry Hill.  I did a lot of reading on this neighborhood. They have unbelievably high unemployment, it's a food desert, and high poverty rates, but a 1985 home for $65k renting at $1100 is otherwise tempting. Trulia lists it as a low crime area, but it has such an awful reputation. It's hard to tell if its turning around. Less than a dozen murders in the past 3 years...

    I think it was Ned Carey on BP that said the further from the city center also means lower crime. Another poster said to up the 1% rule in Baltimore to 1.25% because of the astronomical property taxes. I am aiming for 1.5% RTP. 

    So basically I'm still searching for my target neighborhood but am researching north-west Baltimore like Windsor Hills.  I'm also open to suggestions for neighborhoods. 

     I am curious how did you pick Windsor Hill??

    0Reply
  • Ozzy SirimsiBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 782 votes
    7y

    It is kind of funny, people actually invest in Baltimore all agree on that Brooklyn  is a no go, but rest keep on eye on it for some reason :D))) 

    I  play soccer over there, still drive around and don't see any improvement :D))

    1Reply
  • Nicole Obregon
    Member since 2018 · 28 posts · 18 votes
    7y

    Very interesting conversation about the areas of Baltimore! Following and reading. Curtis Bay isn't appealing or growing in value, from what I've heard, but you can always find a renter.

    0Reply
  • Andrew S.
    Real Estate Agent · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2016 · 37 posts · 12 votes
    7y

    Brooklyn and Curtis bay are not for the faint of heart. 

    2Reply
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