Curious on costs to build new multi-unit as a developer/investor vs. normal consumer?

Curious on costs to build new multi-unit as a developer/investor vs. normal consumer?

Member since 2023 · 11 posts · 5 votes

Using this new build as an example: https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chic... . It's two units and they're asking $1.4m. The top unit is a 1800sq ft. 3/2 simplex. Bottom unit is a 3500sq ft. 4/3 duplex down. Sold as vacant land a year ago for $242k. I looked up permits and the cost to build is listed as $465k. Is that $465k really what it cost to build this entire new construction of 5300 sq ft. total? Does that include all their costs, or only certain things? If the $465k is accurate for all in, then that's only $87/sq ft. which seems insanely cheap...Or is that $465k cost listed in the city records just an estimate that the developer has to provide to the city and it could be way off?

If the $465k for building costs is accurate, then that brings total cost to $707k (242 land purchase + 465 building costs). What other costs have to be considered when looking at the fact they built this new and it took a year. I assume just property taxes, insurance, and mortgage interest right? Since this was vacant land the prop tax are super low. Is it fair to say the carrying costs for the year were probably just like $5k-$10k? If so, then let's say the total cost all in is $720k. Is this likely on the right track or am I way off?

I assume this has to be a developer or investor that already has a team that took this project on right. So are they really going to profit nearly 100% before tax if they are able to sell it for $1.4m? Assuming $1.4m sale less ~720k costs. That seems crazy. Or am I missing something. Assuming the sale proceeds all go to the current owner of the property who did this new build, if that individual has to pay taxes on $700k of income gains, I guess that's pretty high at maybe 35% or so, so say $240k goes to taxes. They still walk away with $460k profit here? Am I on the right track or am I wrong anywhere in my numbers and thoughts.

My last main question is, let's say a normal person like myself had bought this vacant land and wanted to build this new 2 unit. Without any connections or a team, how much $ would I be looking at to spend to commission this project if I wanted it for myself. I have to assume it would be way less than $1.4mil which is the asking price, but I also assume there's no way I could do it for $465k since I am guessing the building costs are only that low because whoever owns this property currently has a team in place and can do the actual work/get materials way cheaper than I could as a normal consumer? And as a normal person I would have to pay a premium for a GC/sub-contractors right, whereas whoever did this is probably a GC themselves or doesn't have to pay those premiums? So let's just say I bought this land for $242k myself and I wanted to build this exact multi. How much would I have to pay a GC to make it happen? $700k? How do I go about thinking about it or determining how much more it would cost a normal person compared to a developer/investor etc. 

I'm also still kind of shocked and thinking I must be wrong about the costs since this building is 5300 sq ft. living space and was able to be done for $720k ish all in? I just think that's too cheap right? Or is that really how much of a benefit a developer or someone in construction can get a project like this done for? And then they can just charge a premium to public buyers for the 2 units..honestly even at $1.4m, this only comes out to $264 sq. ft which still seems pretty cheap compared to other things I see in Chicago for higher end units/sfh's ($350-$450+/sq ft)

Would love those of you more knowledgeable about new construction and the finances around real estate to chime in here. 

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Investor · Clairemont, CA · Member since 2011 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
3y

Any numbers listed on permit or assessor card info are going to be their numbers based upon some cost estimate they have. Locally the number that our City uses is easily half of actual real world cost. Where did it come from, how is it updated? I have no idea. But the simple answer is, don't use that as the basis for any other decision making. 

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  • Investor · Clairemont, CA · Member since 2011 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y

    Any numbers listed on permit or assessor card info are going to be their numbers based upon some cost estimate they have. Locally the number that our City uses is easily half of actual real world cost. Where did it come from, how is it updated? I have no idea. But the simple answer is, don't use that as the basis for any other decision making. 

  • Lender · Chicago IL · Member since 2020 · 357 posts · 229 votes
    3y

    @Anthony Mei I agree with . As a developer and general contractor focused on new construction of SFHs and small multi unit buildings on the North side of Chicago, I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that they spent much more than $87/SF to build this. Remodeling homes at a similar ARV ($1.4MM) wouldn't even be as little as $87/SF, if done properly. It costs us between $155-$185/SF to build new construction nowadays, depending on finishes. Those are hard costs only and do not include the purchase of land or soft costs. If you were going to 'commission' us (or any GC / design build team) to build something for you, mark that up about 15-20%. I hope this helps!

  • Real Estate Broker · 3412 S. Harlem Avenue Riverside, IL 60546 · Member since 2015 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    3y

    @Anthony Mei I have done quite a bit of work in some of the suburbs right outside of Chicago like Berwyn and Cicero, and these suburbs base the permit cost on the total project. What that means is that the amount on the permit application is often not what is actually spent on the ground. I doubt anyone is doing a new build in Chicago for that quality of construction for that price unless it is a labor of love where they are doing all the work themselves. 

  • Mark AinleyBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Roselle, IL (Chicago Suburb) · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    3y

    @Anthony Mei there is a book out called "Don't Buy Multi Family!  Build It" by Roger Luri who is a Chicago developer.  It doesnt go deep into numbers but gives you a 30k foot view and it is a quick read.  I will send you the link as he was a guest on our podcast a few weeks ago.  

  • Crystal SmithPro Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Anthony Mei:

    Does that include all their costs, or only certain things? I way off?

    All the costs to build are not included in what's submitted for city permits. The costs of materials, finishes,labor, drawings.... aren't included.  Do not use those numbers for any planning purposes.

    Is it fair to say the carrying costs for the year were probably just like $5k-$10k? If so, then let's say the total cost all in is $720k. Is this likely on the right track or am I way off?

    Carrying costs is a function of what kind of loan you have with your lender and/or relationship with your equity partners. So you are probably way off.

    I assume this has to be a developer or investor that already has a team that took this project on right. So are they really going to profit nearly 100% before tax if they are able to sell it for $1.4m? Assuming $1.4m sale less ~720k costs. That seems crazy. Or am I missing something. Assuming the sale proceeds all go to the current owner of the property who did this new build, if that individual has to pay taxes on $700k of income gains, I guess that's pretty high at maybe 35% or so, so say $240k goes to taxes. They still walk away with $460k profit here? Am I on the right track or am I wrong anywhere in my numbers and thoughts.

    What your missing is not knowing the this developer's true costs to build and whether or not he's doing this with cash or he or she is leveraged. And if leveraged at what rate.

    My last main question is, let's say a normal person like myself had bought this vacant land and wanted to build this new 2 unit. Without any connections or a team, how much $ would I be looking at to spend to commission this project if I wanted it for myself. I have to assume it would be way less than $1.4mil which is the asking price, but I also assume there's no way I could do it for $465k since I am guessing the building costs are only that low because whoever owns this property currently has a team in place and can do the actual work/get materials way cheaper than I could as a normal consumer? And as a normal person I would have to pay a premium for a GC/sub-contractors right, whereas whoever did this is probably a GC themselves or doesn't have to pay those premiums? So let's just say I bought this land for $242k myself and I wanted to build this exact multi. How much would I have to pay a GC to make it happen? $700k? How do I go about thinking about it or determining how much more it would cost a normal person compared to a developer/investor etc. 

    I would use $200 per square foot as a worst case.



    All costs are not included in a permit
  • Real Estate Agent · Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y

    This is an interesting topic. I wanted to build a spec sf a few years ago and got quotes from a few builders. There is a large variance between builders who build for developers and retail builders often a good 20-30% difference. There is profit to be made using investor builders but after loan fees etc it gets skinny and is often lower then a normal rehab flip. If your own company can GC it thats where the real profit comes from due to an even lower total cost build.

    I have found for small investors a light cosmetic rehab no permits+afterwards significantly increase rents to market, to be the most profitable equity builder on multi units. 

  • Jonathan KlemmBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Contractor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y

    Hey @Anthony Mei - The $465k cost listed in the city records is likely inaccurate and just what they put on the permit, and the actual cost is for sure higher. There are a number of factors that can affect the cost of construction, including the size and complexity of the project, the materials used, the labor costs, and the location.

    In addition to the cost of construction, there are other costs associated with building a new home especially if you are in Chicago, such as the cost of land, permits, and financing. These costs can add up, so it's important to factor them in when making a decision to build.

    If you're considering building a new home, get quotes from multiple contractors. This will help you to get an accurate estimate of the cost and ensure that you're getting the best possible deal.

  • Chris VarsekBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Beach Park, IL · Member since 2021 · 69 posts · 38 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Jennie Berger:

    @Anthony Mei I agree with . As a developer and general contractor focused on new construction of SFHs and small multi unit buildings on the North side of Chicago, I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that they spent much more than $87/SF to build this. Remodeling homes at a similar ARV ($1.4MM) wouldn't even be as little as $87/SF, if done properly. It costs us between $155-$185/SF to build new construction nowadays, depending on finishes. Those are hard costs only and do not include the purchase of land or soft costs. If you were going to 'commission' us (or any GC / design build team) to build something for you, mark that up about 15-20%. I hope this helps!


     even at $215 sqft, that seems like a good deal.  I've been getting consistently quoted north of $250/sqft to build up in Lake County!

  • Investor · Chicago · Member since 2019 · 5 posts · 3 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Anthony Mei:

    Using this new build as an example: https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chic... . It's two units and they're asking $1.4m. The top unit is a 1800sq ft. 3/2 simplex. Bottom unit is a 3500sq ft. 4/3 duplex down. Sold as vacant land a year ago for $242k. I looked up permits and the cost to build is listed as $465k. Is that $465k really what it cost to build this entire new construction of 5300 sq ft. total? Does that include all their costs, or only certain things? If the $465k is accurate for all in, then that's only $87/sq ft. which seems insanely cheap...Or is that $465k cost listed in the city records just an estimate that the developer has to provide to the city and it could be way off?

    If the $465k for building costs is accurate, then that brings total cost to $707k (242 land purchase + 465 building costs). What other costs have to be considered when looking at the fact they built this new and it took a year. I assume just property taxes, insurance, and mortgage interest right? Since this was vacant land the prop tax are super low. Is it fair to say the carrying costs for the year were probably just like $5k-$10k? If so, then let's say the total cost all in is $720k. Is this likely on the right track or am I way off?

    I assume this has to be a developer or investor that already has a team that took this project on right. So are they really going to profit nearly 100% before tax if they are able to sell it for $1.4m? Assuming $1.4m sale less ~720k costs. That seems crazy. Or am I missing something. Assuming the sale proceeds all go to the current owner of the property who did this new build, if that individual has to pay taxes on $700k of income gains, I guess that's pretty high at maybe 35% or so, so say $240k goes to taxes. They still walk away with $460k profit here? Am I on the right track or am I wrong anywhere in my numbers and thoughts.

    My last main question is, let's say a normal person like myself had bought this vacant land and wanted to build this new 2 unit. Without any connections or a team, how much $ would I be looking at to spend to commission this project if I wanted it for myself. I have to assume it would be way less than $1.4mil which is the asking price, but I also assume there's no way I could do it for $465k since I am guessing the building costs are only that low because whoever owns this property currently has a team in place and can do the actual work/get materials way cheaper than I could as a normal consumer? And as a normal person I would have to pay a premium for a GC/sub-contractors right, whereas whoever did this is probably a GC themselves or doesn't have to pay those premiums? So let's just say I bought this land for $242k myself and I wanted to build this exact multi. How much would I have to pay a GC to make it happen? $700k? How do I go about thinking about it or determining how much more it would cost a normal person compared to a developer/investor etc. 

    I'm also still kind of shocked and thinking I must be wrong about the costs since this building is 5300 sq ft. living space and was able to be done for $720k ish all in? I just think that's too cheap right? Or is that really how much of a benefit a developer or someone in construction can get a project like this done for? And then they can just charge a premium to public buyers for the 2 units..honestly even at $1.4m, this only comes out to $264 sq. ft which still seems pretty cheap compared to other things I see in Chicago for higher end units/sfh's ($350-$450+/sq ft)

    Would love those of you more knowledgeable about new construction and the finances around real estate to chime in here. 

    Yes I’m looking for the exact answer I’m interested in new build triplex condo style that you may see popping up all through the city C class was hoping more like $160 sqft but would like an for sure estimate from one of these pros 
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