Best property management company in the Twin Cities?
Investor · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2018 · 8 posts · 4 votes
Best property management company in the Twin Cities?
Most Popular Reply
Michael SmytheBusiness Member
Real Estate Agent · Metro Detroit · Member since 2023 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes@Thomas Hartman what you think is great service may not correlate with what another investor thinks.
Encourage you to learn from the mistakes of others - by reading posts here on BiggerPockets about owners not having their expectations met by their current Property Management Company.
To avoid going through the same poor experience, keep reading.
Even if someone give you a referral, don’t make the mistake of assuming that PMC will meet your expectations, just because they met the expectations of the referral source.
We also can’t believe how many owners hire the first PMC they speak with!
Then they complain their expectations aren’t being met!
In our experience, the #1 mistake owners make when selecting a Property Management Company (PMC) is ASSUMING instead of CONFIRMING.
It's often a case of not doing enough research, as they don't know what they don't know!
Owners mistakenly ASSUME all PMCs offer the exact SAME SERVICES and PERFORM those services EXACTLY THE SAME WAY, so price is the only differentiator – and they often select the first PMC they call!
So, the first question they usually ask a PMC is about fees - instead of asking about services and HOW those services are executed.
EXAMPLE: PMC states they will handle tenant screening – what does that specifically mean? What documents do they require, what credit scores do they allow, how do they verify previous rental history, etc.? You’d be shocked by how little actual screening many PMC’s do!
This also leads owners to ASSUME simpler is better when it comes to management contracts.
The reality is the opposite - if it's not in writing then the PMC doesn't have to provide the service or can charge extra for it!
We have a 14-page management contract that we've added our real experiences to over the years, with the intent of protecting both us AND the landlord. Beyond the Monthly Management, Placement & Maintenance fees, all other fees in our contract are IF EVENT -> THEN fees.
We don’t know any PMCs to recommend in the area mentioned, but since selecting the wrong PMC is usually more harmful than selecting a bad tenant, you might want to read our series about “How to Screen a PMC Better than a Tenant”:
We recommend you get management contracts from several PMCs and compare the services they cover and, more importantly, what they each DO NOT cover.
EDUCATE YOURSELF - yes, it will take time, but will lead to a selection that better meets your expectations & avoids potentially costly surprises!
P.S. If you just hire the cheapest or first PMC you speak with and it turns into a bad experience, please don’t assume ALL PMC’s are bad and start trashing PMC’s in general. Take ownership of your mistake and learn to do the proper due diligence recommended above😊
Logical Property Management4.9455 Reviews
6 Replies
- 2yMichael SmytheBusiness MemberReal Estate Agent · Metro Detroit · Member since 2023 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
@Thomas Hartman what you think is great service may not correlate with what another investor thinks.
Encourage you to learn from the mistakes of others - by reading posts here on BiggerPockets about owners not having their expectations met by their current Property Management Company.
To avoid going through the same poor experience, keep reading.
Even if someone give you a referral, don’t make the mistake of assuming that PMC will meet your expectations, just because they met the expectations of the referral source.
We also can’t believe how many owners hire the first PMC they speak with!
Then they complain their expectations aren’t being met!
In our experience, the #1 mistake owners make when selecting a Property Management Company (PMC) is ASSUMING instead of CONFIRMING.
It's often a case of not doing enough research, as they don't know what they don't know!
Owners mistakenly ASSUME all PMCs offer the exact SAME SERVICES and PERFORM those services EXACTLY THE SAME WAY, so price is the only differentiator – and they often select the first PMC they call!
So, the first question they usually ask a PMC is about fees - instead of asking about services and HOW those services are executed.
EXAMPLE: PMC states they will handle tenant screening – what does that specifically mean? What documents do they require, what credit scores do they allow, how do they verify previous rental history, etc.? You’d be shocked by how little actual screening many PMC’s do!
This also leads owners to ASSUME simpler is better when it comes to management contracts.
The reality is the opposite - if it's not in writing then the PMC doesn't have to provide the service or can charge extra for it!
We have a 14-page management contract that we've added our real experiences to over the years, with the intent of protecting both us AND the landlord. Beyond the Monthly Management, Placement & Maintenance fees, all other fees in our contract are IF EVENT -> THEN fees.
We don’t know any PMCs to recommend in the area mentioned, but since selecting the wrong PMC is usually more harmful than selecting a bad tenant, you might want to read our series about “How to Screen a PMC Better than a Tenant”:
We recommend you get management contracts from several PMCs and compare the services they cover and, more importantly, what they each DO NOT cover.
EDUCATE YOURSELF - yes, it will take time, but will lead to a selection that better meets your expectations & avoids potentially costly surprises!
P.S. If you just hire the cheapest or first PMC you speak with and it turns into a bad experience, please don’t assume ALL PMC’s are bad and start trashing PMC’s in general. Take ownership of your mistake and learn to do the proper due diligence recommended above😊
Logical Property Management4.9455 Reviews - 2yBryon AndrewsBusiness MemberReal Estate Agent · Saint Paul, MN · Member since 2018 · 201 posts · 104 votes
Hey @Thomas Hartman I just sent you a message. There are defenitly quite a few PM companies around the cities. I think you need to focus on who specifically works in your location. Each company have their own set of pros and cons.
- Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes2y
@Thomas Hartman what @Michael Smythe said is the rarely spoken truth, that there is no such thing as a "Good PMc", there is good PMc for you, good PMc for others, bad fit's and than just plain bad PMc's.
My agency is a goliath in the space, but were not a fit for everyone, and when interested persons first connect there often shocked that I start by telling them we need to first find out if were a fit for each other, vs just trying to sell.
Being a corporate entity means we have 24-7 coverage because we operate on a departmental construct. For some they love that. But some people want to be able to call and talk to the PMc owner at any moment of any day. Were not that, our pm's are too dang busy doing stuff and not hanging around just waiting to chit-chat. Is one good and the other bad? No, just different right.
Than there is different service potentials. We do active Property Management and Tenant Placement, and all transactional (R.E. Broker) services. So a person can use both TP and PM, or 1 and not the other. That's not universal. Some places only do a combined service, or just TP, or just PM.
And than on service tickets. We don't do on-staff maintenenance, we believe it's a conflict of interest when a PM also does maintenance 4-profit. Instead, we believe we are aligning interests with our client's by using outside vendors and managing the vendors. BUT, some people hate that and really want there PM out there plunging toilet's and spackling walls. Again, just different.
So starting with what other people think is a folly, unless you know you have the exact same likes, dislikes, needs and want's to that other investor, your only going to find what fit's for others, not yourself.
Your best course is to first write out your priority items, what you want your PMc to do, not to do, and how you'd like it done. Than, research what PMc's best match that. From there look to ratings, and keep in mind to consider tenant and landlord reviews separate. Our "hate" ratings are almost exclusively tenant, which I take as a big positive because when we ferret out a bad tenant what do you think they do, yup, take to a nasty review saying how horrible we are, we made them pay rent, assessed them for damages, refused them a lease that they wanted even though they have no job a 415 fico and 3 UD's on record but how dare this evil PM, lol.
There is now so many PMc's in the market that you can throw a stone and hit 4, so no lack of selection.
My personal thought's, I NEVER go with anyone who also does maintenance for profit, EVER. For me that IS a conflict of interest. And I find too often these teaser rates on PM services for them, and it's obvious that they will do PM for all but free because there going to maintenance ya to death. No thanks. It makes no sense having the one in charge of telling you if/when it needs maintenance has a profit motive for having maintenance. No, I want unbiased info, I want maintenance to be a shared pain in the azz. But that's me. You gotta decide what is your fit.
Do not use Active Property Management in St Paul. Go look at the buildings on Etna St in St Paul. They don't get permits for anything done to the property and the use themselves as they started their own Contracting Co so the win all bids but the work done devalues the property and they will not finish the incomplete jobs that have been done. It looks like a 3rd grader did the work.
- Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes2y
Quote from @NA Mombo:
Do not use Active Property Management in St Paul.....
Ok, any "noob" out there looking for a PM Property Manager and thinking "what do I look for" this above is a good example I will use, because in seconds it shows ALL the Red-Flag's.
When one googles this PMc, we readily find there google biz listing, and it has exactly 0 reviews, ZERO....... That should stop persons right there, that's not just "a" red-flag but "THE" red-flag.
Next, when we click on website link from google biz listing, it goes to a Homesnap page.... For those not in the know, Homesnap is one of those "free" sites to do whatever marketing of self, at least how it says of it, in truth it's trying to be a zillow in manner of driving traffic to sell leads.
This is another EPIC red-flag. When a PMc does NOT have there own website, does NOT have any online system for tenant's, no way for anyone to log into an account, make application etc etc.....
Next, what is the "free" reference site say?: "Ready to buy or sell?"..... Lol. Yeah, not 1 word of anything PM.
So, in about 40 seconds of research we find this so-called Property Management Company is only showing as connected with "a" singular person, has NO company website, has NO standard PM software/online systems for landlords or tenant's, is so "noob" that doesn't even have 1, ONE, review as of yet...... And on what reference page it does have, only speaks to buying or selling.....
Only after digging does 1 find an actual website for this "PM" that is, well it's not up to "par" let's leave it at that.
DO your simple SIMPLE front-line research on a PMc before jumping into bed with them. When hiring a PM your "buying" 2 things; Experience, and Service. If one DOESN'T have the experience, how can they be any form of "good" at the service? Experience comes from, experience.
A "good" PM, we can tell you stories for day's of when this happened, when that happened. So "if" anything come sup with your property under PM, odd's are it's not our 1st Rodeo, been-there-done-that and we readily know how to respond and act.
Does quality cost more..... in a way, if you ignore the giant risk and expense to go with "cheap".
In PM; "cheap" is expensive and "quality" returns.
- Member since 2024 · 19 posts · 2 votes1yI can speak from personal experience using Kleinman Property Management for my multi-family investment.
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