MEMPHIS INVESTMENT PROPERTIES Case Study

MEMPHIS INVESTMENT PROPERTIES Case Study

Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes

Greetings BiggerPockets!

Just last month, I started crawling, walking (& dare I say running) towards being a new real estate investor! Last night, I was reading the Morris Invest Case Study 2.0 (@tyler jahnke) and not only was it enlightening to see the trials and tribulations of his journey but it was astounding to see how the BiggerPockets community got so involved in the comment threads and how helpful everyone is. Truly incredible!

A little background about me: I work in a real estate development company as a Design & Construction Manager keeping an eye on Architects/Engineers and Contractors but I don't really work on the front end with Acquisitions, Proformas, etc. so investing is generally new to me but I learn quick :)

So, my journey begins...

Oct (week 3) - I began spending hours a days reading and researching about single family home rental investments and Turnkey investment properties around the nation. I read many articles on the best cities to invest and I started finding out about companies that specialize in this investment vehicle. 

Oct (week 4) - To make a long story shorter, I ended up making an offer on a 3 bed/2 bath on Scottsdale Ave near Parkway Village with the company Turnkey Properties (@alex craig) http://turnkeyinvestproperties.com/

I really appreciated their website and the information it provided such as the Sales Offering Packet which contained a lot of information including a detailed Scope of Work that they would perform on the property. 


I had a few Lenders lined up but when the rates started coming in, it sunk my Proforma and the Cash on Cash return and Cash Flow dropped significantly. So significantly, I had to drop out of the deal which really took the wind out of my sales.


Turnkey Properties returned my Ernest money because they said I was trying in good faith to stick to my end of the deal but my credit wasn't as good as I thought it was so the 5.5% rate, points and closing costs we're just too much. (4 years ago and beyond, I didn't really pay any school loans so that came to bite me on the ***!)

Hopefully, in the future, I will get the opportunity to work with the team at Turnkey Properties (@jeremy veldman) again because I had a favorable opinion of them up to the end.

Oct (week 5) - To make a short story longer, at some point in the journey, a Lender, Security National Mortgage Company (@aaron chapman) convinces me to pay my credit card to zero and they would rerun my credit score (Every month I pay it to zero but I guess when Lenders run credit scores, I must have had a high balance). I did and low and behold, my credit which was under 680 suddenly went above 680 which not-so-magically lowered my general rate.

One thing leads to another and I end up signing a purchase agreement on a 3 bed/1 bath on Avon Road near Berclair with Memphis Investment Properties (@james wachob @mark hart  ) http://memphisinvestmentproperties.net/

Nov (week 1) - A different Lender (Supreme Lending) offers me a lower rate than 5.0% with points which allows me to move forward with the Loan. I have signed all the Loans documents to date. Unfortunately, SNMC couldn't offer me a better rate but @aaron chapman congratulated me on it (he is a true gentlemen, which EVERYONE tells me he is!).

Nov (week 2) - Today, I received the Scope of Work from Memphis Investment Properties that is to be performed. In a few days, I will post before that Scope of Work and before photos and update the BP community on the progress.

The schedule is as follows which I will update periodically:

Nov (week 3) - Renovation

Nov (week 4) - Renovation

Nov (week 5) - Renovation

Dec (week 1) - Renovation complete.

Dec (week 2) - Home & Termite Inspection to be performed. Home Inspection report issues to be rectified.

Dec (week 3) - I plan on visiting Memphis and walk the final product, meet Memphis Investment Properties team including Property Management.

Dec 18 - Close on the deal.

Questions and Comments are MORE than welcome!!!

7Reply
562 views

Most Popular Reply

Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
8y

@Victor H nieves  that's more realistic  and you do have a lease fee of one months rent when you get a new tenant and if you own this 10 years you will have 4 to 5 lease fee's minimum .. unless management takes a very reduced fee or you get lucky and get a long term tenant.

pretty much anyone buying 1% or so rule property is going to net 5 to 8% COC with 20% down.. over time.. and if you get that tenant from hell you will net nothing or go in the negative.

If you get a great tenant that stays for years does not damage ( pretty rare frankly) then you could do better.

but its best to be realistic than to do blue sky performa's and then be disappointed later ..

the idea behind these rentals is very much lost in the cash flow is king debate.. the idea behind owning rentals is to get them paid for as QUICK as possible.. that's when you loving life.. up until then its managing expense's and you should put every dime back into them to pay down debt and or keep them in good shape.. the other thing is you should be buying were there is a reasonable expectation that values will climb some what you need that to offset sales cost when you do finally exit.

Now many folks I fund over the years they are buying with the intention of never selling and they have goals to own 100 or more.. I help them get to that goal.. and have done it many times one of my clients I have funded has over 250 rentals and self manages them all.. its their business its what they do and so on and so forth.. and they only take a little of the cash flow out for themselves the rest goes to pay down their debt so they can at the end of some time have decent equity.. I am NOT a refi till you die guy I don't believe in that at all.. I am a get property paid for guy.. and the most successful private owners I now have little to no debt. that's when you really cash flow.. If you had no debt you would be at 450 a month with MY expense numbers that's where you want to be..

See this reply in the discussion

148 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • ARRT, RT(R) / Rental Property Investor · Newport Beach, CA · Member since 2017 · 360 posts · 242 votes
    8y

    Nice,@Caleb Heimsoth. 20 properties by 30, you should be at a comfortable $5,000.00 positive

    cash flow monthly, easy breezy. 

    Good for you!  (Double~Post!!...Sorry!)

    Daniel F. Harb

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y

    @Caleb Heimsoth  that's the concept many of my note investors have.. they buy a few notes are making 700 to 1000 a month.. add 10k to it and in the first year they buy another now they are making 1200 to 1400 add ten k to it and buy another and the next thing you know 10 years down the line they have millions in notes paying them enough to actually live on.

    all you kids at your age are so FAR ahead of us old geezers we did not have the internet there was no real financing .. hell I was still using carbon paper when I started in this game and was your age :)

    keep at it you will be a rock star before you know it.. also keep in mind what your buying today you will NOT being buying in 5 years.. its a natural progression.. you will be looking at other cool deals and other ways to make money in and around real estate that do not include tenants.. that's been my experience and many of my cleints.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Caleb Heimsoth:

    @Jay Hinrichs eventually I’d like to have the option to live on my cash flow if I wanted to, but given my personality I feel like I’d go bored if I just “retired” in say my 30s or 40s.  Now i could see how taking like pro longed vacations of say a week or two at a time could be appealing but full on retirement just seems unlikely.  

    In my late 20s or early 30s I plan to just take a year or two off from buying and pay down existing debt very aggressively.  

     not that I wanted to but the timber business I did from 92 to 2001 was very seasonal here in the Northwest and my partner went to Maui after elk hunting season and I stayed at my home in the Napa valley basically playing golf 5 days a week.. maybe a little snow skiing.. and I got board of it after a few years.. that's when I decided to fire back up and chase foreclosures and fire my Lending license back up... but nothing wrong at all with stopping to smell the roses.. and for me personally real estate I love it .. its a lifestyle always has been.. has not been all wine and roses think 08 to 2010 when I lost millions.. but I would not trade it for anything.. Other than I grew up in Cupertino and I should have taken that job with Apple in 1982... :)

  • ARRT, RT(R) / Rental Property Investor · Newport Beach, CA · Member since 2017 · 360 posts · 242 votes
    8y

    Carbon Paper, Ha!!  Funny, @Jay Hinrichs!  Seriously, @Caleb Heimsoth is so ahead of his time at 23!  He will be a multi~millionaire someday, for sure.  :)

    Most kids his age have no clue, as they sit in their "Underwater Basket~Weaving" class...

    ~Daniel

  • Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    8y

    @Jay Hinrichs  yeah I know you’reore involved in the lending or note investing side of things and personally I could see myself doing that down the line.  Specifically investing in note funds seems very interesting to me.  I don’t know enough about it, but I could see myself doing it.

    Right now I think the natural progression leads me to partnering with people I know down the road to buy larger deals (like small apartment complexes).  Right now I enjoy my day job but eventually I think my entrepreneurial itch will get the best of me. 

    In 5 years I hope to be buying 4-5 homes a year instead of two or so.  Could end up being more.  I like to set realistic goals and if I reach them ahead of schedule, I’ll set higher ones.

  • Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    8y

    @Jay Hinrichs when you think about missing out on that job with Apple in 1982, just remember the third co-founder of Apple sold his 10 percent for less than 1000 bucks lol.  That’s worth almost 100 Billion today.  

    Sounds like you had a nice mini retirement, for a bit there.  I enjoy the occasional golf but don’t think I can play that often lol.

    @Daniel F. Harb I sure hope that happens some day!  Right now I just try to save as much as possible me invest (real estate and other wise).  Blows my mind that half of Americans don’t own any stock.  If I’m feeling really risky I’ll buy some bitcoin lol

  • ARRT, RT(R) / Rental Property Investor · Newport Beach, CA · Member since 2017 · 360 posts · 242 votes
    8y

    Ha! Bitcoin is crazy~amazing, but I would never touch it. Fun to watch. After I saw a couple hundred thousand go up in smoke in all High~Tech stocks in 2002(?), I have lost my appetite for individual stocks or otherwise. :)

    All my investments are in Index Funds. Captures the entire market. This past year has returned @ 27.89%, and over the last 5 year returns, 15.95%.

    Time to diversify into RE!

    Cheers!

  • Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2017 · 35 posts · 12 votes
    8y

    Thanks Victor for sharing this case study. It will be very eye opening for anyone considering a turnkey investment in Memphis.  The TK providers make it sound so easy to cash flow, but they often use very aggressive, if not unrealistic, assumptions. I am originally from the Memphis area and still visit family there often.  Crime is rampant in Memphis proper and many turnkey properties are in war zones.

  • Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    8y
    Daniel F. Harb you’re right to go with the passive index funds, that’s what I use. I think I’m at around 20 percent since I started in March of 2016. Obviously this won’t continue every year. I think a good mixture of real estate and index funds makes for a great portfolio for most people.
  • ARRT, RT(R) / Rental Property Investor · Newport Beach, CA · Member since 2017 · 360 posts · 242 votes
    8y

    Precisely right, @Caleb Heimsoth. Excellent you have Index Funds as well. With these, for the long term, we will do very well. And talk about low management fees!  .03% with Charles Schwab. Nice! Saving money is a beautiful thing.

    So is making money!  $$$

    ~Daniel

  • Curt DavisBusiness Member
    Flipper/Rehabber · Memphis, TN · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y

    I am surprised this home did t need one of the following; roof, hvac, hot water tank. 

    Curt Davis - KAIZEN Realty538 Reviews
  • Sacramento, CA · Member since 2017 · 20 posts · 28 votes
    8y

    Thanks Victor for sharing your experience.  I'm in the same boat as you but still researching which TK to go with in memphis.  What make you pick your turnkey company over memphis invest, memphis turnkey, etc?

    Looking forward to your numbers for your current deal!

  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y

    @Jon Zhou You can research the forums, etc but from my understanding, all 3 are reputable and experienced companies but they offer differences (Turnkey Properties, Memphis Invest and MIP). My advice would be to look at their websites, review properties, have an introductory call, crunch some #s, due diligence, etc and you'll form your opinion on what to do next.

    Once a renter is secured, I will post my #s.

  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y

    @Curt Davis Yes both new AC and new water heater were provided. Roof is approx. 5 years old (I visited the property and it looked in good shape). Also I am awaiting the home inspection report which was performed last week.

  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y

    @Robert Carraway Crime is definitely # 1 on my lists to avoid and depending on the property, it can be in a warzone or not. This property is not in a warzone (I visited it as well), many are, many are not (I check Trulia crime maps & other sources).

    Regarding cash flow, yes...we have to create our own assumptions to determine our bottom line. We CAN NOT rely on the provider.

  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Eddie T.:

    @Victor H nieves who is your contact person at Supreme lending group? Do you know if they lend to LLC

    Reach out to Laura Lloyd & Laura Hollis @ supremelending.com

  • Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2017 · 35 posts · 12 votes
    8y

    @ Looks like your latest house is in the Hickory Hill area.  That's better than Berclair.  I would also avoid Frayer (a TK favorite), Orange Mound and Whitehaven. Best of luck and keep us posted.

  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Robert Carraway:

    @ Looks like your latest house is in the Hickory Hill area.  That's better than Berclair.  I would also avoid Frayer (a TK favorite), Orange Mound and Whitehaven. Best of luck and keep us posted.

     I went by Berclair, that area was an ok working neighborhood as well....at least for that price point , crime was LOW on Trulia maps.

  • Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2017 · 35 posts · 12 votes
    8y

    @Victor H nieves That's interesting.  When I look at Beclair on Trulia, there's a fair amount of crime.  It's definitely not the worst, but I wouldn't call it low crime.  If you are looking for a property in NE Memphis, Raleigh or Bartlett have less crime.

  • Curt DavisBusiness Member
    Flipper/Rehabber · Memphis, TN · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Robert Carraway:

    @ Looks like your latest house is in the Hickory Hill area.  That's better than Berclair.  I would also avoid Frayer (a TK favorite), Orange Mound and Whitehaven. Best of luck and keep us posted.

     Robert, most legit turnkey companies in our market avoid Frayser. I can only think of really one that sells a lot of them in that area. Whitehaven for us has been a solid market for several years. Berclair is a great area of you are I  true Beeclair. 

    Curt Davis - KAIZEN Realty538 Reviews
  • Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2017 · 35 posts · 12 votes
    8y

    @Curt Davis Hi, Curt.  Glad to hear you avoid Frayser, but as you noted at least one other large TK in Memphis puts a lot of out of state investors there. You're right there's a difference between Frayser/Orange Mound and Berclair/Whitehaven. I didn't mean to imply they were all the same, just to provide a little caution.  I think it is a stretch to call Berclair or Whitehaven a low crime area.  A more accurate description would be moderate.  That's not to say there's not opportunity there, but an OOS investor really needs to do their due diligence.

  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Robert Carraway:

    @Victor H nieves That's interesting.  When I look at Beclair on Trulia, there's a fair amount of crime.  It's definitely not the worst, but I wouldn't call it low crime.  If you are looking for a property in NE Memphis, Raleigh or Bartlett have less crime.

     Berclair on Trulia shows "low crime", I'm just stating what it shows. I don't live there so I cant define what "low" means.

  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y

    UPDATE:

    I'm reaching the home stretch and I really appreciate everyone's comments especially @Jay Hinrichs !!!

    JAN 3

    • Home Inspection. No major issues as anticipated.

    JAN 4

    • Appraisal received. No major issues as anticipated.

    UPCOMING:

    • fund remaining Closing Costs and Loan Amount.
    • sign Property Management agreement.
    • acquire Tenant.
    • Collect some RENTS!!!
  • Investor · Miami Beach, FL · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 64 votes
    8y

    Also here is the scope of work since I didn't post it before (I don't think I did).

    SCOPE OF WORK:

    • Roof - Approximately 5 year old
    • Exterior- Home will be painted
    • Window Repair- Repair or replace any broken windows and repair all rotten wood
    • Pressure Wash- Clean dirt and other debris off of the exterior of the home
    • Landscape - Trim grass and shrubbery and add fresh mulch
    • New Mailbox
    • New HVAC- Brand new system with caged condenser (includes new furnace)
    • Plumbing repair- Repair plumbing system to ensure proper function and install new water heater
    • Iron Security Doors x 2- Iron doors to be installed
    • Rekey- All doors to the property
    • Electrical Repair- Perform an inspection to ensure all outlets are in working order
    • Interior Paint- New paint on walls and trim where needed. Sheetrock will be repaired on all walls
      beforehand if needed
    • Flooring- new Resilient Plank Vinyl Flooring in living room and 1st floor bedroom and new carpet 2nd floor bedroom.
      upstairs.
    • Kitchen Repair- Paint cabinets and add new formica countertops with granite look where applicable. Install new dishwasher and new ventahood. (plumbing fixtures were replaced)
    • Bathroom- Repair or replace all bathroom toilets, sinks, tile, vanity, shower heads and bathtub (plumbing fixtures were replaced)
    • Dumpster- To haul away debris
    • Hardware Package- Replace all door knobs, blinds, A/C vent covers, light fixtures, and receptacles
    • Final Clean- Deep interior clean to get property camera ready for professional final rental listing photos
  • Investor · Lehi, UT · Member since 2015 · 435 posts · 300 votes
    8y

    FYI all The property that @Victor H nieves was thinking about buying on 849 Avon Road rented today at $950/mo. 

Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.