listed house that i feel i could get much cheeper with dealing directly with owner

Buying & Selling Real Estate

listed house that i feel i could get much cheeper with dealing directly with owner

Investor · Cortlandt Manor, NY · Member since 2015 · 63 posts · 10 votes

ok so here is the story there is a sfr in my target area listed for 105k needs tons of work and was built in 1860 so updating is a must the comps are around 220 and taxes around 8k now from talking to the owner directly it seemed as though a cash offer of 75k would buy the house. now here where it gets stupid the house is listed with an agent so i set up an appointment through my agent put in an offer of 75k with a 30% down payment and a 10 day closing the listing agent without calling the owner to even ask told my agent no way and pretty much hung the phone up on her. now 3 or four days go by and i run into the owner at the store and she asks what happened i thought u liked the house i told her what happened and she's now angry at her agent because she liked my offer i guess my question is any way to get around an agent just out for her personal commission and not the interest of the seller

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Hattiesburg, MS · Member since 2015 · 3 posts · 1 vote

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In my state and in most every state that I have looked into what the listing agent did was against the law. i would simply have my agent call her broker and ask him if he has recently read page x (what ever page in your state) of the licensing law latley. I would add that you don't feel the need to bring the Real Estate Licensing Authorities in at this point. That your agent and you would like to keep this just between the agents and have him rpesent the offer and let it be a teaching moment for his listing agent. Which he will be so so so quick to do. Licenses are at stake here. Now they may insiste that the offer is in writting but that is ok too.

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Randy E.
Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
11y
First, I'd argue that getting the highest price (in a reasonable amount of time) is one way a listing agent looks out for the best interests of her client.
On the other hand, if the seller has told you she will accept your offer of $75K, all you need to do is tell the seller to inform her agent that $75K is all she's looking for. After that, there should be no problem.
It could be that the agent was told by the seller to list at $105. Also, since it doesn't sound like your agent actually delivered a signed contract offer, I'm not sure the listing agent has a duty to report a simple verbal inquiry to the seller.
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John Oitice
OP
Investor · Cortlandt Manor, NY · Member since 2015 · 63 posts · 10 votes
11y
she wrote the offer using my hot spot in the car with me i watched it get sent
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Elbert Barton
Hattiesburg, MS · Member since 2015 · 3 posts · 1 vote
11y
In my state and in most every state that I have looked into what the listing agent did was against the law. i would simply have my agent call her broker and ask him if he has recently read page x (what ever page in your state) of the licensing law latley. I would add that you don't feel the need to bring the Real Estate Licensing Authorities in at this point. That your agent and you would like to keep this just between the agents and have him rpesent the offer and let it be a teaching moment for his listing agent. Which he will be so so so quick to do. Licenses are at stake here. Now they may insiste that the offer is in writting but that is ok too.
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Elbert Barton
Hattiesburg, MS · Member since 2015 · 3 posts · 1 vote
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oos should have proof read that better but think you get teh point.
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John Oitice
OP
Investor · Cortlandt Manor, NY · Member since 2015 · 63 posts · 10 votes
11y
i got it thanks on the phone with my agent now thank you
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Elbert Barton
Hattiesburg, MS · Member since 2015 · 3 posts · 1 vote
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Best of luck. Trust me they don't want any trouble with the licensing folks. Iwill bet you will get your offer excepted real fast. Keep us up dated, please.
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Bob B.
Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
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Would she be able to fire her agent for not performing and sell it directly?
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John Oitice
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Investor · Cortlandt Manor, NY · Member since 2015 · 63 posts · 10 votes
11y
will do
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Brian G.
Entrepreneur · Miami, FL · Member since 2013 · 133 posts · 83 votes
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@John Oitice first shame on the listing agent for not presenting all written offers to the seller. Now whats important (to you) is to secure the deal. On the front end, ask your agent to obtain a written rejection of your offer (no more verbal exchanges). If the listing agent refuses have your agent turn the heat on by contacting the listing broker. By the way, a sharp buyer's agent should of have pursued these venues before coming back to you with a poor story "listing agent said no and hung-up on me". On the back end, let the seller know you resubmitted your offer. If seller is not playing any games by now he should be demanding to review of all offers received. You should be getting an answer soon.
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John Oitice
OP
Investor · Cortlandt Manor, NY · Member since 2015 · 63 posts · 10 votes
11y
thanks for all the help had my agent re submit the offer so I should hear back shortly and will post the details
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Jennifer Talcott
Brandon, FL · Member since 2014 · 55 posts · 13 votes
11y
I am not an attorney, and anything I write on this forum is strictly my own opinion, or an account of my own personal experiences. I recommend consulting your attorney in all matters related to the law.
Ok, I assume that every state has its own laws governing real estate but, I believe that in some states a listing agent is not required to present certain offers if the seller signs an agreement to that effect. However, I think most standard listing agreements usually require the listing agent to present all formal/written offers to the seller.
Have your agent check with her broker first (brokers are supposed to know the real estate laws), but she could maybe present the written offer directly to the seller if the listing agent refuses to. Truth is, if you get a paper copy of the offer, you might be able to take the offer directly to the seller yourself (depends on the laws in your area). However, if your agent's broker talks to the listing agent's broker, it's quite possible that the issue could be resolved that way, and nobody would need to circumvent the listing agent.
Depending on the listing agreement, it's likely that even if you or your agent circumvents the listing agent in presenting the offer, the seller will probably still wind up having to pay her listing agent's commission in the end. She would need to check her listing agreement to find out.
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Crystal SmithPro Member
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Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
11y
@John Oitice we had a situation similar to yours on a property in the Carolina's. We found the property on Craig's list, contacted the owner, saw the property and made a verbal offer, which he accepted. He told us the property was listed so he was obligated to have the offer go thru the listing broker. We contacted the listing agent; provided her w/ our written offer. Waited a couple of days & didn't get a response, not an acceptance, counter or rejection. We called the seller & discovered she did not submit our offer. We were both shocked. If his agent had a better offer on the table then we would understand why our offer wasn't submitted, but the seller didn't have a better offer. We discussed 2 choices w/ the seller: Have the seller call the broker & insist our offer be submitted or 2 submit our offer direct to the seller.
We agreed with the seller on option 2. There's nothing to prevent a seller from accepting an offer on a property direct from a buyer. He was still obligated to pay a commission to the listing agent.
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John Oitice
OP
Investor · Cortlandt Manor, NY · Member since 2015 · 63 posts · 10 votes
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that's just crazy why do they do that
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Randy E.
Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
11y
Originally posted by @John Oitice:
she wrote the offer using my hot spot in the car with me i watched it get sent
Oh. I guess that covers it. I was unsure before that an actual written offer had been submitted. I was under the impression only a verbal offer was given.
If it was a written offer, as the others have said, the agent should have presented it to the seller.
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Edward Shin
Real Estate Investor · Los Angeles · Member since 2011 · 20 posts · 8 votes
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Hm. I guess that someone who believes in the integrity of the agent could argue that they did not submit the offer because they were looking out for the best interests of their client and was confident that another, better offer would come along shortly. A more cynical view might suggest that the agent wants to secure the highest commission possible, so they either pooh-pooh any "low" offers to the seller, or simply (as in your case) don't submit them at all.
I remember hearing that one investor, whenever submitting low offers, includes that "buyer reserves the right to present offer in person." That way, they could ensure that they could present their offer without any potential interference from the seller's agent, and make sure that the offer was presented. They would simply tell the seller that "your agent was kind enough to have me come along so that i could present my offer to you directly." The seller usually didn't realize or care that the buyer was there because of the inclusion of that clause in the contract, the seller's agent was spoken of in an ingratiating fashion, and the investor could present their offer in the most favorable light.
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Wayne Brooks
Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
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@Edward Shin
@Edward Shin While that may sound good, it has no merit. Nothing a buyer puts in an offer creates any obligation on the seller's agent, or the seller. I've seen these attempts, and simply ignored them.
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Richard Dunlop
Investor · Detroit, MI · Member since 2014 · 755 posts · 462 votes
11y
Originally posted by @Jennifer Talcott:

..., it's likely that even if you or your agent circumvents the listing agent in presenting the offer, the seller will probably still wind up having to pay her listing agent's commission in the end. She would need to check her listing agreement to find out.
The seller's agent could not present the offer but could write it up and buyer could give seller a copy.
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Joe Cummings
Philly Burbs, PA · Member since 2015 · 338 posts · 133 votes
11y
I run into this all the time. Realtors want a high commission so they don't submit low offers.
Want to make it worse, try making a trade (barter) with the property owner when there is a Realtor involved.
I'm in the rigging business. Sometimes I buy and sell machinery. I'm looking to buy commercial property. Some of the customers are still in business at other locations.
Try making an offer for 250 in cash, and a late model low hour Toyota forklift ($10,000 value) through a Realtor.
I've pulled a wad of cash out of my pocket already and said "What, are you worried about losing a couple hundred in commission, I'll make it up"
I've never seen people so afraid of hundred dollar bills in my life. Personally I think most of them are gun shy pussies
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Joel OwensBusiness Member
Moderator
Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
11y
Bottom line is many agents are new or part time. That means intentionally or not they make mistakes. Verbal offers in some states are deemed to be valid but not enforceable in a court of law.
As mentioned in some states if a seller in writing instructs an agent not to present offers below XX amount or terms then they do not have to. This all varies state to state on local license laws and state statute codes.
The brokers have the client relationship with the buyers and sellers. The agents are simply working on behalf of the brokerage. The commission belongs to the brokerage in about every state I have seen.
When you represent a buyer or seller as a client and not a customer then you have certain obligations to them. The main one is to have a fiduciary duty to put their needs ahead of your own. This provision goes away generally if they are doing something illegal or ask you to hide material defects that are known.
In license law as mentioned I have seen provisions where if a buyer or the buyers broker has made a REASONABLE attempt to go through the sellers broker then they can contact the seller directly. This all varies by state so you really have to drill down what your rights are.
No legal advice given.
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