Doing Probate as a Wholesaler

Buying & Selling Real Estate
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Doing Probate as a Wholesaler

Kim Hawkinson
Real Estate Investor · Member since 2010 · 61 posts · 12 votes

I'm reading up on how to start doing Probate deals and I'm super stoked b/c there's a lot of good information on this site so thanks for that everyone. I did have one question though. I see a lot of the time that I should tell the executor that I can make a cash offer and close in a couple of days, getting them excited about getting rid of the property.

Well there's a reason I'm wholesaling: I have no money of my own. Any yes, I have a somewhat small buyers list but I'm not sure how many of them are "cash buyers". Should I start asking thise individuals who want to be on my buyers list how they purchase their proerties and do they have access to funds? Also, Let's say I find a property that I THINK a few of my buyers might be interested in. Should I settle on a price with the executor and THEN market to my buyers or should I settle on a price and then market to the vast number of networking site that are out there. Unfortuanately, I'm one of those people who want to know EVERYTHING up front. Pretty impossible, I know, but I want to try and arm myself with as much knowledge before hand.

Please let me know what you think. Thank you!!!!

Kim

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Joe Dube
Real Estate Investor · Palm Harbor, FL · Member since 2009 · 79 posts · 76 votes
16y

Great stuff Charles, thanks for the link.

Kim,

Probates have been the type of deal that have made me the biggest checks. The way I go about finding them is using an absentee owners list. You not only get probate deals, you also get tired land lords, divorce cases, and folks that want to get rid of their vacation property. I get a list of absentee owners that currently own property in my county. Everyone that has a last sale date of 20 years or greater are my targeted sellers. All the folks with a last sale date of 6 months ago to today are my BUYERS. So basically all you need is one list for sellers and buyers. The absentee owners that have purchased a home within the last 6 months will typically be a land lord or a rehabber. Make sure to contact them by mail or phone if possible. Send up a smoke signal, you get the idea. All you need is a handful of cash buyers my friend and you'll be well on your way. I definitely ask as many questions as possible about their buying criteria and get all their contact info. also. A couple other quick ways to get cash buyers is go to the for rent section of craigslist and ask if they need more houses for their portfolio. While your at it ask them about their friends needs as well. I always ask if they have any houses to sell or if their friends have any to sell also. I also find cash buyers from the section 8 list, those guys are land lords so get a hold of them and ask your questions then get these guys some houses.

Hope this helps...

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  • Account Closed
    Landlord · Seattle, WA · Member since 2010 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    16y

    You might want to check out this link. I asked what do you ask when building a buyers lists and got some good insights.

    http://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/93/topics/53979-what-do-you-ask-when-building-a-buyers-list

    2Reply
  • Joe Dube
    Real Estate Investor · Palm Harbor, FL · Member since 2009 · 79 posts · 76 votes
    16y

    Great stuff Charles, thanks for the link.

    Kim,

    Probates have been the type of deal that have made me the biggest checks. The way I go about finding them is using an absentee owners list. You not only get probate deals, you also get tired land lords, divorce cases, and folks that want to get rid of their vacation property. I get a list of absentee owners that currently own property in my county. Everyone that has a last sale date of 20 years or greater are my targeted sellers. All the folks with a last sale date of 6 months ago to today are my BUYERS. So basically all you need is one list for sellers and buyers. The absentee owners that have purchased a home within the last 6 months will typically be a land lord or a rehabber. Make sure to contact them by mail or phone if possible. Send up a smoke signal, you get the idea. All you need is a handful of cash buyers my friend and you'll be well on your way. I definitely ask as many questions as possible about their buying criteria and get all their contact info. also. A couple other quick ways to get cash buyers is go to the for rent section of craigslist and ask if they need more houses for their portfolio. While your at it ask them about their friends needs as well. I always ask if they have any houses to sell or if their friends have any to sell also. I also find cash buyers from the section 8 list, those guys are land lords so get a hold of them and ask your questions then get these guys some houses.

    Hope this helps...

    27Reply
  • Jerry PuckettPro Member
    Wholesaler · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    16y

    Excelent tips Joe, thanks. I'd never even considered using my mailing list that way. Makes sense.

    1Reply
  • Craig Kisinger
    Real Estate Investor · Copley, OH · Member since 2009 · 10 posts · 1 vote
    16y

    Thanks for the help, Joe

    You've added valuable info to this forum!

    0Reply
  • Kim Hawkinson
    OP
    Real Estate Investor · Member since 2010 · 61 posts · 12 votes
    16y

    Definitely Joe. Thanks for all the info. I'll let you know how everything goes!!

    Kim

    1Reply
  • Tadd Bennett
    Investor · El Centro, CA · Member since 2010 · 44 posts · 34 votes
    16y

    Kudos Joe,
    I actually use those same practices you speak of and its been working like a charm. As for building a buyers list i actually have used bandit signs as well. I put something like


    Really Cheap
    Home 4 Sale
    $.30cent On The Dollar
    Must Sell Now
    Call
    ( untraceable #)

    Once Investors start calling in, simply let them know that unfortunately the property has sold hrs after putting up the signs but if you could ask him/her a few q's you would be more than happy to put them on your special buyers list. By doing so you will let them know 24hrs in advance about a property before marketing to the public. With this practice I've been able to pick up some extremely solid cash buyers. Works like a charm.

    P.S I got this idea from our own Andrew Massaro

    Kim,
    To answer your ?s. You always want to get everything under contract first so to not lose the deal. You never want to market something you cant deliver to you investor in the end. Its a quick way to lose your credibility and your buyers. Once i get a property under contract I run it buy my investors via email. Whosoever interested will then contact me and it eliminates me trying to hunt down and bother people. If that doesn't work you always have the option to hit websites, newspapers and if you must, Bandit signs. Always remember its a lot harder finding deals than buyers, if you get a good enough deal your investors should be all over it.

    Any q's or concerns feel free to shoot me an email or PM. I would be more than happy to answer any Q's and help you out as best i can. Good luck Kim

    Rian.

    4Reply
  • Francis Dai
    Member since 2010 · 26 posts · 5 votes
    16y

    Joe, where do you find the list of absentee owners? Is it through Melissa Data?

    1Reply
  • Dustin Johns
    Real Estate Agent · Columbia, SC · Member since 2009 · 93 posts · 6 votes
    16y

    I would like to know where the absentee list is available as well?

    0Reply
  • Joe Dube
    Real Estate Investor · Palm Harbor, FL · Member since 2009 · 79 posts · 76 votes
    16y

    Hi Guys,

    Thanks for all the LOVE :cool: .

    I get my list from the county appraiser's office. I tell them the data I want in the spread sheet and they send it to me on a CD. It only costs $45.00 for 50,000 names. I send these folks a post card through click2mail or a hand written letter introducing myself and asking if they would be interested in selling their house to me. It works great and for buyers I use bandit signs also Rian. I learned lots of tricks from the boys here in Tampa, Andy used to handle Preston Ely's coaching program, he's a solid guy. I've got only good things to say about those guys and Mike Collins too, I've learned a lot from them. Let me know if you need more details and I'll oblige, make sure you have the county or data service provide the last sale date for you so you can separate the buyers and sellers.

    Hope this helps...
    Dubeman

    3Reply
  • Ryan Johnson
    Real Estate Consultant · Saint Paul, MN · Member since 2009 · 55 posts · 4 votes
    15y

    All I can say is that I we fully second Joe's approach!

    Pursuing absentee/out of state owner lists is an approach we've been practicing to bide our time and keep a pulse in the midst of this 'dry' spell before the levy breaks.

    I think that one of the best advantages is that approach draws leads from so many situations.

    Having a clearly defined buyers list turns the absentee owner list into gold and can save a great deal of marketing costs as you can filter for properties in areas and price ranges dictated by the requests of your buyers list.

    When something clicks and the phone rings your operation of funneling deals to the proper channels will seal the deal!

    But I'm cautiously optimistic about the coming wave of inventory, and am ready to be wrong. If I'm wrong it's probate and absentee wholesaling into buy and hold. On the other hand if the flood happens having a sturdy buyers list of the best cash buyers with the quickest turn around is going to be leveraged advantage!

    Buy/Hold isn't in my cards yet, the operations/procedures are in the works, but the fact that there is the real chance of an impending flood of inventory; This tells me to hold off so I can pick up long term properties at the lower price where every dollar I can invest will go that much further.

    Some may say we've hit the bottom, but both Mike Jacka and I hold the belief that shadow inventory exists unsustainably. This is growing larger until reality grinds the shadow barrier releasing the inventory that's been withheld all this time.

    With these properties spending more time in the shadows they are literally rotting from neglect and jilted homeowners wear 'n tear.

    I'd love to see some more probate discussion because that will be one technique that will be relevant no matter what the environment because of the unique characteristics of probate situations.

    People will pass away no matter what the market and probate pain relief will always be in demand.

    0Reply
  • Jeffrey K.
    Real Estate Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 671 votes
    15y

    If you do enough deals your title company will give you the data also.

    On the topic of wholesale probate. As many know I am not big on wholesalers. I think it is a really bad idea on a moral level to promise something to a next of kin of a dead person that you cant deliver on. If you have some cash and want to go after these deals great, but to trying to pull a fast one on the family of a dead person is not the way I would want to live my life.

    0Reply
  • Johnny P.
    Real Estate Broker · Orlando, FL · Member since 2008 · 181 posts · 66 votes
    15y

    This is why you tell the sellers upfront what your intentions are.

    Me: "I'm going to try and resell this property to one of my cash investors for a profit"

    Seller: "Sounds great I cant wait to sell"

    thats all there is to it... NO LYING INVOLVED

    sometimes the homeowner doesn't want you to lock up their property in a contract so you can just add a special clause along these lines-

    "if XYZ company does not find the end buyer this contract is void"

    Whatever it takes to give the seller peace of mind that you wont try to dominate them if they find their own buyer

    4Reply
  • James Hiddle
    Altus, OK · Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 690 votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Johnny P.:
    This is why you tell the sellers upfront what your intentions are.

    Me: "I'm going to try and resell this property to one of my cash investors for a profit"

    Seller: "Sounds great I cant wait to sell"

    thats all there is to it... NO LYING INVOLVED

    sometimes the homeowner doesn't want you to lock up their property in a contract so you can just add a special clause along these lines-

    "if XYZ company does not find the end buyer this contract is void"

    Whatever it takes to give the seller peace of mind that you wont try to dominate them if they find their own buyer

    Honesty is always the best policy.

    0Reply
  • Jeffrey K.
    Real Estate Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 671 votes
    15y

    It almost never works in real life though. If the seller thinks there is more value there they are going to want to capture it themselves. Johnny and James, how many deals have you wholesaled with that line?

    0Reply
  • Jerry PuckettPro Member
    Wholesaler · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Jeffrey Koenig:
    It almost never works in real life though. If the seller thinks there is more value there they are going to want to capture it themselves.


    And you know what Jeffrey? If they want to try, they are more than welcome. Buy if they were able to find their own buyer, they wouldn't be calling me. Why does wholesaling have to equate with pulling a fast one? And I really don't get the moral disconnect with probates. The fact of the matter is that every single one of these folks I've met have really wanted to sell their property. Quickly. With out hassle. As is. That all points to a wholesaler IMHO....
    8Reply
  • Chris M.
    Real Estate Investor · Orlando, FL · Member since 2008 · 12 posts · 13 votes
    15y

    The few who want to hold that property, clean it and market it will do exactly that. Most want to move on past it and appreciate the help of wholesalers.

    As long as the wholesaler is doing everything legally and honestly, I don't see how helping someone sell their property is a bad thing?

    2Reply
  • Ibrahim Hughes
    Real Estate Consultant · Bloomfield, NJ · Member since 2010 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Jeffrey Koenig:
    It almost never works in real life though. If the seller thinks there is more value there they are going to want to capture it themselves. Johnny and James, how many deals have you wholesaled with that line?


    Jeffrey what I tell my wholesalers is that "I buy houses to fix up (which I do) and if I'm tied up with too many projects, I find houses for other Investors. So this is likely a project I will find for another Investor and he pays me, not you." And they've never had a problem with it.
    2Reply
  • Ibrahim Hughes
    Real Estate Consultant · Bloomfield, NJ · Member since 2010 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y

    I meant what I tell my SELLERS.

    0Reply
  • Jeffrey K.
    Real Estate Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 671 votes
    15y

    I still have not heard how many deals your are doing and how much money you are making?

    Real esate is what I do for a living. It gets a bad name because of wholesalers and slumlords. What really gets me is all the extra hoops and language that has to be signed when buying an reo because of banks being burned in the past by wholesalers.

    If they want to sell for top dollar they will get an agent and sell it in "as-is" condition on the MLS. Paying the realtor 6% will be about what you guys make in profit and the deal will be exposed to more people (including your "buyers list").

    0Reply
  • Chris T.
    Wholesaler · Amarillo, TX · Member since 2008 · 369 posts · 75 votes
    15y

    Hi Jeffrey,

    If everyone walked around with a bag of gold then they could be as cool as you!

    1Reply
  • Jerry PuckettPro Member
    Wholesaler · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Jeffrey Koenig:
    I

    If they want to sell for top dollar they will get an agent and sell it in "as-is" condition on the MLS. Paying the realtor 6% will be about what you guys make in profit and the deal will be exposed to more people (including your "buyers list").


    And how long would their property sit on the market? My experience with realtors is that time is on their side. They list a property but do very little to market it. It's rare when I can't get a property sold within 30 days, max.

    If I hear you correctly Jeffrey, what your saying is that wholesalers and slumlords are responsible for you having to work so hard. Not bad business people. Do the banks that you are having to jump through hoops for bear some responsibility for the predatory lending practices which caused a market collapse and created an inventory of REO property for you to chase? Not to mention the credit crunch and tougher lending regulations in general?

    Be careful with your stereo types sir. No one likes wearing a label. I don't expect you to change your mind, but maybe you could open it up a little.

    7Reply
  • Jeffrey K.
    Real Estate Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 671 votes
    15y

    I do not want to live in a nanny state. The banks were and are trying to make money. If you did not understand a product or took a loan you could not afford to pay back it is your fault.

    Chris, when I invest in metals I stick to platinum as it takes up less space in the vault.

    Buying an REO or other property with a POF that you paid for and do not have the money to back is sketchy in my mind. I might be old fashioned but thats just me. In life and in business, when I say I am going to do something I do it.

    0Reply
  • Kim Hawkinson
    OP
    Real Estate Investor · Member since 2010 · 61 posts · 12 votes
    15y

    Well I'm glad to see that we can talk about this like adults:)

    Thank you everyone for the insight. It is more than greatly appreciated.

    Jeremy, if you were one of those that were burned by a wholesaler in the past, I'm sorry. I think that there will be those that agree with you and those that don't. While it seems that the majority of the responses you've gotten are from those that don't agree with you, you have to remember that the majority of the people on this site aren't the ones that are going to burn you, that are honest and want to be part of a wonderful community like BP.

    I wish you nothing but success in the future and hope you can work with some legitimate wholesalers in the future.

    4Reply
  • Terence Taylor
    Investor · North Brunswick, NJ · Member since 2015 · 1 post · 0 votes
    9y

    Thank you Joe for your valuable input, i truly appreciate it!

    0Reply
  • Account Closed
    Dupont, WA · Member since 2017 · 42 posts · 5 votes
    9y

    @Joe Dube

    @Joe DubeYour knowledge is phenomenal! Would you be able to specify what you ask the county to provide on this list other than the sale date? Also, this thread is 6 yrs old, are your methods still working? :) Im new to the game I plan on using your system to get started.

    0Reply
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