questions about double closings and land trust

questions about double closings and land trust

Hackensack, NJ · Member since 2008 · 49 posts · 1 vote

hello everyone, well anyway i'm a new investor and after some research i decided to focus on pre-foreclosures.

well anyway i was told of a strategy that i could use that didn't involve the use of any of my money or credit and will allow me to actually retail these properties to end-buyers and not just wholesale them for a small profit to other investors, it sort of goes like this.

1- locate and market to the people in pre-foreclosure, 2- once they contact me setup an appointment with them, 3- setup a land trust with them ( which they will be the beneficiaries and either me or a disinterested party the trustee)and have them sign a "warranty deed to trustee" doc which i will record at the my local court house, 4- also have them sign over there beneficiary interest to you which you'll store away for protection of problems that might come up in the future 5- start marketing the property as well as working on the short sale with there lender, 6- once i have my end-buyer (and hopefully my short sale is accepted in time) have my title company perform a double closing to pay off the first lender as well as myself, and to give the end-buyer clear title without any seasoning issues coming up (which i was told there has to be two separate HUD's, two separate escrow accts and etc)

so my questions are:

do i have all the steps down correctly or am i missing something?

how in the world do i explain this double closing thing to a title company, like how do i explain to them how to do this paper shuffle ? because they either know what it is and they just don't do it or do, or they just don't know what it is and need you to break the whole process down for them.

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Will BarnardPro Member
Moderator
Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
16y
Originally posted by short_sailer:
If you use an option contract instead of a land trust

...will recording an option contract also cause the deal to be killed if the bank finds out?

Why?
Are you implying that you do not want to give proper disclosure to all parties? If so, you are asking/begging for trouble. You can use an option contract or a full blown purchase and sales agreement and still double close (not simultaneous close) using transactional funds and investing with little or no money out of pocket. The key is to have the proper team in place such as a title/escrow company familiar and capable of back to back closings, an attorney, to properly advise you and construct your documents for full legal disclosures and verbiage in your documents, and a quality transactional funder.

With all of that, you can successfully complete short sale transactions. The other missing link is to have the knowledge to negotiate with the selling bank and make the deal work for all parties involved (homeowner, selling bank, you, end buyer, agents)

Good luck.

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  • Real Estate Investor · London · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 74 votes
    18y

    The closing agent either understands double closes and is willing to do them or they do not. If the later, do not waste time trying to educate them. Just find a different closing agent.

    Be careful how you run this sort of business. Some states have regulations that can get in the way. There was a case in OH where someone was found guilty of brokering without a license and they were using a trust process similar to what you described. The devil is in the details.

    At a very high level the model is fine. Just be sure that the state and your process keeps you on the legal side of the line.

    John Corey

  • Real Estate Investor · East Lyme, CT · Member since 2008 · 78 posts · 10 votes
    18y
    Originally posted by "4EverLearning":
    3- setup a land trust with them ( which they will be the beneficiaries and either me or a disinterested party the trustee)and have them sign a "warranty deed to trustee" doc which i will record at the my local court house,

    Just my 2 cents. Be very careful about recording anything at the court house when working a short sale. If the bank finds out there is a transfer of deed on the land records it can kill the whole deal. In addition Simultaneous closing are becoming harder to do in some states (for all I know all states) . Beside the "practicing real estate with out a license" you can be charged with bank fraud. We will not do any simultaneous closing because of that. Talk to you attorney and get his opinion before you proceed. A good attorney will pay for themselves by saving you money you would have lost and keeping you from being sued. That said unfortunately there are very few attorneys who understand how investors should work, stay with in the law and also be ethical.
  • Member since 2008 · 10 posts · 0 votes
    18y

    Wisdom is this. Find yourself a good real estate attorney who knows the laws, because you can find yourself in bed with an investor or a title company that shoud not be doing doulbe-closings or the like. This practice is highly frowned upon because of "flipping" issues.

    Exercise wisdom. Good luck.

  • Real Estate Investor · FL · Member since 2009 · 6 posts · 0 votes
    16y

    If you use an option contract instead of a land trust

    ...will recording an option contract also cause the deal to be killed if the bank finds out?

    Why?

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    16y
    Originally posted by short_sailer:
    If you use an option contract instead of a land trust

    ...will recording an option contract also cause the deal to be killed if the bank finds out?

    Why?
    Are you implying that you do not want to give proper disclosure to all parties? If so, you are asking/begging for trouble. You can use an option contract or a full blown purchase and sales agreement and still double close (not simultaneous close) using transactional funds and investing with little or no money out of pocket. The key is to have the proper team in place such as a title/escrow company familiar and capable of back to back closings, an attorney, to properly advise you and construct your documents for full legal disclosures and verbiage in your documents, and a quality transactional funder.

    With all of that, you can successfully complete short sale transactions. The other missing link is to have the knowledge to negotiate with the selling bank and make the deal work for all parties involved (homeowner, selling bank, you, end buyer, agents)

    Good luck.

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    16y

    I forgot to touch on the land trust issue. I strongly urge you to use an LLC or other legal business entity to flip short sales as banks are savvy to the land trust and when seen on the contract, option or PSA, they may simply reject the offer all together, whereas an entity is common practice for investors which provides liability protection advantages, etc.

  • Real Estate Investor · FL · Member since 2009 · 6 posts · 0 votes
    16y

    How much is a local transactional lender with a team in place worth to a newbie investor trying to get into short sale double closings?

    Spliting a deal with them 50%?

  • Real Estate Investor · FL · Member since 2009 · 6 posts · 0 votes
    16y

    In the proper investor lingo, is an "equity split lender" worth it to someone starting out in short sale double closings or should I search for PL's and title companies to work instead?

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    16y

    The beauty of a transactional lender is that you get to keep 100% of your pfofits, no equity splts needed, just pay the fee for the short time money usage and the rest of the profits are yours!

  • Real Estate Investor · FL · Member since 2009 · 6 posts · 0 votes
    16y

    I agree. Thanks.

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