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Granite, Quartz, or just plain stupid?!?!

Posted Jan 3 2023, 19:41

So I am going to be doing a major renovation on a unit. Current rent is $1150 but I believe I can get $1500/1600 if I ball out on the renovation. My question is what type of hard surface countertop would you use? Granite, Quartz.. or am I being stupid?

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Olivia Grabka
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Olivia Grabka
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Replied Jan 4 2023, 20:33

So, the unit will make you right around $6k in profit over the next 12 months. I would make that your max budget.  Low end granite, vinyl plank flooring in the kitchen & living (unless you already have hardwood or decent vinyl already). We have a 4 plex in a B+ market and we went with granite & vinyl, the net effect was we were able to get top of market rents and the appraisal on the building came in at 95% of the max; the extra rent is awesome monthly, the high valuation made it easier to get a line of credit to keep adding units.


Hope this helps!!!

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Dan Heuschele
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Replied Jan 4 2023, 23:21
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:

Quartz. And go find a pre-finished stone place. They have slabs with pre-edged finishes on the sides and front. All the installers need to do is cut out the sink and faucet holes. You can do an average kitchen for under $3000.

You have to decide if it is worth it on a rental.....?

 I second the pre-fab but I seem to be in the minority that granite is better than quartz.  My experience with the quartz is it seems to chip easier than granite.  Quartz does look awesome, but I like granite better due to how easy quartzchips.

The prefab granite is very reasonable cost.  The fab is done in cheaper labor markets and a discerning eye can tell it is pre-fab (reflected in the price), but it is good enough for all but the highest class properties.

I have units in a B+/A- area (Pt Loma) that I would use prefab granite counters (market rent $4.5k/month).

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 04:13

@Brandon S. Pangman

Whichever you like the color/price on. I do like using granite or quartz over anything else because they hold up to the abuse much better/longer.

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 08:00
Quote from @Dan Heuschele:

I second the pre-fab but I seem to be in the minority that granite is better than quartz.  My experience with the quartz is it seems to chip easier than granite.  Quartz does look awesome, but I like granite better due to how easy quartzchips.

Dan, do you mean Quartz or Quartzite? I've found over the years that granite usually chips easier around the edges. But there are different types of granite with different porosity. You can tell when you're looking in the stoneyard which ones will be more brittle....

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 08:33

Use the enemy method: find nearby (0-5m away) rentals and check the kitchen countertops; what are they using?  Let that provide you guidance on making this decision.

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Brett Tvenge
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Replied Jan 5 2023, 08:35
Quote from @Brandon S. Pangman:

So I am going to be doing a major renovation on a unit. Current rent is $1150 but I believe I can get $1500/1600 if I ball out on the renovation. My question is what type of hard surface countertop would you use? Granite, Quartz.. or am I being stupid?


 I think it may depend on your market but here in Phoenix it's Quartz all day! Make it rain!! 

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Patrick Sittenauer
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Replied Jan 5 2023, 09:06

@Brandon S. Pangman

While you might not see the ROI "balling out", it will probably get you a higher appraisal. In the short term that doesn't mean much other than a lower ROI, but in the long term, that means you can leverage later in a Refi, HELOC, or Portfolio LoC.

Plus, if you ever have to sell, your house will be more competitive in that neighborhood, ie sell faster and for more. Personally, I renovate all of my non-low income houses with nice kitchens for these reasons.

Between the two options you’ve provided, I’m torn. I tend towards quartz due to lower maintenance costs, however, it can be damaged by hot pans. I didn’t know this until recently so a renter may also not know that and set a hot pan down thinking it’s safe to do so like on granite. Quartz in my area is also cheaper. I think I’ll still stick with quartz but it’s not one definitely over another.

I apply this same principle to flooring and get rid of all carpets in a reno and replace with wood look tile floors. The cost is higher, but the maintenance costs are lower and tile is much more durable.

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 09:28

I agree with the majority of responses for granite countertops. We had the same dilemma a month when remodeling a SFR. We went with laminate as the rehab budget was running dry and the neighborhood just doesn't command top end materials. I'm fully aware of that statement now because we had a lot more dead beats and tire kickers than expected (just a bad time of year to rent). I'm grateful for the advice given in BP because it really helped filter people I don't want in my rentals.

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 09:55
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @Dan Heuschele:

I second the pre-fab but I seem to be in the minority that granite is better than quartz.  My experience with the quartz is it seems to chip easier than granite.  Quartz does look awesome, but I like granite better due to how easy quartzchips.

Dan, do you mean Quartz or Quartzite? I've found over the years that granite usually chips easier around the edges. But there are different types of granite with different porosity. You can tell when you're looking in the stoneyard which ones will be more brittle....


 You are correct I was referring to Quartzite (the natural material).  Quartzite seems to chip too easily.  

I have not experienced any chipping with granite.  My initial protege did have a granite counter snap, but it was an issue of mis-use.  

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 13:04

When it comes to renovating your home, remember that the most cost effective option isn't always spending money on items that won't increase its value. Look for alternatives like Market Place or Outlet centers which offer appliances at a much more affordable price and can instantly give a kitchen or bathroom a new look. Cut corners where possible to maximise cash flow and don't waste money on anything that doesn't add equity to your home. With a little bit of planning and research, you can find a renovation solution that will fit your budget.

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 13:45
thanks! Lots of good stuff here. 

I am thinking about wood looking tile as well! I was going to do wood looking plank tile everywhere but the bedrooms. Is that what you do?

Quote from @Patrick Sittenauer:

@Brandon S. Pangman

While you might not see the ROI "balling out", it will probably get you a higher appraisal. In the short term that doesn't mean much other than a lower ROI, but in the long term, that means you can leverage later in a Refi, HELOC, or Portfolio LoC.

Plus, if you ever have to sell, your house will be more competitive in that neighborhood, ie sell faster and for more. Personally, I renovate all of my non-low income houses with nice kitchens for these reasons.

Between the two options you’ve provided, I’m torn. I tend towards quartz due to lower maintenance costs, however, it can be damaged by hot pans. I didn’t know this until recently so a renter may also not know that and set a hot pan down thinking it’s safe to do so like on granite. Quartz in my area is also cheaper. I think I’ll still stick with quartz but it’s not one definitely over another.

I apply this same principle to flooring and get rid of all carpets in a reno and replace with wood look tile floors. The cost is higher, but the maintenance costs are lower and tile is much more durable.


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Replied Jan 5 2023, 13:55

@Brandon S. Pangman

Yes to tile throughout minus beds. Also, the longer the tile, the more authentic it looks. I’ve noticed shorter tiles (<36”) look like tile, so I’ve gone with 36” tiles. If you do that with ultra thin grout lines, it looks very close to a real wood floor, especially in pictures. It won’t feel like it, but it makes the house feel nicer.

Just make sure that whoever is doing it, if it’s on a subfloor that the trusses are strong enough to support the weight. A good contractor should know what codes say. I don’t have that problem because Oklahoma is on slab, but something to consider if you have a basement or a second floor.

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 13:59
Quote from @Patrick Sittenauer:

@Brandon S. Pangman

I love your feedback!!! Thank you!

Yes to tile throughout minus beds. Also, the longer the tile, the more authentic it looks. I’ve noticed shorter tiles (<36”) look like tile, so I’ve gone with 36” tiles. If you do that with ultra thin grout lines, it looks very close to a real wood floor, especially in pictures. It won’t feel like it, but it makes the house feel nicer.

Just make sure that whoever is doing it, if it’s on a subfloor that the trusses are strong enough to support the weight. A good contractor should know what codes say. I don’t have that problem because Oklahoma is on slab, but something to consider if you have a basement or a second floor.


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Replied Jan 5 2023, 14:02

Granite will stain  / quartz is more expensive most of the time but easier to take care of - you really can’t go wrong with either 

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 14:32

I would strongly recommend quartz.  There is so much out there in beautiful patterns/ colors at really good prices per sq. ft.  It is extremely durable, really super hard to stain, and holds up incredibly well with very little maintenance.  Hope this helps!

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 17:49

@Brandon S. Pangman - As an engineer who specializes in durability, I highly recommend low porosity granite. Just double check and make sure your cabinets are well installed. I’ve seen lots of laminate scratch, warp, get stained. I’ve seen quartz get burned (because it’s glue resin). But the best quality (not necessarily the highest price) granite can really last. I have 12 year old granite that looks like I installed it yesterday and I do not do a good job with cleaning or sealing it. The low porosity granite is more durable against acids and stains. My favorite granite right now is viscount white which is grey with black swirls and glitter speckles. In my area it’s the “grade 1” so cheapest, most common, and runs 35-40 psf.

Brown fantasy is a common color my flipper friend Stan Wilder picks.

No doubt I would pick granite every kitchen. I only keep laminate if it’s in good shape when I bought the property. I use prefab quartz sinks and Costco wood vanities.

Do not ever ever ever choose real marble. It stains and scratches so easily.

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 17:50

Quartz seems to be the popular option... maybe include a little section made of wood next to the stove (sort of like a cutting board) so they can use that to set the hot pans. You can replace that section every now and then. It would certainly be cheaper than having to replace cracket or discoled quartz. I'm just trying to get a little creative here.

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Replied Jan 5 2023, 17:54

@Natalie Schanne has good points. That's what I was discussing in an earlier post, that the porosity of granite is important re it's durability. You can usually tell just by looking.

The main thing I (and others) like about quartz is that you can get a 'plain' color/style that some prefer. I've had very wealthy customers, who could afford anything, go with quartz because of the color and pattern selections....

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ModeratorReplied Jan 5 2023, 18:20

Granite

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