water bills due to leaky toilet flappers

water bills due to leaky toilet flappers

Real Estate Investor · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2013 · 27 posts · 1 vote

Fellow Investors: 

After six (6) years of renting out properties, I still haven't yet figured out the best way to mitigate those tenants who fail to keep an eye out for the occasional leaky toilet flapper for which some claim the Landlord is responsible for occasional  high water bills.  It's a struggle to convince some of them that I believe it's their responsibility to listen for water running over a flapper and if and when it occurs to alert the property management team immediately.  Some have even said they left for a couple weeks and returned only to discover the problem.  I say they need to absorb this risk and expense, and take steps to prevent: listen and report for leaks, and to be extra safe, before heading out for vacation, by closing the ball valve behind the toilet.  

I am interested to know how you handle such tenants.  I have been telling those tenants these types of expenses they try to put on me will come into consideration when their leases are up for renewal.   I would like to put this in the lease that they are responsible for all water expenses even if it is due to a failed plumbing condition, but want to ensure I can properly enforce that requirement through proper language in the Lease Agreement.

Bruce

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Investor · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 708 votes
11y

@Bruce Kozak 

I do agree with you that this is (or should be) the tenant's responsibility.  That said, I have paid for enough $100 service calls that ultimately came down to replacement of the $5 flapper that I have decided to just buy a bulk quantity and replace ALL flappers in ALL my rental properties on a regular basis as preventive maintenance (I do the same with air filters for the HVAC because we all know how good the average tenants are at replacing those...).  While the quality of these flappers has improved over time, people will toss those bleach tablets into the tank which really chew them up.  Yes, I could try to pin this on the tenant and make them pay for the service call, but it's not worth the hassle.

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  • Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Dawn Anastasi:

    I have had several toilet flapper issues and old toilets, so rather than rely on old toilets and dumb flappers, I've taken to upgrading the toilets to a newer model.  It's a Kohler that handles flushes and does not have a flapper.  It's more expensive than the cheap $80 toilets with a flapper, but the toilet claims to save up to $90/year on the water bill. That would be good on the tenants too.

    Sounds good... what is the model number of your preferred Kohler toilet? Most of our toilets are newer models in our rental units, but our own home sure could use an upgrade!

  • Dawn AnastasiPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 6k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Marcia Maynard:
    Originally posted by @Dawn Anastasi:

    I have had several toilet flapper issues and old toilets, so rather than rely on old toilets and dumb flappers, I've taken to upgrading the toilets to a newer model.  It's a Kohler that handles flushes and does not have a flapper.  It's more expensive than the cheap $80 toilets with a flapper, but the toilet claims to save up to $90/year on the water bill. That would be good on the tenants too.

    Sounds good... what is the model number of your preferred Kohler toilet? Most of our toilets are newer models in our rental units, but our own home sure could use an upgrade!

     Kohler Wellworth Classic Model # K-11464-0

  • Saint Paul, MN · Member since 2012 · 98 posts · 58 votes
    11y
    In my opinion, this really is something that the manager should be watching for. Of course, tenants should report leaks or drips but they are just that-tenants. They realize that for the most part they have no profit motive for jiggling the handle on the toilet or requesting the faucet be rebuilt. Your water bills come in monthly in most cases. These bills should be monitored for usage rates compared to historical data. Even a 15% deviation from the norm for a small residential property could mean a leak which could be unknown or unseen by the tenant. When all else fails a letter reminding tenants to report maintenance issues and emergencies immediately helps with being authoritative yet it creates a synergy between landlord and tenant that is beneficial for both parties.
  • Roy N.Pro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Fredericton, New Brunswick · Member since 2013 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Marcus Curtis:

    In my opinion, this really is something that the manager should be watching for. Of course, tenants should report leaks or drips but they are just that-tenants. They realize that for the most part they have no profit motive for jiggling the handle on the toilet or requesting the faucet be rebuilt.

    Your water bills come in monthly in most cases. These bills should be monitored for usage rates compared to historical data. Even a 15% deviation from the norm for a small residential property could mean a leak which could be unknown or unseen by the tenant.
    When all else fails a letter reminding tenants to report maintenance issues and emergencies immediately helps with being authoritative yet it creates a synergy between landlord and tenant that is beneficial for both parties.

     Marcus,

    If you have a large enough property that you have a manager, then you should probably be considering sub-metering of water.  In our practice, any property 6-units or greater in size is evaluated (cost vs benefit) for fitness to be sub-metered.

    Once you sub-meter the water, you can hold tenants accountable for their consumption.  When we converted our first property, we sent tenants monthly usage statements - which showed usage for all units in the building - 6-months before we began billing.   Just the action of showing all tenants all usage led to a > 10% reduction in water usage on the next quarterly invoice from the utility.  When we began billing for water, we did so only on turn-over ... we have one long-term tenant who still does not pay for water ... but she's not heavy user.

  • Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 31 posts · 1 vote
    11y

    They do have improved versions of these. I have had great success with these. Easy to install and problem free. They are very well made and last a long time pretty much paying for themselves. $9

    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Danco-HydroStop-Flapper...

    This is the complete kit we use. I honestly think these are the way to go in the long run. Not only do they remove maintenance costs but saves you money on water bills. Yes you do pay more for them intially but if you think about it as a long term investment you are actually paying WAY less. $24

    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Unbranded-HydroKit-Toil...

  • Roy N.Pro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Fredericton, New Brunswick · Member since 2013 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    11y

    @Josh B. 

    I would be cautious using these to turn a 3.4 usg (or older) toilet into a low-flush or dual flush is asking for dissatisfaction.   A bowel ad trapway designed for a greater volume of water will not perform with a reduced flow.  This was one of the big faillings with several of the N.A. manufacturers first foray into low-flush toilets which created the still lingering perception they do not work.

  • Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2014 · 178 posts · 64 votes
    11y

    @Bruce Kozak I do not do this personally, but know someone who charges a fee of $12.50 per adult for water, with a provision in the lease that says any leaks reasonably observable by the tenant must be reported within 1 day or there will be a charge for the additional water use from that month's bill.

  • Rental Property Investor · Massachusetts and Maine · Member since 2020 · 20 posts · 18 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Bruce Kozak:

    Fellow Investors: 

    After six (6) years of renting out properties, I still haven't yet figured out the best way to mitigate those tenants who fail to keep an eye out for the occasional leaky toilet flapper for which some claim the Landlord is responsible for occasional  high water bills.  It's a struggle to convince some of them that I believe it's their responsibility to listen for water running over a flapper and if and when it occurs to alert the property management team immediately.  Some have even said they left for a couple weeks and returned only to discover the problem.  I say they need to absorb this risk and expense, and take steps to prevent: listen and report for leaks, and to be extra safe, before heading out for vacation, by closing the ball valve behind the toilet.  

    I am interested to know how you handle such tenants.  I have been telling those tenants these types of expenses they try to put on me will come into consideration when their leases are up for renewal.   I would like to put this in the lease that they are responsible for all water expenses even if it is due to a failed plumbing condition, but want to ensure I can properly enforce that requirement through proper language in the Lease Agreement.

    Bruce

    You need this smart water valve:

    https://meetflo.com/

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