Investor · Carnegie, PA · Member since 2014 · 259 posts · 144 votes
Hi All - One of our tenants that is typically late on rent and usually needs a reminder (or 7) is late on rent again. A few days ago we sent him a late notice, left a voicemail, and have texted - all with no response. Usually he responds to at least one of those.
I attempted to call again tonight and found that his his phone has been disconnected. We then tried to call 2 of his other contacts, one of which was also disconnected (his sister) and his parents house (left a message) with no response.
We're pretty new to this and haven't really faced a situation like this one. Not sure what to try next. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks!
Property Manager · Big Bear Lake, CA · Member since 2013 · 585 posts · 330 votes
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Because his phone has been disconnected, he has no money and is avoiding you. I have found that people will pay their phone bill before paying rent. Time to start the eviction process.
Property Manager · Big Bear Lake, CA · Member since 2013 · 585 posts · 330 votes
11y
Because his phone has been disconnected, he has no money and is avoiding you. I have found that people will pay their phone bill before paying rent. Time to start the eviction process.
Real Estate Investor · Audubon, PA · Member since 2009 · 13k+ posts · 8k+ votes
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Get the eviction rolling, with notice to quit.
You are lucky that the spring busy season will be here soon; so if the eviction happens in a reasonable time and with little damage, you will have more tenant prospects looking, and that means it should not stay vacant long.
Property Manager · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2015 · 31 posts · 12 votes
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Post a 3-day notice to pay or quit. That will usually get a response from a delinquent tenant. I post several of these a month. It's not fun but it is necessary when dealing with these types of situations. The eviction process here in Los Angeles is a long and tedious one. This is the first step toward eviction. In the 3 years I have been managing buildings, I luckily have never had to evict anyone but we have asked people to leave and have had them sign a 60-day notice to move because they were not abiding by the terms of their lease. The 60-day notice or some form of it might benefit you or could be an option to
Investor · Carnegie, PA · Member since 2014 · 259 posts · 144 votes
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Thanks for all the help! I've never had to post a pay or quit notice. Is this something that has to come from an attorney, county, or does it have to include any specific verbiage?
Property Manager · Long Beach, CA · Member since 2015 · 31 posts · 12 votes
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It can come directly from the landlord. The property management company that I work for has a legal team that drafts all of these notices, leases, addendums, disclosures, etc. You can probably find a decent generic one online somewhere that might suit your needs, but contacting a real estate attorney might not be a bad idea either.
Thanks for all the help! I've never had to post a pay or quit notice. Is this something that has to come from an attorney, county, or does it have to include any specific verbiage?
You need to learn the landlord-tenant laws for your jurisdiction. Know them better than your tenants do. Serve the legal notice to pay rent or quit the right way with the right form. Establish a connection with a qualified attorney that specializes in landlord-tenant law. They can provide you with the forms and/or service you need. Your local rental association can also help you find the right documents and the right attorney. Here's a link to one such organization.
Real Estate Broker · Naples, FL · Member since 2013 · 9k+ posts · 6k+ votes
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If you don't end up evicting this person you should consider finding a new tenant when the lease expires. Why have someone that is a constant source of aggravation and problems? I would dump them as quickly as possible.
Real Estate Investor · Houston, TX · Member since 2010 · 499 posts · 206 votes
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Also, get over to the property and see if he still lives there. I had one who didn't pay his rent Friday when it was due. I contacted him Monday. He had moved out Saturday.
The sooner you find out they've moved, the sooner you can re-rent.
Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
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Your neighbors have reported hearing water running at the house. Go over there and check it out. Knock on the door and if no one answers, open the door to check out this "emergency".
If empty, you know your tenant has taken off.
If stuff remains, close the door, lock it and leave the "Pay or Quit" notice taped to the front door where you can see it as your drive by to continue to check your property. That way, you'll be able to tell if your tenant comes home and retrieves it.
If your tenant answers the door, hand him the "Pay or Quit" notice. Follow up by sending a second one via snail mail.
Rental Property Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2013 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
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Matt Faix A couple of thoughts. If you want to be fully above board. Today, post a 24 hour notice to enter and then go in tomorrow and make sure the heat's on and the tenant hasn't bolted. Hopefully they left and you can clean and rerent.
At the same time you post the notice to enter post the notice of late rent or whatever form is required in your area. There is likely a local attorney (or two) that specializes in representing landlords in the eviction process. Get them in the loop on what you are dealing with. Often jurisdictions have specific language that must be on the late rent notice forms. Ask them if they have one you can use to post.
Your neighbors have reported hearing water running at the house. Go over there and check it out. Knock on the door and if no one answers, open the door to check out this "emergency".
The option to see a Real Estate Lawyer who knows the locals laws is a much better one. If the eviction process turns adversarial, you definitely want to have the law fully on your side.
Investor · Carnegie, PA · Member since 2014 · 259 posts · 144 votes
11y
Update: I finally heard back from the tenant with a typical story - broken down truck/no money/etc. and that it will be in the mail tomorrow. Either way we're still contacting our attorney and local magistrate about posting notice if needed, and at the very least are going to have a talk with the tenant about finding a new place to live. Thanks again for all the suggestions!
Real Estate Investor · Montesano, WA · Member since 2014 · 8 posts · 10 votes
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You have a couple options: Evict him, or offer him money to leave provided he meets certain conditions. For example, if he’s out by Friday with all his belongings moved out and the house clean, you’ll give him $400 in cash. “Cash for Keys” has saved me from having to go through the eviction process a few times! It’s a lot cheaper and you get your house back much sooner as well. That said, I would still serve the tenant a Notice to Quit as soon as possible (If you offered him Cash for Keys and he didn’t follow through you could start the eviction right away). I’m not familiar with the landlord/tenant laws in Pennsylvania, but according to this site: http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/how-evictions-work-pennsylvania.html after the Notice is served the tenant has 10 days to either pay the rent or move out (in Washington where my rentals are it’s only 3 days). So the sooner you get the notice served the sooner you can start the eviction process if that’s the route you are going to take. Don’t let your tenant continue to bury his head though. It’s important for you to act quick. Also, here’s a link I found for the Pennsylvania Landlord Tenant Act: https://www.thelpa.com/PA_landlord_tenant_act.pdf
Once last thing, if your tenant does end up paying his rent, you might want to consider not renewing his lease if he's on a term lease, or simply giving him notice to vacate if he's on a month-to-month agreement. There are a lot of good tenants out there who are responsible...there's no reason to be stuck with one who's not.
Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
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@Matt Faix I hope you're charging him late fees at least for all this trouble. And don't get your hopes up about it "going in the mail tomorrow". All that does is buys him more time. You'll have high hopes and check your mail box for the next several days just to find nothing.
From now on, you have to stick to the timelines of the lease. If it says it's late if not RECEIVED by the 5th, then the morning of the 6th, you need to do whatever the first step is in your county for this eviction process. If you have to file something with the court and pay fees at 10:00am on the 6th, and then they come and pay you the rent at 1:00pm...too bad...they'll still need to reimburse you the court fees and late fees. Be tough.
Usually this process isn't terribly difficult. I highly suggest you Google your local landlord laws. Lots of people use terms like "pay or quit" here, but that term is not used in all states or all counties, so don't let it confuse you.
Investor · Monroeville, PA · Member since 2014 · 102 posts · 32 votes
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does your leave contain a clause waiving the notice period for nonpayment? Its very common. If so, you can file as soon as he is late. Mine does, but sometimes i still post a notice because it can be a good motivator. If you do file he will owe court fees in addition to rent and late fees. One note.....if you want to evict do not accept a partial payment or its start over.
Dont waiver on late fees.
I have 1 family that pays late alot, usually less than a week. I dont make an issue of it as long as they notify me that they will be late and pay the late fees.
Fyi...I believe you can also evict for habitual lateness.
Rental Property Investor · Holley, NY · Member since 2011 · 507 posts · 347 votes
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@Matt Faix I will try not to repeat too much of what has already been said here. Instead, I will share a little of my experience and hope it helps.
When I first started as a landlord, I used to DREAD evictions, notices, etc. and used to brag about how I had gone "x" number of years and never been to eviction court. My first eviction that I ever did cost me over $ 3,000 in lost rent and over $ 1,000 in water bills. That hardened me a little bit, but I was still reluctant to even serve notices, afraid I would come across as a hard-a$$.
After several more years and probably over $ 10,000 total in lost rents, I don't worry about it anymore. We have it down to a science almost. Rent is due on the first, and considered late on the third. By the fifth, notices are on doors and in the mail. Just last month, we served notices on a couple of tenants that had really good history with us, but wouldn't return phone calls and were late. Within a week, they paid up and apologized. This month they paid on time again.
One lesson that you can't learn fast enough is that this is BUSINESS, it doesn't have to be personal. I have told people that at eviction court as they are crying the blues of their life. I hear all kinds of stories. Some of the people I truly do feel for when they get themselves into a bad spot. But at the end of the day, you need to run your properties like a business. Your mortgage company doesn't care why YOU paid the mortgage late and they don't want to hear about the tenant didn't pay on time so you can't pay on time.
I will say that I am a lot less soft than I was when I started out. But I will also say that when I do find myself in eviction court and a few weeks later looking at how much money I am out, the numbers are a lot easier to swallow. It is far easier to charge off 1 month's rent than it is to charge off 6 plus month's rent because you kept buying the sob story.
You may also find that some tenants use the pay or quit notice of their "reminder" to pay the rent. We have had a couple of those over the years too. It's a game, learn the rules and play well.
Investor · Carnegie, PA · Member since 2014 · 259 posts · 144 votes
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@Heather Turner thanks for the links! I'll check those out. As for late fee's we are definitely sticking to them. I like the cash for keys idea too, sounds like it's a good way out for all parties.
@Nicole A. We're learning that very quickly. We haven't waived any late fees, but clearly we're learning that a notice or eviction proceedings must be started quickly after non-payment.
@Rick C. We do have a clause in our lease that the tenant gives up those rights, we might still post it though just motivate him as you said. Thanks for the tip on partial payment too, didn't know that.
Investor · Wethersfield, CT · Member since 2013 · 371 posts · 191 votes
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I feel I should chime in here and say that there are flat rate evictions Attorneys that will handle the entire eviction process for you, soup to nuts. I might suggest Googling "Flat Rate Eviction Attorney [your city, state]."
Let an expert handle it, you don't need the stress.
Rental Property Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2013 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
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@Matt Faix once a tenant is late. The check's in the mail is no good. The only acceptable means of payment is MO (money order) or cash deposited directly into my bank account. Most banks will let you specify no checks for deposits from third parties. If you haven't already done this. Find the bank with a branch nearest the property and open an account there. Direct the tenants to deposit the funds into that account and then sweep the account. Don't worry too much about giving them your account number. Anyone who gets a check from you gets your account number.
Investor · Fort Lauderdale, FL · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 465 votes
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Do the pay and quit.
Also mount a For Rent sign outside to send the message home.
I do a face to face at lease signing and I told new tenants I am easy going but if rent is not received before the grace period there grace goes away because I have financial obligations and I must meet.
Landlording with an iron fist inside a velvet glove.
Investor · Carnegie, PA · Member since 2014 · 259 posts · 144 votes
11y
@Rick C. Question on the partial payment - I posted the notice and heard from the tenant the next day saying that his rent was in the mail (I'll believe it when I see it), but that it didn't include the late fee. My question though is that do i have to accept the payment if it's the full amount of rent, but no late fee? Is that still considered partial? I'm not waiving the late fee, I just don't know what's considered full or partial and what is acceptable.
I heard somewhere once that the late fees cannot be considered when posting notice. Any truth to that?