Nightmare tenant is leaving, but....

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Nightmare tenant is leaving, but....

Corby GoadeBusiness Member
Investor 路 Boise, ID 路 Member since 2014 路 3k+ posts 路 3k+ votes

I have a tenant that gave me their 30 day notice yesterday, which was cause for some serious celebration. Almost every interaction I've had with them over the last two and a half years ended with them threatening to sue me (dryer isn't working, "we're going to sue." Coming to fertilize the lawn; "this is our home and we don't want you here, if you show up, we'll sue.") Of course, they've never actually sued, because they have no idea what they're talking about.

So, I told them that I would be showing the house over the next month, and the lease allows me to have reasonable access without permission to show the house within 45 days of them giving notice. I've told them that I would give them at least 48 hours notice, and they've told me that they'll sue if I don't pay them $50 each time I show the house, because they are worried that I will show the house to a registered sex offender. But I guess It's okay to have a registered sex offender in the house if they get $50? Obviously I will show they house, and give them the notice that I promised I would.

My concern here is that I don't believe they will be gone on July 2nd, as their notice requires. I will have a new lease in place and new tenants ready to move in. How can I be proactive about this so that I don't have a nightmare on July 2nd with a new tenant trying to move in and the old tenants still living there and refusing to leave?

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Lynn McGeein
Real Estate Agent 路 Virginia Beach, VA 路 Member since 2012 路 2k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
11y

If you know they are problem tenants and always threatening lawsuits, why would you even attempt to show it while they are still there?  Even with the best tenants, it is difficult to show while occupied.  What happens when these guys say things are missing?  I'd just wait until they were actually out to schedule any showings.  You can still be pre-screening interested parties, then have an open house for all of them after the problem tenants are really gone.    

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  • Lynn McGeein
    Real Estate Agent 路 Virginia Beach, VA 路 Member since 2012 路 2k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    11y

    If you know they are problem tenants and always threatening lawsuits, why would you even attempt to show it while they are still there?  Even with the best tenants, it is difficult to show while occupied.  What happens when these guys say things are missing?  I'd just wait until they were actually out to schedule any showings.  You can still be pre-screening interested parties, then have an open house for all of them after the problem tenants are really gone.    

    17Reply
  • Angel Rosado
    Bronx, NY 路 Member since 2015 路 151 posts 路 54 votes
    11y

    I agree with @Lynn McGeein.  Although you have cause to celebrate since they have given you the notice, it may be too early to celebrate.  You won't be rid of this "problem" until they are long gone from the property.  

    1Reply
  • Angel Rosado
    Bronx, NY 路 Member since 2015 路 151 posts 路 54 votes
    11y

    Just wondering what tenant screening process did you have in place when these problem tenants came in?

    0Reply
  • Corby GoadeBusiness Member
    OP
    Investor 路 Boise, ID 路 Member since 2014 路 3k+ posts 路 3k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Lynn McGeein:

    If you know they are problem tenants and always threatening lawsuits, why would you even attempt to show it while they are still there?  Even with the best tenants, it is difficult to show while occupied.  What happens when these guys say things are missing?  I'd just wait until they were actually out to schedule any showings.  You can still be pre-screening interested parties, then have an open house for all of them after the problem tenants are really gone.    

    Good suggestion, Lynn. For one, I don't want to miss out on a month of rent, especially when I have gone out of my way to be more accommodating than the lease requires of me. Secondly, if they stay an extra two weeks, I fear that it will turn into three, then two months, etc. I understand that I could start a formal eviction at that point, but I want to be proactive about this and avoid losing rent, a formal eviction and caving to their whims simply because they've threatened me.

    1Reply
  • Corby GoadeBusiness Member
    OP
    Investor 路 Boise, ID 路 Member since 2014 路 3k+ posts 路 3k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Angel Rosado:

    Just wondering what tenant screening process did you have in place when these problem tenants came in?

    Hi Angel- My screening could have been better- in retrospect, there were a couple subtle signs that I should have picked up on. Their credit checked out, and former landlord gave them glowing reviews, though now I am confident that they landlord gave them a glowing review because he was ecstatic that he was getting rid of them.

    2Reply
  • Angel Rosado
    Bronx, NY 路 Member since 2015 路 151 posts 路 54 votes
    11y

    @Corby Goade You may want to consider on any prospective tenants to ask for two different landlord references, consider meeting them twice once in the prospective home and in a professional business setting i.e. rent a lawyers office this may help view any tenant nuissances, obviously credit check which you have done.  I would even go as far as having a third party like a significant other meet them with you to get their thoughts on the tenants.

    Every experience is a lesson learned and I'm sure that you now know that it's worth putting the work upfront in screening the tenants.  Good luck and I'm glad the end is near with these fools.

    0Reply
  • Richard C.
    Bedford, NH 路 Member since 2012 路 2k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    11y

    It is very hard to show an occupied house under the best of conditions.  And these are not the best of conditions.  These tenants will scare away any prospects.  You will end up wasting your time and the time of everyone who comes to view the place.

    And if in the process you tick off the tenants even further, you may be left with damages to re-mediate.

    Just wait until they are out, and then turn over.

    2Reply
  • Ryan Dossey
    Real Estate Broker 路 Indianapolis, IN 路 Member since 2014 路 3k+ posts 路 2k+ votes
    11y

    I understand not missing out on a month of rent. But the above posters are right this just screams of a "something is missing" scam. 

    They may not know how to sue but they've already shown they are willing to extort money out of you. I would tell them that their fear of me showing to a sex offender is ridiculous and none of their concern. 

    I would also let them know in writing and in advance that you will evict them if they aren't gone by the date they gave you. You could even throw in a little blurb about how hard it is to find somewhere to stay with an eviction on ones record. 

    I wouldn't tolerate a tenant threatening to sue me all the time. I would be pissed...

    5Reply
  • Mark Brogan
    Investor 路 Roanoke, VA 路 Member since 2012 路 1k+ posts 路 374 votes
    11y

    i would not consider showing the house until these POS tenants are out of your house 
    if you show house they could just get mad and decide to stay and then you will be forced to evict 
    i would wait until they are gone for good and then show
    @Corby Goade

    3Reply
  • Richard C.
    Bedford, NH 路 Member since 2012 路 2k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Corby Goade:
    Originally posted by @Lynn McGeein:

    If you know they are problem tenants and always threatening lawsuits, why would you even attempt to show it while they are still there?  Even with the best tenants, it is difficult to show while occupied.  What happens when these guys say things are missing?  I'd just wait until they were actually out to schedule any showings.  You can still be pre-screening interested parties, then have an open house for all of them after the problem tenants are really gone.    

    Good suggestion, Lynn. For one, I don't want to miss out on a month of rent, especially when I have gone out of my way to be more accommodating than the lease requires of me. Secondly, if they stay an extra two weeks, I fear that it will turn into three, then two months, etc. I understand that I could start a formal eviction at that point, but I want to be proactive about this and avoid losing rent, a formal eviction and caving to their whims simply because they've threatened me.

     I don't understand this reply.  There is no connection between holding off on showing the place and allowing them to stay an extra two weeks.

    You sound, not to put too fine a point on it, butt-hurt.  This is business.  Those things don't mix well.

    0Reply
  • Corby GoadeBusiness Member
    OP
    Investor 路 Boise, ID 路 Member since 2014 路 3k+ posts 路 3k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Angel Rosado:

    @Corby Goade You may want to consider on any prospective tenants to ask for two different landlord references, consider meeting them twice once in the prospective home and in a professional business setting i.e. rent a lawyers office this may help view any tenant nuissances, obviously credit check which you have done.  I would even go as far as having a third party like a significant other meet them with you to get their thoughts on the tenants.

    Every experience is a lesson learned and I'm sure that you now know that it's worth putting the work upfront in screening the tenants.  Good luck and I'm glad the end is near with these fools.

     Great suggestions, thank you. I will incorporate those in to my screenings from now on. Much appreciated. 

    0Reply
  • Leandro Rodriguez
    Investor 路 Miami, FL 路 Member since 2015 路 46 posts 路 15 votes
    11y

    Focus all your energies in getting these problem tenants out, in order, with the least amount of hassle and damage to the property. You have to put feelings aside and see this as an opportunity to get rid of a problem and get the property ready for a brand new tenant.

    Consider the cost of opportunity of one month rent vs not getting these tenants out.

    I am assuming you have some cushion funds and can weather one month rent.

    3Reply
  • Michael R.
    Rental Property Investor 路 Woodbridge, VA 路 Member since 2014 路 249 posts 路 81 votes
    11y

    This is why vacancy must be factored in too when you run your numbers.

    0Reply
  • Lynn McGeein
    Real Estate Agent 路 Virginia Beach, VA 路 Member since 2012 路 2k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    11y

    We now always wait for tenants to leave before showing the property just to avoid issues, as the old tenants are usually packing up and the place is a mess, anyway.  It shows much better clean, vacant, and ready to move in.  Even with not showing until vacant and clean, I've had turnovers in as little as a week, although 2-3 weeks is more common.   We do advertise, but just tell them they can drive by and see if they want to pre-screen and be available for viewing when ready.  The only times I've ever had a whole month vacant was when the tenants trash the place and we're repairing/replacing, and even then, a whole month is rare.      

    0Reply
  • Jesse T.
    Herndon, VA 路 Member since 2014 路 1k+ posts 路 324 votes
    11y

    You might see if they would be willing to move out a week earlier for a pro-rated refund of the rent.  This would give you a better chance of getting a tenant for at least part of the month of July.  It is probably a good time to start advertising even if you aren't doing showings until after the tenants leave.

    2Reply
  • Michael Noto
    Real Estate Agent 路 Southington, CT 路 Member since 2008 路 5k+ posts 路 3k+ votes
    11y

    @Corby Goade

     Just wait until they move out to show the unit and fill the vacancy.  If I were you I wouldn't even bother communicating with these tenants unless it is through a letter.  They sound like they are legitimately crazy.

    0Reply
  • Amanda Comeau
    North Stonington, CT 路 Member since 2015 路 13 posts 路 1 vote
    11y

    honestly- I would wait till they left the property- bringing in new tenants to look may cause them to destroy the property or make a scene which will make good people run. they seem INSANE, I wouldn't chance anything with them... One thing I wish I had done, was call employer and previous employer for a reference...... I didn't do this and I got burned......

    0Reply
  • Joe Moore
    Rental Property Investor 路 Los Angeles, CA 路 Member since 2010 路 804 posts 路 230 votes
    11y

    You can also state the property will be available by the 15th of the month or whenever.  Whatever the date you decide, these tenants must have already vacated the rental.

    0Reply
  • Randy E.
    Rental Property Investor 路 Durham, NC 路 Member since 2014 路 1k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    11y

    @Corby Goade

    1) Wait until current tenants have moved.  It may be later than they said.

    2) Begin showing house to prospective tenants.

    3) Screen prospective tenants.

    4) Rent house to new tenant who passed your screening.

    Finally, or actually in the first place, I would accept the house will not generate rent for at least a couple of weeks and maybe up to a month.  Sometimes you can rent with only a day between tenants.  Sometimes you can't and it results in  a month with no income.  Everything you said in your first post indicates this is a time you can't.

    It's just the cost of doing business.  Good luck.  

    0Reply
  • Kimberly T.
    Investor 路 Colorado Springs CO 路 Member since 2014 路 535 posts 路 253 votes
    11y

    This is one of many reasons why we don't show units while they are still occupied.  Other reasons include: current tenants claiming their "expensive jewelry" is missing after a showing, prospective tenants seeing how these less-than-clean tenants keep the unit and think this is an acceptable condition to keep the unit in, and having to give notice and arrange showings days ahead of time (since many prospective tenants won't bother showing up or remembering their appt time that far down the road).

    We always want prospective tenants to see exactly what they will be getting with the unit, which is why we only show it in rent-ready condition.  This way they see how clean we expect it, and they see that *fresh paint* or *new carpet* in person rather than getting a promise from us that we'll do it (how many tenants have written horror stories of getting promises from prospective landlords of what will be done prior to them moving in, and then having it not get done?).  No thanks.  Show them the unit when it looks great, and it should sell itself.

    2Reply
  • Jacqueline Beynon
    Weston Super Mare, North Somerset 路 Member since 2015 路 2 posts 路 0 votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Leandro Rodriguez:

    Focus all your energies in getting these problem tenants out, in order, with the least amount of hassle and damage to the property. You have to put feelings aside and see this as an opportunity to get rid of a problem and get the property ready for a brand new tenant.

    Consider the cost of opportunity of one month rent vs not getting these tenants out.

    I am assuming you have some cushion funds and can weather one month rent.

    0Reply
  • Jacqueline Beynon
    Weston Super Mare, North Somerset 路 Member since 2015 路 2 posts 路 0 votes
    11y

    If I was you I would be thinking about how to get them out. Once out of the property money can be earnt. If that is what you are worried about. Seriously I would set a date in writing and if they don't move out then ask the police if they can issue a warrant. And to go with you to the property. Don't let them tell you and just tell the ones moving in that some work has to be done on the property. Good luck 馃崁 and be bra

    0Reply
  • Wilson Churchill
    Madison Heights, MI 路 Member since 2014 路 471 posts 路 132 votes
    11y

    I say go ahead and show the unit, giving proper notice to the current tenants. Be sure to video record every time you are at the property. It would also be advisable to record every phone call. When recording calls, be sure to announce that you are recording at the start of every call.

    2Reply
  • Scott Harper
    Investor 路 Longwood, FL 路 Member since 2015 路 221 posts 路 130 votes
    11y

    Do not show with them in.

    Send some guys there on Harleys and have them tell the people they will be moving in on the first. They just came by to check the place out early and they hope there wont be any problems.  The tenants will be gone.

    2Reply
  • Mary lou L.
    Investor 路 Wichita Falls, TX 路 Member since 2014 路 382 posts 路 123 votes
    11y

    I also agree waiting until the house is empty.  If they already make threats to sue for normal maintenance,  its not a stretch that they would just make more noise about having people walk through their house.

    Even if they never sue, having the possibility of prospective tenants hear them rant about it doesn't reflect well.

    I had a tenant that had no problems voicing his "opinions", even when I had the pest control guy there spraying. It was very embarrassing to say the least.

    And as others have said who knows what the condition of the house may be!

    Put your best foot forward, and show a clean empty house.

    1Reply
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