Tenant is lying and looking to swindle me

Tenant is lying and looking to swindle me

Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes

A couple of month ago, a tenant I have had for 2 years told me her freezer would not always seal when she closed it.  I went to the house and even though the fridge was only 3 years old, I told her i would swap out the fridge mainly to keep her happy.

Being busy, I told her I would be there with the new fridge but was unable to make it.  This occurred again.  If felt bad and said I would without fail be there on the following Wednesday or her next months rent was free.  These had been communicated in phone texts.  On the following Wednesday I did not have my handcart with me, I live about 3 hours from the house.  I called her and said I could be there if need be but would rather make the due date that Friday.  She said no problem.  On Friday I gave her the new fridge and left.  She never mentioned anything about the no rent for the month.  She had sent me a text on that Thursday about discussing her rent discount with a LOL appended to the end.

Today I texted her, asking if she had sent out my Nov rent, she  said no.  Was not going to because I had not deliverd the fridge on the date I had texted her.  I thought she was kidding.  She was not.  She followed up with a fabricated conversation, where her boyfriend overheard my saying, no rent was needed, when i delivered the fridge.  So I know she is playing me.

Where to go from here.  My thoughts.

I have been in court several times before for non-paying tenants.  I have listened to many tenants cry about this not working, on and on.  As we all know.  Judges I have seen take the position, if you don't want to live there, move.  While you live there pay rent.

Although I made the claim, She gave no consideration, in the legal sense.  I did not say, move in and I will do this.  Mine was more in the form of a one sided gift.  

I would expect the judge not to clearly determine what was agreed to, since some was texted and some was in phone conversation.  It is unreasonable expect you would not have to not pay rent over an intermittent fridge seal, that was fixed 2days past an agreed due date.  Plus I was in contact with her throughout that week.  Showing a notable effort to correct the problem.

I would like BPs thoughts.


0Reply
42 views

Most Popular Reply

Investor · Canton, GA · Member since 2014 · 728 posts · 500 votes
10y
Dude, you stepped in your own p@@p! If you say something, you do it.
See this reply in the discussion

75 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • Real Estate Investor · Lansdowne, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 656 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    A couple of month ago, a tenant I have had for 2 years told me her freezer would not always seal when she closed it.  I went to the house and even though the fridge was only 3 years old, I told her i would swap out the fridge mainly to keep her happy.

    Being busy, I told her I would be there with the new fridge but was unable to make it.  This occurred again.  If felt bad and said I would without fail be there on the following Wednesday or her next months rent was free.  These had been communicated in phone texts.  On the following Wednesday I did not have my handcart with me, I live about 3 hours from the house.  I called her and said I could be there if need be but would rather make the due date that Friday.  She said no problem.  On Friday I gave her the new fridge and left.  She never mentioned anything about the no rent for the month.  She had sent me a text on that Thursday about discussing her rent discount with a LOL appended to the end.

    Today I texted her, asking if she had sent out my Nov rent, she  said no.  Was not going to because I had not deliverd the fridge on the date I had texted her.  I thought she was kidding.  She was not.  She followed up with a fabricated conversation, where her boyfriend overheard my saying, no rent was needed, when i delivered the fridge.  So I know she is playing me.

    Where to go from here.  My thoughts.

    I have been in court several times before for non-paying tenants.  I have listened to many tenants cry about this not working, on and on.  As we all know.  Judges I have seen take the position, if you don't want to live there, move.  While you live there pay rent.

    Although I made the claim, She gave no consideration, in the legal sense.  I did not say, move in and I will do this.  Mine was more in the form of a one sided gift.  

    I would expect the judge not to clearly determine what was agreed to, since some was texted and some was in phone conversation.  It is unreasonable expect you would not have to not pay rent over an intermittent fridge seal, that was fixed 2days past an agreed due date.  Plus I was in contact with her throughout that week.  Showing a notable effort to correct the problem.

    I would like BPs thoughts.

     SMH, Why in the world would you make such a barter, especially if you had no intentions in keeping your word?! I've never heard of any landlord making that statement to a tenant via text, phone, in-person or written especially to swap out an appliance. Even as a joke that would be risky. Doesn't matter how close or far you are from the rental property that was a terrible thing to say to the tenant. Of course she was hoping and praying that you didn't make it on Wednesday and you didn't. You texted it so its in writing and I'm sure its locked in her phone. No doubt you deeply regret telling her that. Honestly, what tenant wouldn't hold you to it? I would especially if I had it in writing. If anything, it looks like you are trying to swindle your tenant not the other way around. You made a barter you hadn't the slightest intentions on keeping and now you're pissed because your tenant is holding you to your word.    

    In my opinion, you need to immediately seek legal advice on this. 

    Kudos,

    Mary

  • Investor · Canton, GA · Member since 2014 · 728 posts · 500 votes
    10y
    Dude, you stepped in your own p@@p! If you say something, you do it.
  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    @MaryB  Did you read the part where I talked to her on the due day and said I would be there if need be.  That she agreed to have be there that Friday.  I would hardly consider that, me swindling anyone.  Are you familiar with consideration in the legal sense.  She did nothing for the free rent.

  • Investor · Corona, CA · Member since 2014 · 746 posts · 372 votes
    10y

    It seems you didn't keep your end of the bargain. You now have to eat 1 month's rent because of your word and actions. Expensive lesson learned for you.

  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    So the 10 minute conversation we had on the phone the day of the due date has no bearing?  I don't feel folks are reading my whole post.

  • Investor · Corona, CA · Member since 2014 · 746 posts · 372 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    @MaryB  Did you read the part where I talked to her on the due day and said I would be there if need be.  That she agreed to have be there that Friday.  I would hardly consider that, me swindling anyone.  Are you familiar with consideration in the legal sense.  She did nothing for the free rent.

    She didn't mention getting free rent for the fridge, this is something YOU offered. You said you would be there Wednesday or next month is free. She didn't have to do anything. It was all on you.

  • Rental Property Investor · Lynnwood, WA · Member since 2015 · 45 posts · 21 votes
    10y
    Unfortunately for you, I think you might just need to eat this one as the price of your lesson... As a land lord my self, Rent payments is never a substitute for any deadline issues... Lesson learnt...
  • Adam BartomeoBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · Cape Coral, FL · Member since 2015 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    Too funny. I know you are probably looking for support from the forums but I don't think you will find much. I always taught the sales people I taught in class to "under promise and over deliver". You did the opposite and are now lying the price. You made a commitment and couldn't follow through on more then one occasion. Sorry my man but I would be giving them the free rent. 

    Well, no I wouldn't because I would have followed through on my commitment.

    Good luck sir.

  • Investor · Corona, CA · Member since 2014 · 746 posts · 372 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    So the 10 minute conversation we had on the phone the day of the due date has no bearing?  I don't feel folks are reading my whole post.

    You said yourself that you would be there if "need be". You JUST said you would BE THERE ON WEDNESDAY. You didn't have your handcart and used that as a way to change the date on the tenant (again) but tried to save face by saving I'll be there if "need be". You did not keep your word and now owe a free month's rent because of it. Lesson learned.

    The tenant is not lying and looking to swindle you. You pretty much swindled yourself.

  • Contractor · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2014 · 651 posts · 510 votes
    10y

    @Account Closed I think you made a [foolish] promise and now you should honor it. The "need be" changes nothing because her basis of "need be" was different from yours. You gave her an incentive to wait a few additional days and get free rent. In other words: the need to deliver on the promised day was on your part, not hers. 

    Also keep in mind that you made this 'free rent' promise because you had failed your other promises to bring the fridge. 

    Expensive lessons learned: Don't promise things lightly and always keep your promises. 

  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    I did deliver.  There was a conversation on the phone the due date and she agreed for me to do it on Friday.  Just because some discussion was in text and phone does not mean it did not happen.

    So please stop saying I did not make good on my offer.  

    So back to the issue.  I could promise someone a $1000 on Monday.  If on Monday they do not get the money, they cant sue me.  They did nothing for that.  Rather, I said I will give you a $1000 to go to Albany and they do, I could be in trouble.  

    What if I said, I will be there on Wednesday or the house is yours.  Think a judge will force the sale of my home.  No.  Same here.  It is unreasonable to expect you dont have to pay rent over a fridge not always closing.

    Thoughts?

  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    @Account Closed I hear you.  But I think her giving up the bad feelings is a weak form of consideration.  Is it reasonable to think you don't have to pay rent over a seal?

  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    For one last time, she agreed I could be there Friday.  During that Wednesday conversation, if she had said no, I would have been there with the new one.

  • Attorney · Attleboro, MA · Member since 2015 · 412 posts · 165 votes
    10y

    It was not the tenant that suggested it, it was YOU. I am sure she only remembers that part about you promising a months free rent. Forget the legal consideration issue. It was an offer made by you and she accepted.

    The bottom line is Do you want to take your chances and try to evict her for not paying a months rent and take this in front of a judge or worse et a jury (not sure if that is available in NY but it is in MA)? Has she been an otherwise good tenant? If so do you really want to upset the cart over something you offered?

    If I was a judge and you came before me on an eviction over a missed month of rent based on this, I would throw the case out and assess costs against you also.

  • Investor · Corona, CA · Member since 2014 · 746 posts · 372 votes
    10y

    You cannot justify not giving her a month rent free. You keep speaking like she did something wrong. YOU told her she would get a month free if YOU did not deliver and install the fridge on WEDNESDAY. YOU called on Wednesday with another excuse of not having your handcart. She played nice saying you would come on Friday. However, you still did not deliver and install the fridge on WEDNESDAY, which you promised.

    If I were the tenant, I wouldn't pay either for the month you said would be free and if you tried to take me to court about it, I would have all your conversations as documentation.

  • Firefighter · Hampshire, IL · Member since 2009 · 41 posts · 17 votes
    10y
    I agree with everyone else. You should just eat the months rent. You said that you would have it there by a certain date or that month is free. The reason she had no complaint of you bringing it at a later date is because of the conversation of you paying the rent. Put yourself in your tenants shoes. I bet you would be looking at it from the opposite view. Do the right thing.
  • Investor · Tallahassee, FL · Member since 2013 · 77 posts · 24 votes
    10y
    I read your whole post. Of course she would say Friday was ok because she saw that she was getting free rent. Does not say in your post that I will be here on Friday but no free rent. This is on you. Sorry
  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    So I should do the right thing and give  my tenant a free months rent after she agreed to take on Friday and then lied about that conversation ever taking place.  In addition saying her boyfriend heard me saying you dont have to pay rent for November, during my delivery of the fridge.  Even when I never told her that.  Sorry that does not make sense to me.  She knew I did not deliver the fridge on Wednesday because she said Friday would not be a problem. 

  • Firefighter · Hampshire, IL · Member since 2009 · 41 posts · 17 votes
    10y
    Yes you should! Regardless of who said what, YOU still stated that it would be delivered by Wednesday or that month is free! It looks like you are the one who lied. Does it matter if she is saying her boyfriend heard you say it? You already told her that it was FREE. It seems like you've already got your own idea on what you are going to do. Why ask for guidance?
  • Real Estate Investor · Lansdowne, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 656 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    For one last time, she agreed I could be there Friday.  During that Wednesday conversation, if she had said no, I would have been there with the new one.

    Robert, I read your entire post and I am not attacking you. I definitely get that you are upset. That said, your post stated that you forgot your handcart and phoned the tenant that you'd be there if need be on Wednesday but YOU PREFERRED to reschedule to show up on Friday. Again, all of the suggestions were on you from the not paying rent if you don't show on Wednesday to you showing up on Friday. This is what's written in your original thread. Which is all we can go by. The lesson for you to learn here is to be careful of what you say particularly in the form of a barter to your tenants. Yes, I get that you could've said something to the effect that you bet your right eye if something doesn't occur at said time / date. It doesn't mean that you will give up your eye or any other body part. However, the last thing I'd expect a landlord to say is if I don't show up on this date you get a month's rent free and put it in writing to boot.

    Imagine if a contractor texted to their client, if they don't show up on a given date / time that they'd do the project for free. Let's say you were that client and they didn't show up on said date / time but phoned / texted you that they'd come over if need be but would prefer to reschedule on Friday instead. Would you be adamant that they show up on the date they made the barter for or would you agree with THEIR suggested rescheduling for another time (considering you'd get your project done on them)? Even if you chose not to hold them to the full project being on them, you'd expect a hell of a discount at minimum, yes?

    Kudos,

    Mary    

  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    @Bill Turner

    The phone call we had on Wednesday addressed this.  So it was said that Friday I would bring it to her with no free rent.  She is trying to use texts as the only admissible evidence.  The call did take place.  To me a judge presented with this can't only rely on texts and dismiss a 10 minute phone call.  What he does know it the exchange is unreasonable.  If have been in court and seen many tenants talk about how a home is messed up as a justification for not paying rent.  Compare the water, sewer, taxes and home to a fridge seal.  They don't compare.  

    ?

  • Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2015 · 27 posts · 20 votes
    10y

    Just take this as a lesson learned and move on. Most reasonable Landlords that read this thread would agree. 

  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    @Mary B.

    So address my case of the landlord that says, I will be there or you can have the house.  Think the courts would support this?  No.  It is an unreasonable exchange.  I am not saying the courts will see my case the same as the one i just used but my time in the courts suggest a judge will look at whats fare.  Does a fridge seal warrant not paying rent.  There are only 2 folks who know what was said.  Some in texts, some in phone.  Given that I would think the judge has to look as what is reasonable.

    ?

  • Real Estate Investor · State College , PA · Member since 2009 · 594 posts · 173 votes
    10y

    So what is the lesson to learn?  I have a phone call conversation changing the due date and the other party agrees, then lies about the conversation.

  • Landlord · Port Orchard, WA · Member since 2015 · 80 posts · 39 votes
    10y

    it's like you're going to keep disagreeing with people's opinions until you get the validation you seek. See what Bryan Schultz said above. 

Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.