July rent not paid

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July rent not paid

Yvette M.
Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes

I posted on another LL and would like to get y'alls thoughts on the situation:

I'm on a merry-go with a POS tenant. I terminated contract with PM. All tenants were by PM notified that I would be self-managing beginning July 1st. I sent my own letter to tenants stating the new payments arrangements. Tenant sends her check to the PM just to irritate me. PM emails me and asks if I want him to deposit in my account. Check is made payable to him.

What would you do? Have PM return check to tenant and continue with PQ? Or let PM deposit in my account?

There is a rough backstory  -- tenant has been a PITA since day ONE and her attitude and behavior are continuing to escalate.  She has a year lease, otherwise she would have been gone long ago.  

Let me just insert here that she is an attorney.  I was showing a vacant unit and as prospects passed by she warned them not to rent from me, I was liar, etc (if I'm all those things then why are you still here?). Lately when I go to the property, she stalks me and takes pictures of me until I leave.  I have called the police twice because of her ugly actions.   Police were called a third time because she got into a verbal fight with her boyfriend -- haven't seen him since.  The list goes on ...

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Account Closed
Investor · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
10y

@Yvette M.  There is obviously a lot going on here and I'm assuming a lot but the fact is that YOU changed the payment plan.  Sure she's pressing your button but she will claim she lost the paperwork and sent to the PM to at least be sure someone got the rent, blah,blah.  Sounds like you are a little pissed at the PM and seems he is just trying to get the rent to you altho he may be taking a little delight in YOU having to deal with Miss PITA.  Let it go!

I don't see how the POQ will do anything but escalate things and prove to her that she has the correct button.  She has the money and made the "attempt" to get it to you.  Stay professional and businesslike knowing that you are choosing to ask her to leave at the end of the lease..

In my 40 years I recently had my first eviction.  When I showed up with the writ of possession they called the police on me!  The police came and tried to BS me and tell me I was crazy to think they would help me get them out in a half hour.  I just kept my cool and showed my paperwork that said any officer of the court HAD to help me but if they didn't want to comply with the Judges order I was fine with that and would just let the Judge know.  Long story short the Police got the tenant to come up with $3200 from their boss and asked me to allow them to stay until that money ran out and confirmed that they would be witnesses if there was any damage done, etc.  I SO wanted them to be forced out on the spot because they had violated my trust.  But, it made financial sense to collect the money and I didn't let being pissed cloud my judgement.  It was myself that I was really pissed at because I lowered my judgement because they had been friends of a friend.  Got extra money, got them out and got over it. 

You are in charge, don't lose that advantage.  And sorry you are going thru this.

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  • Dana Dunford
    San Francisco, CA · Member since 2016 · 238 posts · 204 votes
    10y

    @Yvette M. -- Did you send notification of updates to your rental agreement (an addendum) to notify the tenants that going forward ... rent must be addressed to you? Once you have this, the tenant is considered late (and must pay late fee, per your lease agreement) if they make out the check to the property manager, rather than you.  She may reconsider who she is sending those checks to ... if there are further implications (late fees, 3 day notices to pay rent or quit, etc.).

    What a horrible mess ... sorry to hear that.

    1Reply
  • Yvette M.
    OP
    Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    @dana

    @Dana Dunfordundefined

    The PM notified the tenants by letter and I notified the tenants by letter on June 21.  PM's letter was about a week before mine.  Of course she will say that she never received notice.

    0Reply
  • Kelly N.
    Investor · SE, MI · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 461 votes
    10y

    How were the tenants notified?  Do you have proof that this tenant received notification of where rent was to go before her July rent was actually mailed?  If so, I would have that PM either return or void the check, and then you charge whatever the late fee is AND send her a pay or quit notice.  Nip this in the bud now, or she will continue to play games with you until she move out.

    When is her lease up?  Do you think she wants to move sooner?  If so, I would write her a letter stating that you would let her out of the lease without consequences given proper notice and communication.  If she's not happy in your property she won't ever be, so she might as well move on down the road.  If there is a clause in the lease about an early termination fee or having to pay rent until a new tenant is found, I would gladly give that up in order to get her out of my property.

    3Reply
  • Yvette M.
    OP
    Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    @Kelly N. lease expires Feb 2017.  She was offered to get out of lease with no penalty, but told PM she had "no where to go".  She has harassed the landscaping work crew as well as my handyman.  She said she wasn't notified of landscaping and demanded that he leave.

    Forgot to mention that I found out she faked a landlord reference from her previous residence.  On and on and on

    0Reply
  • Eric Andrews
    Alexandria, IN · Member since 2016 · 38 posts · 7 votes
    10y
    Newbie, sorry. What does "PITA" mean?
    0Reply
  • Kelly N.
    Investor · SE, MI · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 461 votes
    10y

    Ugh, that stinks.  Might end up being a case for the "cash for keys" tactic.

    Is there anything in the lease about landscaping crews?  I handle the lawn care for our properties, and while I do avoid showing up before 8 am I also can't imagine a tenant having an issue with the property being maintained.   Do they have a set schedule?  If so, notify her of that (in writing) and give the crew a copy of it.  Also let her know that if she causes a delay in repairs or landscaping, she pays for them to return to the property.  

    What does she do for a living?  Can you schedule any handy man type work for times when she is at work?

    0Reply
  • Kelly N.
    Investor · SE, MI · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 461 votes
    10y

    @Eric Andrews- PITA= Pain In The A$$

    0Reply
  • Terry Miller
    Akron, OH · Member since 2015 · 178 posts · 189 votes
    10y

    Pain in the ***

    0Reply
  • Eric Andrews
    Alexandria, IN · Member since 2016 · 38 posts · 7 votes
    10y

    Ahh. Thank you. She certainly sounds like one.

    0Reply
  • Jim Shepard
    Investor · Edwardsville, IL · Member since 2015 · 432 posts · 481 votes
    10y
    I would suggest getting an attorney involved now. One would be for slander in front of a prospect. See if you have the prospect's name and have them write a statement saying what exactly was said. Have them sign and date the statement. Two, if she lied on the application, I would have your attorney contact the state bar association. She could possibly lose her license? It could also be grounds to break the lease. Good luck.
    3Reply
  • Account Closed
    San Jose, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    10y

    I'd give her a pay or quit notice to evict for nonpayment.  Let her prove she tried to pay you.  It goes both ways.

    The laws work for everyone and anyone.  Doesn't matter if they went to law school and passed a test.  Anymore than if they got a bachelors degree in art.  They don't get special treatment.

    And in fact, they can lose their license for acting in a manner that embarrasses their profession.  They have higher standards than anyone else on the street.

    So, you could counter any of her threats with the fact that you will file a complaint against her with the bar association.  If she's breaking laws or acting unethically, she can lose her license to practice law.  

    Let's see how far her ego works to get her out of that one.

    I like fighting fire with fire and I hate bullies.

    4Reply
  • Polly Gage
    Portland, OR · Member since 2016 · 16 posts · 4 votes
    10y
    Always always send mail certified so you can prove they received your notice. If you posted them with the correct payment procedures and they did not follow them, then they are considered late. They need to follow to correct procedure. If you skirt on it then they will keep playing the game. Stick to the lease. It's your safety net - even when dealing with an attorney resident. Good luck!!
    1Reply
  • Yvette M.
    OP
    Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    @Polly Gage, I did send the letter priority with tracking, but damn I can't find the receipt :( I'm sure it's stuck between something.

    0Reply
  • Account Closed
    Investor · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    I would not start  a battle over the first payment being sent to the wrong address.  You are unlikely to get a sympathetic judge when she did exactly what she's done for the last 6 months.  I would resend new instructions by regular mail and certified and text, etc. and have the PM deposit the check.

    I also would never go over there without a witness and I would instruct any workers to avoid her and refer her to you if she has any issues.  Six months will fly by.  Make sure you give notice of not renewing the lease timely.

    4Reply
  • Ralph R.
    Investor · Bethel, AK · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 852 votes
    10y
    Yvette May I'm with Sue Kelly If you can prove she got the notice that you are now self managing and the check is made out to your old PM, I would post the cure or quit notice. She hasn't paid her rent. If the check has his name and not his business's name on it now that I think about it what prevents him from just cashing the check and keeping it?? He doesn't own or manage the property. She either knows something I'm overlooking or she's not much of an attorney. If you accept the check/ money from him you are in effect saying he's still managing the property. I'd be careful about that. RR
    1Reply
  • Yvette M.
    OP
    Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    @Ralph R.good points.  @Account Closed She made the check payable to the the PM company which she has NEVER done. She has always paid on-line and I have the tenant's register of payments.  She's just giving me the run-around.  I will not let the PM deposit the check into my account.  My contract with him has been terminated. I'm giving her the statutory amount of notice for non-renewal.  She'd be dumb as dirt to think she'd stay one second past her lease expiration. Her 3-day POQ will contain payment instructions. I will send a "late notice"email though, however, she has not responded to any of my emails to date.

    0Reply
  • Ralph R.
    Investor · Bethel, AK · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 852 votes
    10y

    @Yvette M.  I know in some or maybe all states e-mail is a legal form of notification but what if she tells the judge her computer broke and she dosent use her e-mail??  I live in a place where most people don't have or use e- mail.  Better to stick with certified mail but did you know you can ask the mail person who it's from then refuse to sign for the letter?  Bet that's why you can't find the receipt.  She's playing you for sure. She mite be dumb like a fox but if you know for sure she faked a reference on her application why can't you use that to get her out?? I'd spend $100 dollars to ask my attorney if she rented from me. I'd spend more to get her out around the middle of the month if I could. It's generally tougher to find a place to rent than it is the end of the month.  Keep me posted now I'm curious!! RR

    0Reply
  • Account Closed
    Investor · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    @Yvette M.  There is obviously a lot going on here and I'm assuming a lot but the fact is that YOU changed the payment plan.  Sure she's pressing your button but she will claim she lost the paperwork and sent to the PM to at least be sure someone got the rent, blah,blah.  Sounds like you are a little pissed at the PM and seems he is just trying to get the rent to you altho he may be taking a little delight in YOU having to deal with Miss PITA.  Let it go!

    I don't see how the POQ will do anything but escalate things and prove to her that she has the correct button.  She has the money and made the "attempt" to get it to you.  Stay professional and businesslike knowing that you are choosing to ask her to leave at the end of the lease..

    In my 40 years I recently had my first eviction.  When I showed up with the writ of possession they called the police on me!  The police came and tried to BS me and tell me I was crazy to think they would help me get them out in a half hour.  I just kept my cool and showed my paperwork that said any officer of the court HAD to help me but if they didn't want to comply with the Judges order I was fine with that and would just let the Judge know.  Long story short the Police got the tenant to come up with $3200 from their boss and asked me to allow them to stay until that money ran out and confirmed that they would be witnesses if there was any damage done, etc.  I SO wanted them to be forced out on the spot because they had violated my trust.  But, it made financial sense to collect the money and I didn't let being pissed cloud my judgement.  It was myself that I was really pissed at because I lowered my judgement because they had been friends of a friend.  Got extra money, got them out and got over it. 

    You are in charge, don't lose that advantage.  And sorry you are going thru this.

    5Reply
  • Chris V.
    Rental Property Investor · SF Bay Area · Member since 2015 · 154 posts · 179 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Eric Andrews:

    Newbie, sorry. What does "PITA" mean?

    I believe it is a technical acronym that stands for "P"ain "I"n "T"he "A**" :)

    0Reply
  • Chris V.
    Rental Property Investor · SF Bay Area · Member since 2015 · 154 posts · 179 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Yvette M.:

    My tip: Try not to get emotionally involved. Focus on what is important: your financial interest. You are very unlikely to "educate" anyone, or make them see the "error of their ways" or whatever:). What I try to do is I take the high road, as long as I am getting paid. 

    If that means I need to eat some sh*t here and there and make the tenant feel they "won", so be it. You might not get a great "victory" but in the end you OWN and they RENT, and that says enough.

    As to your particular example. I would do what is easiest and most practical and ask the PM to deposit the check, and thank them, and then communicate again that in the future rent needs to be paid such and so. Don't get emotionally involved! Being petty does not help anything even IF you are right. 

    Sometimes you just got to suck it up, part of land-lording (or running any type of business probably) is dealing with irrational customers *who are wrong*. Don't let them drag you down to their level, specifically if it does not cost you anything out of pocket, just keep moving forward. Easier said than done, I know, but I've been there and I can assure you it gets easier as you do it more often. Just remember, its BUSINESS:). 

    Good luck!

    2Reply
  • Thomas S.
    Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    10y

    Follow through with the normal process of notice for late payment and pay or quit. You treat all tenants exactly the same regardless of the situation. If it gets to court both sides explain the situation as they interpret it. You are establishing a history record for each tenant every time you send notice that you will then place as evidence at a eviction hearing. Telling a Judge a tenant regularly paid late without evidence is useless at a hearing. Neither your word or a tenants is of any value without evidence to support it.

    Send notice every time a tenant is in violation and you will be prepared in the event it leades to an eviction.

    1Reply
  • Yvette M.
    OP
    Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    @Vitaliy Merkulov thanks I've never heard of renterinc

    1Reply
  • Vitaliy Merkulov
    Property Manager · Sacramento, CA · Member since 2015 · 121 posts · 33 votes
    10y
    Yvette May it works well because you can tell your renter that her performance is being reviewed on RenterInc and will be searchable by future landlords. That should encourage her to behave well as a tenant. It might take you couple days to get approved, but after that, it's all worth it.
    0Reply
  • Yvette M.
    OP
    Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    @Account Closed

    Yes, I changed the payment arrangement, because I took over management.  Same scenario if someone had bought the building the tenants would be sending payments to the new owner.

    Things are very ugly between me and the tenant, but I would not do anything differently if it was any other tenant.  I'm not risking eviction she is and if she chooses to flush her rental property prospects down the toilet then so be it.  LLs know that an eviction or eviction is a rental death wish.

    0Reply
  • Yvette M.
    OP
    Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    BTW, I posted the PQ and mailed a copy to her "office".  She didn't respond with the money, phone call, text or email.

    Sent everything to my attorney, so now I'm waiting for the eviction filing.

    0Reply
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