SFH rental; Milw WI; TONS of interest - No applications??

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SFH rental; Milw WI; TONS of interest - No applications??

Kelly G.
Florissant, CO · Member since 2013 · 184 posts · 69 votes

I am at a complete loss! My SFH (3/1.5, 2car garage, fenced)has been for rent on Zillow/hotpads/trulia for > 1 month. asking very reasonable rent (below other similar properties now). I have had >100 inquiries and conducted probably > 40 showings and Everyone has taken an application.  I've had TONS of interest - eager prospective applicants asking about putting in a garden, or swingsets for the kids, I've met their dogs 'cuz they were so excited to find a nice house that allows pets . . and on and on and on.  And I have received only 3 completed applications in return!  (2 just in the last couple days but not stellar applicants).  I had a couple this weekend sooooo excited about the house - it's < 1 mile from their employer; they were asking about all kinds of 'mods' and my flexibility and what good tenants they are and on and on . . . . and no application. 

Now . . the house is 'vacant' except for me - camped out in the living room (bed on floor, small table and lamp) while I complete some upgrades and find a tenant.  The house is always 'tidy' when I do showings.  And I go through the gamut of current and future upgrades/maintenance: tiling the kitchen floor (in progress), new windows come spring/summer, new blinds and curtains, and the few 'fix-it' things that need attending to.  

My previous PMs never had a vacancy!  (They never did CL and neither do I)

What Am I Doing Wrong?????

Kelly

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Account Closed
Johnson City, TN · Member since 2014 · 586 posts · 705 votes
9y

landlord camped out in living room with Rv parked in driveway promising all kind of improvements would freak anyone out.

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  • Michele FischerPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    There must be something in the application that is turning folks off.  I would suggest posing as a renter and collecting applications from similar available properties to see what you have in yours that comes across as unreasonable.

    I would also move the mattress into a bedroom.

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  • Kim Meredith HamptonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · St Petersburg · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    @Kelly G. your honey do list may scare them off, especially if they are families, they want a home they can move into that doesnt still need to be renovated. 

    Can you move the personal belongings into the garage or closet, may be a turnoff to people

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  • Michael Henry
    Real Estate Consultant · Brookfield, WI · Member since 2014 · 873 posts · 350 votes
    9y

    @Kelly G. where is the property located and how much is the rent? 

    0Reply
  • Shawn Devoid
    Real Estate Agent · Tucson, AZ · Member since 2016 · 168 posts · 106 votes
    9y

    @Kelly Maybe this is a totally stupid thought, but couldn't you just call a few people that viewed the house & ask why they didn't submit an application?  Just explain that you want to learn & improve your processes & are looking for feedback to better serve your customers.  You don't even need to tell them that the house is still empty, just that your are doing an informal study.  Totally true...

    2Reply
  • Kelly G.
    OP
    Florissant, CO · Member since 2013 · 184 posts · 69 votes
    9y

    Great comments all!  Thanks - 

    @Michele Fischer- I doubt it's the application - I'm using the 'standard' from WI Legal Blank;  though it could be that my criteria are too strict.  I go over the criteria with everyone who takes an application, and the criteria is also posted on the listing.  The "tough" criteria could be: a) no evictions and good references from all landlords; b) no financial judgements against you in 5 years (may need to lower that); c) no credit delinquencies in 5 years (this is really probably the kicker - everyone seems to have a credit delinquency).  

    @Kim Meredith Hampton  - yeah - I didn't explain that well on my original post.  I go to great lengths to tell folks that I'm 'working on the house' between tenants and that it will be 'move-in ready' when they are; they see my RV in the driveway - ask where I live etc. They seem to 'get it' - but maybe not.  The only thing that won't be ready at move-in are the windows - don't want to replace those in winter.   I thought folks would 'apperciate' a landlord actually doing upgrades and maintenance.  I 'think' it looks better than if I had a tenant in here - but apparently I don't 'know' much! ;-)

    @Michael Henry The house is on S. 81st St. - a couple blocks S. of Oklahoma - still a good neighborhood and in Milw for all those city/school employees. I'm currently asking $1100. 

    @Shawn Devoid - Never a 'stupid' question here - I actually started doing that via email yesterday - maybe phone calls would be better.  

    Really appreciate everyone's time . . .   

    Kelly

    0Reply
  • Danny Olivo
    Real Estate Investor · Medford, NY · Member since 2017 · 6 posts · 4 votes
    9y
    It sounds like you are figuring it out pretty quickly once you start thinking about it. My "standard" application looked similar to yours initially. I had to lower a fair bit of my requirements when I began investing in lower income neighborhoods. Even in my original investment area which is easily an "A minus" area I often have to bend rules depending on the tenant.
    0Reply
  • Gail K.
    Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    Possibly the folks viewing it know they have lousy credit and figure they wouldn't pass your screening.

    I get lots of questions when I mention doing a credit check on "what are you looking for?".   They mean the FICO score.  With online services such as Credit Karma many know their FICO scores already.   It's not unusual that some will come right out and say they have poor credit.  Young folks may have no FICO score at all.

    They also know if they have accounts in collections.  It may help with certain rental properties to state that medical bills or student loans in collections MAY be overlooked.  What you're trying to avoid are those folks who haven't paid their cell phone bills, cable, internet and on and on (the record I got was someone with...150...yes, 150 accounts in collections!).

    Gail

    0Reply
  • Matt R.
    Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Kelly G.:

    I am at a complete loss! My SFH (3/1.5, 2car garage, fenced)has been for rent on Zillow/hotpads/trulia for > 1 month. asking very reasonable rent (below other similar properties now). I have had >100 inquiries and conducted probably > 40 showings and Everyone has taken an application.  I've had TONS of interest - eager prospective applicants asking about putting in a garden, or swingsets for the kids, I've met their dogs 'cuz they were so excited to find a nice house that allows pets . . and on and on and on.  And I have received only 3 completed applications in return!  (2 just in the last couple days but not stellar applicants).  I had a couple this weekend sooooo excited about the house - it's < 1 mile from their employer; they were asking about all kinds of 'mods' and my flexibility and what good tenants they are and on and on . . . . and no application. 

    Now . . the house is 'vacant' except for me - camped out in the living room (bed on floor, small table and lamp) while I complete some upgrades and find a tenant.  The house is always 'tidy' when I do showings.  And I go through the gamut of current and future upgrades/maintenance: tiling the kitchen floor (in progress), new windows come spring/summer, new blinds and curtains, and the few 'fix-it' things that need attending to.  

    My previous PMs never had a vacancy!  (They never did CL and neither do I)

    What Am I Doing Wrong?????

    Kelly

     I am not sure you are doing anything wrong but I would not park RV in driveway. That might freak some folks out as to think this LL is going to be hanging out or? A couple questions; What is the vacancy rate for the area? Why would you not use craigs? 

    0Reply
  • Lois Ginter
    Rockford, IL · Member since 2016 · 126 posts · 48 votes
    9y

    I would move forward with the window replacements now.  It only took one day for 30 replacement windows to be done on one of my buildings.  It took me a few months to get a spot in the crew's schedule for the install.  

    0Reply
  • Michael Henry
    Real Estate Consultant · Brookfield, WI · Member since 2014 · 873 posts · 350 votes
    9y

    @Kelly G. it seems that the location would be easy to rent. Try placing different ads at different price points all at the same time. Is the property located in West Allis or Milwaukee? 

    0Reply
  • Justin Fox
    Software Developer · Vidor, TX · Member since 2015 · 922 posts · 639 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Kelly G.:

     c) no credit delinquencies in 5 years (this is really probably the kicker - everyone seems to have a credit delinquency).  

    That's definitely your problem.  People are delinquent on mortgages during divorces, have late payments on automobiles here and there and especially medical/college loans.

    0Reply
  • Account Closed
    Johnson City, TN · Member since 2014 · 586 posts · 705 votes
    9y

    landlord camped out in living room with Rv parked in driveway promising all kind of improvements would freak anyone out.

    5Reply
  • Ralph R.
    Real Estate Agent · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2014 · 114 posts · 30 votes
    9y

    The property is in a very nice area so I would think it would be easy to find a tenant. I would post an ad on craigslist and list your criteria. I normally follow up with people to see if they were interested and what they thought.  

    1Reply
  • Rebecca Belnap
    Rental Property Investor · Lehi, UT · Member since 2015 · 195 posts · 133 votes
    9y

    @Account Closed is absolutely correct.  You said it has been listed for more than a month and you still have items unfinished?  Finish it in 3 days or hire a contractor.  I used to do this, always doing my own work to save money.  I have rented to 2 single contractors this way.  I got repairs done instead of rent in both cases.  I know it looks like just a few things to you, but everyone knows that the odds of you finishing once they give you money goes down.  

    Get it finished, and get out.

    4Reply
  • Michael Boyer
    Investor · Juneau, AK · Member since 2015 · 980 posts · 741 votes
    9y

    The level of interest (100 inquires/40 showings) to the ratio of applications (3) definitely points to something in the unit or showing process that is a deterrent or amiss.

    And I agree with the prior posts noting many renters (your applicants), lack what we'd call "imagination" in seeing how this unit "will look" when you are done and out of the place. They are unable to see your vision. You need to show them a finished unit (not tell them) ready to rent.

    I don't even show a "work in progress" for this reason (it can waste time and lose good potential applicants).  Many folks may need a place very soon or like now (pronto) not when the construction wraps up, so that could cause a pause.

    Plus, for many (unless they are HGTV fans or in the trades) they will simply see a construction zone and not a future home (even if you are almost done).... They need to visualize themselves in the unit (where their stuff goes, etc). Not how it may look when complete.

     And while I am sure you will do all you say, consider it from their view. They can't trust everyone and everything they hear when seeing units, so a fully ready to rent unit that shows well is far favorable/safer than even the slight risk of an unfinished unit (that may or may not be done on time). 

    Your work to upgrade is admirable but you probably want to separate it from the showing process. 

    I would complete all work and get all my personal items out. 

    Get the place in showroom condition and invite back your best leads and continue advertising and showing (I would guess you get many qualified applicants).

    Best of luck!

    3Reply
  • Kelly G.
    OP
    Florissant, CO · Member since 2013 · 184 posts · 69 votes
    9y

    Wow - 16 replies - can't thank you all enough for your insights.  My screening criteria should not be soooooo restrictive;  but clearly it's the 'maintenance' issue that is likely scaring people off.  My sister tried to tell me this - I shrugged it off.  I figured:  I'm not 'selling' the house - upkeep is ongoing in a rental - I thought applicants would be 'impressed' with a landlord who takes care of the property, and wouldn't mind some minor (mostly) issues that I'm tending to. And the house has always been Clean, Neat and Tidy at showings - certainly better than showing it with current tenants who are packing!  Apparently Not.    I would not care about some maintenance issues if I were looking for a decent house in Milw.  Clearly I am Not most people!  "Showroom Condition" seemed relevant to 'selling' a house, but not for a rental - Clean, Neat Tidy - absolutely - but 'showroom'??   Lesson learned!  What gets me though - is that past PMs always did showings with current tenants and never had an issue or vacancy (but on the other hand - I fired those PMs at least in part for 'tenant' issues).

    I cancelled all my showings for the next couple days (yes, I kept contact info).  Why waste my time.  I'll reschedule when the work is done.  

    just 'for the record':  I can't move the RV - it's my house and my only transportation; I don't have a lot of stuff in the house (personal belongings) as  . . I live in a small RV - I don't live in Milw or WI!  I can't do the windows now: no $$, no time to look for a contractor and further delay renting.  

    Here's to hoping you are right and the applications start rolling in . . . .   after the work is done

    Cheers

    Kelly

    0Reply
  • Michele FischerPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    If you changed your no credit delinquencies in the past 5 years to no landlord or utility credit collections in the past 5 years, that might help.

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    0Reply
  • Michelle Fenn
    Real Estate Agent · Cleveland OH · Member since 2015 · 216 posts · 275 votes
    9y

    I tell prospective tenants that I do a credit check and then ask if there is anything I might find that they would like to tell me about.   If they respond I have reason to consider them honest and it allows them to tell me about the divorces, student loan debt or not credit at all, credit conditions I may accept.   

    0Reply
  • Phil Earley
    Property Manager · Cumming, GA · Member since 2015 · 261 posts · 199 votes
    9y

    Coordinating and dealing with your future renovations sounds like the issue.  Tenants want to find something turn key and be left alone.   It would be like leasing a car today and having the dealership tell over the next 12 months these are the 9 recalls they will be taking care of for you so expect to have to coordinate everything and deal with all of the disruptions.   

    1Reply
  • Kelly G.
    OP
    Florissant, CO · Member since 2013 · 184 posts · 69 votes
    9y

    Yeah - I changed my criteria on my listing.  

    As for 'maintenance' - I explain to all 'lookers' that all the work will be done before move-in except the windows, and I tell them the windows should only take 1-2 days.  So - if applicants are anticipating work they are not listening to me. 

    My "plan" was to find a tenant and then do/finish the work  - so that I wouldn't lose 'down' time.  Guess that backfired.  Although - most have been 'excited' about the soon-to-be new kitchen floor and prospect of new windows etc.  So . . . maybe it's the criteria afterall.  No way to know until some one who has looked at the house and not completed an application Tells me!

    back to work

    Kelly

    0Reply
  • Shawn AckermanPro Member
    Real Estate Entrepreneur · Mid West, East Coast · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Kelly G. "while I complete some upgrades and find a tenant" where are you in the upgrade process?  Could it be the unit is not finished?  if that's not the case what are the rent numbers telling you?

    0Reply
  • Marcus Auerbach
    Investor · Milwaukee - Mequon, WI · Member since 2010 · 5k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    9y

    @Kelly G. most tenants have been burnt by landlords who have made all kinds of promises and have never been seen again as long as the rent is paid. 

    You definitley have to get the place in good shape first, then take 20 great pictures and post them on Zillow (seems like you are only on CL). Also, $1100 is kind of low for a SFR in that area. Problem is if your property is in C condition it will attract tenants that don't care about that - and ultimatley won't take care. And that takes your property from a C to a D condition within 2 years. D condition pushes your rent and cash flow down, so less money for improvements and you have just entered a death spiral.

    Take a step back, raise the money you need, fix the place up to B or A condition and then start over with higher rent and better tennants. Better tenants appreciate a nice home and make an effort to keep it that way. They also stay longer, so you vacancy losses go down. And your turnover cost goes down. They also pay higher rents, so your cash flow goes up. 

    Hope that helps. Feel free to give me a call if you need something. Good luck! 

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