Eugene, OR · Member since 2016 · 11 posts · 3 votes
Greetings bigger pockets.
I need urgent help. I am living in an owner occupied duplex and renting out the other side. This is my first rental and I closed last December.
My tenant just got shot last night. It's not clear if he got shot by himself or by someone else, though it happened inside, and the officer did not mention anything about a break-in. I hope I will be finding out more details about that later today.
He had a girlfriend and they had recently broken up. They also have a child and a pet.
It seems like there are a lot of implications that this has, and that I need help understanding. I also need to figure out what the next steps are for myself. Should I get new tenants? How do I approach it with his girlfriend and him if they want to stay or not? It seems like they would want to go but I'm not sure. How easy is it to even rent out again? It looks like Oregon law says that I don't have to disclose to prospective future tenants, though I think it was fairly obvious that something had happened since the police and the fire department were there for so long.
Has this ever happened to anyone and what steps did you take?
Investor · Vancouver, WA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
9y
Attempted suicide or domestic violence or both. Whatever the reason, I would have a sit down talk with your tenants. Check in to make sure they are okay and find out what they need at this point.
If they need to move, make it easy for them to leave by releasing them from their lease obligations without penalty. Move forward as you would with the termination of any tenancy and make-ready the unit for the next tenant.
If they need to stay, go over the terms of the rental agreement and re-establish understanding about the property rules regarding "peace and quiet" "safety" "crime" and "firearms on the property." It's quite likely that discharging a firearm within the city limits is a violation of a local ordinance, it is in my town, so check out that aspect. If one of your tenants or their invitee was the one who discharged the firearm, then that could easily be a violation of one of the terms in the current lease agreement and grounds for serving a Notice to Comply, or similar type notice to bring them back into compliance.
Do not attempt to evict without clearing this through an attorney, as you don't want to violate laws that protect the rights of the tenants. Attempted suicide can result from mental duress and/or mental illness, so think about protected classes of people. Assault and attempted murder are crimes, so if that was the case, you could quite likely evict the perpetrator. Collect your facts first and seek legal counsel.
Troutdale, OR · Member since 2016 · 47 posts · 15 votes
9y
Deanna McCormick hahah. I didn't even think about my last name and then replying in this discussion haha. That's funny. Unfortunately I am not related to the Winchester rifle family, I wish! Then I could buy all the real estate I want ha
Rental Property Investor · Portland, OR · Member since 2015 · 338 posts · 332 votes
9y
The guy who advised talking with the tenant (not a lawyer first) and having "empathy" . . .
Bad advice. Don't get emotionally sucked into this prime time drama. Being "nice" with someone who discharges guns indoors--especially because of mental health issues--could get you shot next.
This is YOUR safety and life at risk. If it were me, I'd get him out ASAP. In your case, a property manager would also help. I live in a duplex and just hired a PM for next door.
Eugene, OR · Member since 2016 · 11 posts · 3 votes
9y
Greetings everyone
I realize it has been a while since I responded to this, and I thought I should follow up. From my perspective, the situation keeps getting stranger and stranger, and I think that my judgment is being clouded by the fact that it is hard now for me to trust the tenant anymore. I will do my best to see what I can explain here, and maybe somebody in my area can help me out. I am in touch with a property management company as well, but it seems that a lot of them don't want to step in when there is already a difficult situation
I found an attorney recommended through a friend on bigger pockets. The attorney has counseled me that the tenant retains his right to stay in the property. His ex-girlfriend testified to the police that she left because he was hitting her repeatedly and she feared for her own safety and the safety of her daughter. The police also told me that he was lying about his suicide attempt, until they showed him the physical evidence, and then he admitted it. When I asked for the police report they told me that they were going to redact all of that out. Because of that, there is no evidence of any of it, and he can simply ledge that it was an accident. In order for an act to be "outragious in the extreme," which would be grounds for eviction for cause, it has to be on purpose.
About three weeks ago, the tenant asked me my preference, and I said I thought it would be better if they left. She couldn't wait to get out, and didn't even bother to send me notice. She could've gotten out of the lease sooner if she wrote me a letter with a qualified third-party testifying that there was domestic abuse, but she didn't even do that. At the time he was in Iowa, and he came back about a week sooner than he said he was going to originally, apparently to move his stuff out and throw away some leftover junk.
Up to this point, it has looked as though he was going to move out, but now he is saying that it is hard for him to find housing. He is living on an income of between 2600 and 4000 per month which seems to me like it would be enough. A couple days ago when he told me about his income, he made it sound like he could live there just fine on his own, except now he is telling me that he needs a roommate. He says that in order to have enough money to move by October, when the lease finally ends, he needs to be able to have the extra savings.
Up to this point, I have been trying to give him his space in hopes that he would move out. I told him that they could have their deposit back in full if he would just leave it in the condition that it is. That might've been a mistake.
On one hand, I would only be adding a roommate by addendum to the existing contract, which expires in five months, and they would be jointly and separately responsible for the rent. The damage to the building is already done regarding the carpets, and possibly paint on the walls which need to be replaced because of all the blood, So what is the big deal if I wait five months before having to do all that work. On the other hand, somebody, who is on his side not mine, would be moving in, and do I really want to give him and his friends more rights to the property than they already have.
And of course he is trying to explain that it would make it easier for him to move if you were able to save an extra $400 per month for a while, given all the money that he lost in the separation. Yes I know… Textbook example of tenants trying to make their problems yours.
It seems like if he had just had a break up, this request would not seem so unusual. But I realize that I am at the point where I can't trust him anymore.
How would you navigate a situation like this? Have any of you ever had to be forced to negotiate with the tenant who had legal rights to the property, but who you couldn't trust? That must be something that happens sometimes, and you just have to hold your tongue maybe. Thoughts? Of course there is the extra problem with the fact that he lives next door. If I were on the other side of town, I might have some peace of mind at least as to my own safety, but I feel like my decisions as a property manager are definitely influenced by that personal desire of self-preservation.
Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y
I suppose if your attorney is saying that this remaining tenant still has rights to the property, that you work with what you got. Although I do feel some people tend to be overly cautious...I don't see why you couldn't end a lease early due to gunfire on the Premises....*especially* when you live there! Perhaps you need to speak with a different attorney.
Rent is due... is he paying? If not, *immediately* file for eviction the second it's late. Do not let him give you excuses. File and if he pays before eviction, you can cancel it. Think of filing as your insurance.