Unapproved Pet - Not on Lease

Unapproved Pet - Not on Lease

New to Real Estate · Coppell, TX · Member since 2017 · 6 posts · 3 votes

Hello BP! We are managing our first rental property and have come across a concern with pets at the property. 

We approved 1 dog (specifically identified on the lease) for the tenants. We recently learned that they took in a cat and did not volunteer that information to us. At this point, it is considered against our policy of no cats and no unapproved animals, in addition to a breach of lease.

The tenant is offering to pay an additional pet fee, as well as additional rent to cover the animals. But our concern is the damage the cat has potentially done or will do to the home (flooring, smell, etc.). The fee and rent may not cover the cost of floor replacement or other damage that may occur. The flooring is all luxury vinyl plank, which was installed prior to the tenant moving in. While this flooring is water proof, we are still concerned about the cat urine getting into the seams and baseboards.

Our question then is whether we should take the additional fee ($400) and rent ($25/month), or stick with our policy and communicate that they must remove the pet from the property within a stated timeframe.

Any advice or lessons learned would be greatly appreciated!

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John UnderwoodPro Member
Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes
8y

@Kyle Burrows I am not a cat person either but I don't think they necessarily urinate over everything and destroy a house. I imagine that a trained cat would be no trouble at all. That said I would schedule an inspection to see if there is an issue. If you find a problem then you can resort to asking them to remove the cat an pay for any deodorizing or other remediation.  If you find no issues then you can charge the extra fees same as you did for the approved dog.

I also eliminate carpet and allow pets and so far have never had any pet damage. I charge a $300 pet fee (not a refundable pet deposit) and I do not charge any additional monthly rent for pets.

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  • Investor · Joplin, MO · Member since 2017 · 15 posts · 9 votes
    8y

    Take the additional money and do occasional inspections. Keep the rent coming in, people are selfish, stuff like this happens. The money helps make up for it lol.

  • Investor · Laurel, MD · Member since 2016 · 395 posts · 191 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Nathan Gesner:

    @Ihe O. if you don't care, why are you following the thread and posting on it? Stop trolling and move on.

    I'm sorry. I don't recall engaging you on this thread and am happy to keep it that way. If you have a problem absorbing alternative viewpoints find some other way of solving it. 

  • Handyman · Whittier, CA · Member since 2018 · 21 posts · 29 votes
    8y
    When I used to turn over apartments, I feel like dogs did more damage than cats. Cat pee does stink though, but if your floors are vinyl I wouldn’t worry so much about it lol. Cats will urinate to mark territory so even if you do inspections you will likely notice the smell. Personally I would rather take the increase in rent if they are good tenants and more importantly keep a good relationship to hopefully keep them as tenants longer. Since they broke your lease though, you need to talk to them firmly about that. If you aren’t firm with certain tenants then it could get progressively worse for you. Maybe put something in writing.
  • Chicago, IL · Member since 2018 · 6 posts · 6 votes
    8y

    As a cat owner, I can definitively say that my cats have in no way damaged my home, and I readily welcome pets into my rentals with additional fees and pet rents charged to compensate for the mere possibility of damage occurring (which it never has.) 

    Charge the fee, add additional pet rent, and allow the cat to stay. There are so many animals that need homes, and as long as a pet owner can demonstrate responsibility for the pet while maintaining the condition of the property, allowing pets is a win win for both the landlord and the tenant.

  • Investor · Whitinsville, MA · Member since 2014 · 29 posts · 2 votes
    8y

    Why not have them get renters insurance with a pet policy of an additional $5000.00 to cover any expense for any pet damage.  They must provide you with the insurance information.  I would also collect the additional deposit and pet rental fees.

  • Real Estate Agent · Grand Junction, CO · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 736 votes
    8y

    @David Wurzel not weighing in on the cat thing but "luxury vinyl" is a product used to create a higher end look for a lesser cost. Generally sold in 18" squares with a heavy backing to offer cushion and durability. Most I've seen look like tile. You actually use real grout between the squares. I used the product in my last personal kitchen because I can't physically tolerate the unforgiving nature of ceramic tile and the home already had hardwood floors elsewhere. Just FYI...

  • Investor · Temple, TX · Member since 2015 · 111 posts · 80 votes
    8y

    Wow, @Kyle Burrows, you really started something here...I do believe this will get you an award for being a debate starter! 

    I inherited seven tenants and seven leases when I bought my properties. The previous owners had a strict no pets policy. Well, guess what? Two of the tenants had animals, which I found out about later. (One tenant passed away suddenly. That's how I found out he had pets, but that's a story for another post.) The other one had a dog, which turned out to become an emotional support animal. (Yes, the tenant provided the necessary paperwork from their physician.) 


    The point of my story is that I changed the pet policy moving forward. Yes, pets are allowed with a deposit, shot records, proof of health and flea prevention in writing from a veterinarian. I would rather be aware of the pets and be able to monitor their presence than have a tenant sneak in an animal, which they tend to do.

    At this time, I'm a small enough operation that I can develop a personal relationship with my tenants. I know some advise against that, but I do it anyway, and it has paid off. We have open lines of communication and (I hope) some level of trust and respect that's not always found between landlord and tenant. 

    I approach the lease with the attitude that the house is the tenant's home, but my it is my responsibility. I leave them alone to live their lives, but they understand that I am ultimately responsible for the property, and I feel like (so far), they respect that. 

    One caveat to this: These are A/B properties in my neighborhood, so my tenants know that I'm nearby at all times. I'm aware that this situation is not always possible, like for long-distance landlords or certain property classes. 

    Best of luck with your first rental property! Whatever you ultimately decide to do will be the right decision for you.

  • Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    8y

    @Ihe O.

    Since you have engaged me I'll give it a try......

    if you don't care, why are you following the thread and posting on it? Stop trolling and move on.

    Come back when you invest in a property of your own and actually know something about the subject. Gees ...tenant activists.

  • Investor · Fort Wayne, IN · Member since 2016 · 48 posts · 13 votes
    8y

    @Account Closed

    What these two said. Lots of other good perspectives as well, less one poster.

  • Rental Property Investor · Davenport, FL · Member since 2016 · 593 posts · 382 votes
    8y

    @Kyle Burrows

    My lease has a hefty, daily pet violation fee. I would include one in your leases. Enforce the no pet policy. Some male cats have a tendency to spray the walls. A close friend of mine had to replace Sheetrock to get rid of the odor. The male cat was over 12 years-old and it went on most of that time. I can still smell it when I walk into the house, even though the Sheetrock was replaced. It probably soaked into the studs behind the Sheetrock.  

  • Investor · Mission Viejo, CA · Member since 2011 · 6 posts · 0 votes
    8y

    I just kicked out a tenant for having 3 dogs when the lease clearly stated no pets.  I had to clean up 1/4 of an acre of dog poop that was left to dry in the hot desert sun.  then I found out that they had dug a (*&##(*&#(* fire pit in the back yard....they had also installed a latch on a chain on the bathroom door into the master bedroom that tore the molding to bits. 

    So I think the 3 dogs were a sign that they weren't going to give a crap shoot about the property.

    I'd tell them to get rid of the cat or leave.  Actually, I'd just kick them out for breach of contract.

  • Joe SplitrockPro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ihe O.:
    Originally posted by @Nathan Gesner:

    @Ihe O. if you don't care, why are you following the thread and posting on it? Stop trolling and move on.

    I'm sorry. I don't recall engaging you on this thread and am happy to keep it that way. If you have a problem absorbing alternative viewpoints find some other way of solving it. 

    These are landlords looking for landlord viewpoints. I have read enough of your posts to know you are more likely a social worker or disgruntled tenant that is on here trying to troll landlords. Alternate view points are fine, but all your posts begin with some form of "you are wrong" to the person who posted something. The world isn't black and white. We don't all have to be wrong for you to be right. Sorry you see it that way.

  • Dick RosenPro Member
    Property Manager · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 451 votes
    8y

    I am not a fan of cats, in fact I hate cats but I really don't think that cat will cause as much damage as you are mentioning. I would do an inspection to see if they are taking proper care of their pets and not letting them destroy your house and assuming all is fine I would write up an addendum to add the cat and your typical pet fees/deposit/rent.

  • Rental Property Investor · Edison, NJ · Member since 2016 · 753 posts · 565 votes
    8y
    I would inspect the property to see if you see any damage. If you do not see any damage and the home is well kept and clean I would collect the extra money and allow the cat. I would also check to make sure the cat is spayed or neutered and require proof from a vet. If you see damage from the cat during the inspection then work on getting the tenants out. They may lie and say they got rid of the cat but just hide the cat at a friends home when they know you are coming to inspect or for maintenance.
  • Investor · Laurel, MD · Member since 2016 · 395 posts · 191 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Joe Splitrock:
    Originally posted by @Ihe O.:
    Originally posted by @Nathan Gesner:

    @Ihe O. if you don't care, why are you following the thread and posting on it? Stop trolling and move on.

    I'm sorry. I don't recall engaging you on this thread and am happy to keep it that way. If you have a problem absorbing alternative viewpoints find some other way of solving it. 

    These are landlords looking for landlord viewpoints. I have read enough of your posts to know you are more likely a social worker or disgruntled tenant that is on here trying to troll landlords. Alternate view points are fine, but all your posts begin with some form of "you are wrong" to the person who posted something. The world isn't black and white. We don't all have to be wrong for you to be right. Sorry you see it that way.

    My posts have got enough likes on this thread and I am not the only one who has pointed out the wrongheadedness of what you and others have written. I think someone  else called it specious reasoning.

    So quit whining at least until you can build your own website and make your own rules about who can post and what sentiments they have to express.

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    8y

    I am renovating a cat unit right now. Seller had maybe 2 cats for at least 10 years in there. When I first viewed the property I noticed the smell.

    But it wasn't until I started pulling up the vinyl plank flooring in the kitchen and the hallway when I realized how long these cats had been pissing in the same places. These planks that looked pretty nice got pulled up and showed an underside that looked, felt, and smelled like cat piss jelly -  thick.

    Now there is a layer of 12x12 linoleum glue down tile that was underneath the LVP. The stench is horrible. Floor guy says we can spray an enzyme solution and let is soak for a week, then cover with hardi and tile... I hope he's right.

  • Investor · Laurel, MD · Member since 2016 · 395 posts · 191 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Kyle Burrows:

    Thanks everyone for your information, it's been helpful to get different perspectives! We are going to enforce our lease and policy, rather than collect extra fees. And ensure we include more specific details in our leases going forward.

    Thanks BP!

    Sir, I asked you earlier what you were going to do if the tenant called your bluff  and you didn't answer. 

    Landlord tenant is not like parent child. Just because you have a lease and say something should stop happening doesn't make it so. And so while  you can start following others here and throwing around phrases like "enforce our lease" the reality is that your tools for doing so are limited. 

    Basically you can start proceedings to evict them. That's it. A lease doesn't give you any other remedy (apart from a pet fee which you don't seem to want).

    The problem with that remedy is that when you are a first time single unit landlord that's probably going to hurt you more than it is going to hurt the tenant.

  • Multi-family Investor · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2008 · 14 posts · 10 votes
    8y

    In response to Steve B about how people would not if a landlord enforces one provision with one tenant and not with another .....this would only seem to take effect if it were a duplex or fourplex, where tenants would probably know each other, the history, pets etc.

  • Investor · Cleveland, TN · Member since 2016 · 279 posts · 187 votes
    8y

    @Ramiro Burr That's a good point. Since my rental experience is MF my tenants know if the neighbor has pets. Interesting how experience plays into veiwpoints. :)

  • Ned J.Pro Member
    Investor · Manteca, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ihe O.:

    Landlord tenant is not like parent child. Just because you have a lease and say something should stop happening doesn't make it so. And so while  you can start following others here and throwing around phrases like "enforce our lease" the reality is that your tools for doing so are limited. 

    Basically you can start proceedings to evict them. That's it. A lease doesn't give you any other remedy (apart from a pet fee which you don't seem to want).

    You can either be landlord that lets the tenant set the rules, lie to you and ignore the lease, or you can actually enforce the rules YOU set in place in the lease and be in charge of the situation....YOUR CHOICE.

    Yes....your tools to enforce the lease are very limited....IF you do 1/2/3 year leases etc.....if you do M2M, its cake......30 days notice...bye bye.....

    Based on lots of posts by Ihe O, he/she is a landlord that will pretty much tolerate anything as long as the rent is paid eventually....do whatever, as long as I get my check eventually. That's their choice....that works for them......I don't run my business that way. I choose my battles, but I don't get pushed around by tenants and let them set the rules.

    And I disagree that the landlord/tenant relationship isn't pretty close to child/parent......know why the world is full of little a-hole kids that have no discipline or respect for other? Because their spineless parents didn't do anything because it might upset little Jimmy

    As usual the post got sidetracked into..... should I allow cats?........ that's up to you......there are pro/cons.... the REAL issue here is....SHOULD YOU ALLOW TENANTS TO IGNORE THE LEASE AND LIE TO YOU?  and how are you going to respond when you cant them in a big lie.... your choice

  • Investor · Laurel, MD · Member since 2016 · 395 posts · 191 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ned J.:
    Originally posted by @Ihe O.:

    Landlord tenant is not like parent child. Just because you have a lease and say something should stop happening doesn't make it so. And so while  you can start following others here and throwing around phrases like "enforce our lease" the reality is that your tools for doing so are limited. 

    Basically you can start proceedings to evict them. That's it. A lease doesn't give you any other remedy (apart from a pet fee which you don't seem to want).

    You can either be landlord that lets the tenant set the rules, lie to you and ignore the lease, or you can actually enforce the rules YOU set in place in the lease and be in charge of the situation....YOUR CHOICE.

    Yes....your tools to enforce the lease are very limited....IF you do 1/2/3 year leases etc.....if you do M2M, its cake......30 days notice...bye bye.....

    Based on lots of posts by Ihe O, he/she is a landlord that will pretty much tolerate anything as long as the rent is paid eventually....do whatever, as long as I get my check eventually. That's their choice....that works for them......I don't run my business that way. I choose my battles, but I don't get pushed around by tenants and let them set the rules.

    And I disagree that the landlord/tenant relationship isn't pretty close to child/parent......know why the world is full of little a-hole kids that have no discipline or respect for other? Because their spineless parents didn't do anything because it might upset little Jimmy

    As usual the post got sidetracked into..... should I allow cats?........ that's up to you......there are pro/cons.... the REAL issue here is....SHOULD YOU ALLOW TENANTS TO IGNORE THE LEASE AND LIE TO YOU?  and how are you going to respond when you cant them in a big lie.... your choice

    Yup. The whole point of  getting into the rental property business is to get paid and not to delude myself into thinking I am there  to  lord it over the people I rent to especially when I am being paid to provide a service.

    So for me the time to enforce the limited remedies in a lease is when I no longer believe the tenant is able or willing to pay the rent.

    I strategize on recruiting long term tenants. They would have to do something far more serious than bring in an unapproved pet to make me no longer want their long term money. 

    So let's say I believe it is more profitable to have a policy that places greater emphasis on customer retention.

  • Ned J.Pro Member
    Investor · Manteca, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y

    If you want to be a "do whatever you want in my property....lie to me, pay me late, trash the place....ignore the lease...do whatever you want....as long as I get my $$" kind of landlord, then more power to you..... your choice.

    Letting a tenant blatantly lie to me and have there be zero consequences is a path that I chose not go down. No way would I evict these people, but this is a situation where you set a precedent on how you expect the tenant to behave in your property. If you want the precedent to be "do whatever you want as long as I get my check", then that's your choice. That's just not the choice I would make

  • Investor · Laurel, MD · Member since 2016 · 395 posts · 191 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ned J.:

    If you want to be a "do whatever you want in my property....lie to me, pay me late, trash the place....ignore the lease...do whatever you want....as long as I get my $$" kind of landlord, then more power to you..... your choice.

    Letting a tenant blatantly lie to me and have there be zero consequences is a path that I chose not go down. No way would I evict these people, but this is a situation where you set a precedent on how you expect the tenant to behave in your property. If you want the precedent to be "do whatever you want as long as I get my check", then that's your choice. That's just not the choice I would make

    Ok my tenants don't lie to me because they don't fear the consequences of telling the truth 

    I'll explain my position more succinctly so you won't have cause to misrepresent it again.

    When it comes to leases, I choose my battles.

  • Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    8y

    @Ihe O.

    "The whole point of getting into the rental property business is to get paid"

    "When it comes to leases, I choose my battles."

    If you were a landlord, which I do not believe you are, your policies would be those of a slum landlord. As long as I get paid I don't care what my tenants do. You have never once agreed with any post regarding enforcing of a landlords lease and always support a tenants perspective ahead of operating a legitimate business. You are either not a landlord or at very best a very negligent landlord..ie slum.  

    Most of us take managing our properties very seriously you obviously prefer that your imaginary tenants operate your business.

    Time maybe you moved on to a tenant advocacy forum and leave us to operate our business properly without your input.

  • Investor · Laurel, MD · Member since 2016 · 395 posts · 191 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Thomas S.:

    @Ihe O.

    "The whole point of getting into the rental property business is to get paid"

    "When it comes to leases, I choose my battles."

    If you were a landlord, which I do not believe you are, your policies would be those of a slum landlord. As long as I get paid I don't care what my tenants do. You have never once agreed with any post regarding enforcing of a landlords lease and always support a tenants perspective ahead of operating a legitimate business. You are either not a landlord or at very best a very negligent landlord..ie slum.  

    Most of us take managing our properties very seriously you obviously prefer that your imaginary tenants operate your business.

    Time maybe you moved on to a tenant advocacy forum and leave us to operate our business properly without your input.

    For a guy whose philosophy is all about not being a charity , you seem to devote alot of time to giving out free advice on here.  See ,if you were actually the big landlord you claim you are you wouldn't have the time to do that.

    The only reason I give your posts the time of day is to counter the bad advice you keep dishing out that could really hurt people who may not know better. 

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