Tenant bidding war? need advice

Tenant bidding war? need advice

Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes

I own a nice home in a nice area.  Similar house on the corner just closed for $710,000.  3 bedroom home, 2.5 bath, nice but really kinda basic.  It's a great neighborhood and the best school in the county is just down the block, so it's primarily a family neighborhood and I prefer to keep turnover dates on the school schedule.  We are in the down-valley shadow of Vail and Beaver Creek ski resorts so there is international wealth pressures, lack of affordable housing and general scarcity.    I believe high demand will continue in the future and vacancy will be limited to less than a month (in 5 years of ownership and 4 tenants, turnover vacancy has ranged from overnight, to 1 week).  This makes a great formula for being a landlord.

The current tenants are out tomorrow.  I placed a yard sign last week and ZERO other marketing.  I've shown the house to 3 potential tenants and they have all been A+ (no background checks yet but my gut feelings were A++).  It has become a difficult decision to choose who would be best in the home.  

Asking rent is $2550 + utilities, first last security deposit is $7650 (which both strike me as a ton of money and beyond what I'd comfortably choose to afford, but this area is kinda going nuts).

Last night, the most recent prospective tenant (single mom and high school daughter) said she would sign a 2-year lease and have the cash to me before Monday.

The other competing tenant (family of 4) is actually former tenants.  They were in the home 1.5 years, great tenants, no issues.  Bought a house for ~$850k last year, moved out, are now selling that house for a profit because this area is kinda nuts, but now they need a place again.  They would require no background check and are financially solid.  They can only commit to a 10-month lease (which takes us to 5/31, on the school schedule and likely a time of high demand) and will almost certainly leave at that time, as they're looking at jobs outside the area.  I told them the other people offered a 2-year lease and they countered w $2900.

All other things equal, what is better?

10-month lease at $2900 to a known quantity, but having to clean, repair, and market the property again next summer?  $29,000 and maybe a higher established rent going forward?

Or $2550 for 2-years?  I haven't ran a background check yet but my gut feeling was definitely A+.    $61,200 guaranteed over 2 years?

I haven't even mentioned the other family, but they were incredible and I would rent to them in a heartbeat but I feel like I've already got a tough decision on who to choose.  Good problem to have!

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Investor · Downers Grove, IL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 955 votes
8y

@Ryan K.

Great issue to have!

Personally, I would go with the former tenant, AND have them hire a professional cleaning company to clean the house after they move out.  

Plus make sure they give you permission to start marketing and showing the house in March. That way, you could have a qualified tenant move in asap when they move out. 

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  • Property Manager · San Bernardino, CA · Member since 2014 · 473 posts · 238 votes
    8y

    Does the single mom have a good job that pays her $6,000 a month? Having a kid and paying that kind of rent would be extremely hard otherwise.

    I don't think you should go with your gut on this one and do background checks to make sure they can pay what they say they can pay.

    Choose what is best for you at the end of the day. You have all of the control in this.

  • Investor · Downers Grove, IL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 955 votes
    8y

    @Ryan K.

    Great issue to have!

    Personally, I would go with the former tenant, AND have them hire a professional cleaning company to clean the house after they move out.  

    Plus make sure they give you permission to start marketing and showing the house in March. That way, you could have a qualified tenant move in asap when they move out. 

  • Investor · Winter Park, FL · Member since 2017 · 171 posts · 165 votes
    8y

    i would go with former tenant, however I would still have them do a credit/background check (at their expense using something like SmartMove). 

    The known quantity is always a plus (if previous experience with them was good).  I’d also plan to show before they move out to minimize vacancy. 

  • Member since 2018 · 23 posts · 5 votes
    8y

    I agree with the responses above- go with the tenants you know AND do the credit check.  Also, ask the tenants if you can show the house before they move out.  Good luck!

  • Greenville, SC · Member since 2018 · 45 posts · 17 votes
    8y
    Do all of your standard checks first. You don’t want any surprises. There is definitely appeal on the 2yr lease. Could probably write in a rent increase after year one to keep up with the market. All else being equal, I’d say first come, first serve.
  • Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes
    8y

    Why do credit/background checks?  I did that on these people 2 years ago and it was spotless.  They supposedly bought the house from a motivated seller and are selling it to motivated buyer, more or less breaking even (so it appreciated at least 6% to cover broker commission is my guess).  If they were approved by a bank to buy an $850k home last year, now selling that home for a gain, I know them and have positive experiences and believe they have solid character, we were neighbors for a while, their young girls are very sweet (and occasionally very helpful with yard work) ...why would another background check be required?

  • Investor · Winter Park, FL · Member since 2017 · 171 posts · 165 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ryan K.:

    Why do credit/background checks?  I did that on these people 2 years ago and it was spotless.  They supposedly bought the house from a motivated seller and are selling it to motivated buyer, more or less breaking even (so it appreciated at least 6% to cover broker commission is my guess).  If they were approved by a bank to buy an $850k home last year, now selling that home for a gain, I know them and have positive experiences and believe they have solid character, we were neighbors for a while, their young girls are very sweet (and occasionally very helpful with yard work) ...why would another background check be required?

    Because things happen in 2 years and people are not always entirely truthful, for example people do sometimes sell houses for reasons other than to lock in a gain ;). 

    Or, because it’s your standard operating procedure w/ no exceptions, take your pick.  

    FWIW if they are motivated enough to offer to pay up for the 10 month lease they’re not gonna sweat a $40 background check. 

    Do whatever you want, if it were me I’d require a credit and background check. 

  • JD MartinBusiness Member
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    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    8y

    I would do the check. As noted above, people are not always truthful why things are the way they are. Why would someone sell a house they bought for $850k last year if they weren't moving out of the area? Either making a boatload of profit (meaning well more than $50k, since that's the RE break-even) or because they can't afford a mortgage on an $850k house any longer. A $680k mortgage (let's assume they had 20% down) plus taxes and insurance is going to be somewhere around $5k per month. That's a far cry from $2900 in rent. 

    As for the other candidate, the two year lease isn't really to your advantage. People break leases all the time. What if the market appreciates significantly during that time for rentals? What if you find the tenant is annoying? 

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  • Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes
    8y

    Great opinions, thanks to all.

    My wife thinks we should go w the 2-yr lease because my stress levels always increase when I have to actually do work for this $$$.

  • Investor · Winter Park, FL · Member since 2017 · 171 posts · 165 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ryan K.:

    Great opinions, thanks to all.

    My wife thinks we should go w the 2-yr lease because my stress levels always increase when I have to actually do work for this $$$.

    $3500 over 10 mos is not peanuts and if you know these people take care of the place the cleaning/turnover costs should be minimal. 

    Consider this - given you have a “bidding war” and the interest you have had in the unit, it’s reasonable to say that you have underpriced it.  Signing a 2yr lease is effectively locking in below market rates for 2 years. I would take the $2900/mo known quantity and plan to relist it at ~$2900/mo next summer, pending how the market is looking then of course.  If you’ve never had a problem filling it I don’t see why you are stressed about it, I actually sorta enjoy the marketing process. 

  • Colleen F.Pro Member
    Investor · Narragansett, RI · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    8y
    I would not do a two year lease but I would not favor tenants who are between houses you could be turning it around whenever they find the new place which could be 6 months... I would wonder why they are so anxious.
  • Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes
    8y

    If they pre-pay last month's rent and a security deposit equal to another month's rent, I think they have strong incentive to not bail in 6 months.  Well, actually they said they probably would buy before the end of May, but would commit to signing a lease and paying thru May.  Like I said, we have a previous relationship as neighbors and tenant/landlord and its a tiny town...so "friends" as well.  I don't think they'd have any trouble paying even if they bought a $1M house somewhere else.

    @Walt Dockery - you've got a good point about being under market.  That has usually been my approach, price it slightly under with a huge up front cost (first, last, security deposit), get a ton of applicants, select the best ones.  Below market rent keeps em there, huge $ up front shows they're probably not bums.  That said, I've also had 4 tenants in 5 years so maybe its not really keeping anyone there.

    But my wife just emailed me back, and again said she thinks a 2-yr stability would be best.

  • Steinhatchee, FL · Member since 2017 · 77 posts · 69 votes
    8y

    Seems Ive read more stories about the problems with 2 year leases than the advantages. What if she ends up with a crappy boyfriend moving in, or loses her job? With a 2 year lease, you are stuck with her no matter what.

    Id go with the devil you know vs. the devil you dont know. Or have the 2 year lease person sign a one year lease. They can always sign a new one when times up.

  • Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    8y
    Definitely Go with the former tenant ...and do not be dumb and do a two year lease ,that’s a horrible idea . In fact I’d do month to month instead of a year !
  • Investor · Winter Park, FL · Member since 2017 · 171 posts · 165 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ryan K.:

    If they pre-pay last month's rent and a security deposit equal to another month's rent, I think they have strong incentive to not bail in 6 months.  Well, actually they said they probably would buy before the end of May, but would commit to signing a lease and paying thru May.  Like I said, we have a previous relationship as neighbors and tenant/landlord and its a tiny town...so "friends" as well.  I don't think they'd have any trouble paying even if they bought a $1M house somewhere else.

    @Walt Dockery - you've got a good point about being under market.  That has usually been my approach, price it slightly under with a huge up front cost (first, last, security deposit), get a ton of applicants, select the best ones.  Below market rent keeps em there, huge $ up front shows they're probably not bums.  That said, I've also had 4 tenants in 5 years so maybe its not really keeping anyone there.

    But my wife just emailed me back, and again said she thinks a 2-yr stability would be best.

    Deliberately pricing below market makes no sense, esp where rent as a % of home value (per your first post) is already low.  P&I alone on a $700k house is close to $2900, people should be lining up to rent it at that price.  If house is clean and well maintained you’ll still have plenty of interest at market rent, you can still ask for first/last and deposit etc. 

    Notice how virtually everyone in the thread has said 2yr lease has more cons than pros. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Pensacola, FL · Member since 2018 · 196 posts · 130 votes
    8y

    I agree with the posts above. A known quantity for 10 months at a higher price is great. Still screen though just to cover your assets. 

    As some others are saying, you may be in a situation where you are priced too far below market. 

    And if your market continues to go crazy, you may find yourself in a situation where it makes sense to sell and redeploy your cash in a less expensive (or possibly less inflated) market.

    Best of luck!

  • Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Walt Dockery:

    Notice how virtually everyone in the thread has said 2yr lease has more cons than pros. 

    I guess I didn't mention there's a 1-bedroom apartment above the garage, also rented, for $1600.  So, the property would gross $4150 or $4500.  It was also bought from the bank in 2013 for $405.  The house on the corner that sold for $710 also has the "carriage house," so its a decent comp.

    I have offered it to the previous tenants at $2900, should hear back this afternoon if they're ready to sign a lease.  In the meantime, there have been 2 other yard sign calls, so either way, I believe it will rent soon.

  • Investor · Kansas City, MO · Member since 2017 · 791 posts · 1k+ votes
    8y

    Shoot if it's around $700k value, I'd sell it and buy something else that gets $7-10k per month in rent. 

    Do you think it will continue to appreciate? Or do you think you're near the top? If it's not going to keep moving upward at a fast pace, 0.3% rent to value is a terrible return. 

  • Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes
    8y

    Hey Austin,

    I'm open to leads.  What you got?

    I grew up in the Midwest and had been looking in my hometown.  Much lower barriers to entry, but I just heard another major employer is pulling out thousands of jobs.

    This one is in my town so easy to self-manage.  This area has a lot of positive things going for it, more similar to SF than Cleveland.  Wish I could have bought 10 of these 5 years ago.  Its appreciated 175% since purchase; since 2013, rents have increased 145%.  I agree its not the best cashflow, but I wouldn't call it a terrible return.

    I also didn't mention the property is directly next door to my in-laws and nephews.  We're planning to start a family soon so there may be a long-term babysitting synergy play here too!

  • Investor · Kansas City, MO · Member since 2017 · 791 posts · 1k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Ryan K.:

    Hey Austin,

    I'm open to leads.  What you got?

    I grew up in the Midwest and had been looking in my hometown.  Much lower barriers to entry, but I just heard another major employer is pulling out thousands of jobs.

    This one is in my town so easy to self-manage.  This area has a lot of positive things going for it, more similar to SF than Cleveland.  Wish I could have bought 10 of these 5 years ago.  Its appreciated 175% since purchase; since 2013, rents have increased 145%.  I agree its not the best cashflow, but I wouldn't call it a terrible return.

    I also didn't mention the property is directly next door to my in-laws and nephews.  We're planning to start a family soon so there may be a long-term babysitting synergy play here too!

    If you're thinking about moving into it in the future and having the family right there, that's a completely separate thing for you to weight versus just comparing strict investments. 

    So outside of moving back in and just looking investment, that was my question about the appreciation... you made a great return in those regards. If you sold your IRR would be through the roof for the time you've held it. And if it's going to continue then it may be worth holding, but if you see more of a plateau in that appreciation then your IRR will continue to fall as time goes on.

    There are lots of markets where you can buy fully rehabbed rentals at 1-1.2%. The biggest factor though is making sure you have a great management team, and if you're buying from an actual turnkey company, make sure they do solid work. There are lots of lipsticks on pigs in the turnkey world. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Orange County, CA · Member since 2016 · 513 posts · 374 votes
    8y
    Ryan K. You have a great investment property and it will always appreciate. You can’t compare to midwest and mid south areas of USA Cap rates are very similar if you buy in the top school neighborhoods in those cities as well Keep this one for retirement My 0.02 cents
  • Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 31k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    8y

    Turnover is a return killer. While I wouldn't give a tenant a discount for stating they will stay longer than one year I wouldn't entertain renting to another tenant who is guaranteed to be a short term tenant for a nominal increase like this one.

  • Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes
    8y

    former tenants signed a 10-month lease. First, last, security deposit paid. For rent sign pulled out of the front yard. Got about 2 weeks to do some minor maintenance and cleaning, which is actually a relief to not feel rushed! They were chatting with all their old neighbors and the little girls are excited to be back in their old rooms and neighborhood! Win win. Hardly any marketing, big rent increase, helping a happy local family. Sometimes this landlording biz really is too good to be true! Sometimes you also gotta spend a Sunday night fixing a fence gate. But my day job doesn’t let me have a beer while I work!

  • Rental Property Investor · Davenport, FL · Member since 2016 · 593 posts · 382 votes
    8y

    I can't wait until I am putting up a thread like this! Hey I have this awesome problem....can you all help me out with this decision that is going to gross me over $60k in the next two years! LoL. This is great. I love to read about these great problems. It is a good balance of the bad issues that we try to help with on here. 

  • Investor · Eagle, CO · Member since 2013 · 94 posts · 24 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Kristopher Hanks:

    I can't wait until I am putting up a thread like this! Hey I have this awesome problem....can you all help me out with this decision that is going to gross me over $60k in the next two years! LoL. This is great. I love to read about these great problems. It is a good balance of the bad issues that we try to help with on here. 

     Delayed gratification.  Save up now, make the sacrifices, pay your future self.  Stick to a plan and you'll be there soon!

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