Applicant did not disclose their emotional dog
Member since 2019 · 2 posts · 0 votes
Applicant did not disclose their emotional dog
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Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Violet Lisa:
I guess my situation is a little unusual - I have a potential tenant who has filled out applications but did not disclose they have an emotional support dog until we mentioned there will be a pet deposit since there will be a dog living on the property as well. I am okay with the pet situation but I feel it's a bit odd they told us the dog is emotional support right after my property manager let them know about the pet deposit instead of just being upfront about it. I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and I think this is dishonest. Can I deny the applicant at this point? I would appreciate any advise, thank you.
I was at a seminar and the word was that "emotional support" animals is a made up term. There are "Service Animals" used for blind, and other legitimate needs.
It's a scam and I wouldn't rent to them since they tried to hide their intent (to avoid paying a fee or deposit). Who knows what other trick they will try in the future.
https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-book...
II. Service Animal Defined by Title II and Title III of the ADAA service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Tasks performed can include, among other things, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items, alerting a person to a sound, reminding a person to take medication, or pressing an elevator button.
Emotional support animals, comfort animals, and therapy dogs are not service animals under Title II and Title III of the ADA.
For rental properties, ADA does not apply. ADA is more about public places like restaurants, libraries, clubs, schools etc...
The relevant federal regulations is HUD's Fair Housing Act, and Emotional Support Animals are covered and protected under that. If you reject ESA, you will violate FHA.
As far as I can tell there are four classifications.
Service Animals - those are trained animals that provides a specific need to their owners such as seeing eye dogs, medical alerts etc...there are online companies that one can order a vest for $20 and people put on their dogs to disguise them as SAs, when they are not. You cannot deny someone with an SA.
Emotional Support Amimals - any animals that is prescribed by a LMHP to ease anxiety of it's owner. Many online web sites will provide a letter of certification for a fee so this is a very easy vehicle for someone to get their pets certified as ESAs to be able to fly with their pets and to be able to move into no pet rentals. A significant number of those are scams but the problem is it's very difficult to prove it's a scam.
Therapy dogs - those are dogs trained to comfort elderly or terminally ill people at hospices, hospital, nursing homes, those are not specifically linked to an owner and are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Working dogs - those are police K9, trained to sniff bombs, track and retrieve, guard etc...and also are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Technically, IMO, you can't say they lied by not disclosing their pet or dog because they can say they don't think of it as a pet or regular dog, it's an ESA. You should have had an application that ask if they have any animals, not pets. You also should have something in the lease that require your approval if they have to move any animal in. In the case of a SA or ESA, you as the landlord has the right to verify the SA or ESA, by request to see documentation and call to verify with the provider to make sure the certification is legit, valid, active and current, and wellness documentation that the animal is in good health, free of parasite, flea, ticks, vaccinated etc...
40 Replies
- Specialist · Paradise Valley, AZ · Member since 2018 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Violet Lisa:
I guess my situation is a little unusual - I have a potential tenant who has filled out applications but did not disclose they have an emotional support dog until we mentioned there will be a pet deposit since there will be a dog living on the property as well. I am okay with the pet situation but I feel it's a bit odd they told us the dog is emotional support right after my property manager let them know about the pet deposit instead of just being upfront about it. I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and I think this is dishonest. Can I deny the applicant at this point? I would appreciate any advise, thank you.
I was at a seminar and the word was that "emotional support" animals is a made up term. There are "Service Animals" used for blind, and other legitimate needs.
It's a scam and I wouldn't rent to them since they tried to hide their intent (to avoid paying a fee or deposit). Who knows what other trick they will try in the future.
https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-book...
II. Service Animal Defined by Title II and Title III of the ADAA service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Tasks performed can include, among other things, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items, alerting a person to a sound, reminding a person to take medication, or pressing an elevator button.
Emotional support animals, comfort animals, and therapy dogs are not service animals under Title II and Title III of the ADA.
You must allow emotional support animals due to fair housing laws (not ADA as mentioned above). And actually, the law states that the ESA does not have to be disclosed during the application process. If you deny based on that alone, you could find yourself in a lawsuit. Yes, they have to request reasonable accommodation, but by law they can wait to do so until after their application has been approved.
The current law is full of loopholes for scammers, but unfortunately it’s what we have to work with...
This site offers some helpful info:
The tenant is obviously lying. Insist that they show proof of need from their regular doctor. Make it clear a form off of the internet is not sufficient. It must be from their regular family doctor.
At this point in time your best option is to only offer them a M2M lease, this will hopefully discourage them from applying. If they do apply do not make an issue over the dog, keep taking applications and wait till you have a applicant that is more qualified. You can then legitimately reject this applicant.
Landlords are not legally obligated to accept emonimals or service animals if you have a more qualified applicant.I use this system to eliminate all applicants trying to circumvent my no animal policy.
Hopefully someday soon this problem will go away. The few that may legitimately need an ESA are lumped in with all of the scammers out there, of which I personally think the majority are.
I was not aware they did not have to disclose the ESA on the application. This is yet another loophole unscrupulous people will exploit. My application asks about "animals" and states misrepresentations on the app are grounds for disqualification. Wonder how that would play out when push comes to shove?
Sheesh. What a mess.
Originally posted by @Wesley W.:
My application asks about "animals" and states misrepresentations on the app are grounds for disqualification. Wonder how that would play out when push comes to shove?
Sheesh. What a mess.
My application has the same; specifically, I ask how many animals they have. I’ve never had an applicant not disclose upfront, so I’m not sure how it would play out either. I imagine if they just move in an ESA without requesting accommodation you could hold them in violation of the lease. However, if you approve them and they then submit the reasonable accommodation request, you really are without options. I’ve seen ESA “certification” sites that actually encourage tenants not to disclose until after they are accepted, so that they “aren’t discriminated against.”
Yeah, I’ll just leave that alone...
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Violet Lisa:
I guess my situation is a little unusual - I have a potential tenant who has filled out applications but did not disclose they have an emotional support dog until we mentioned there will be a pet deposit since there will be a dog living on the property as well. I am okay with the pet situation but I feel it's a bit odd they told us the dog is emotional support right after my property manager let them know about the pet deposit instead of just being upfront about it. I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and I think this is dishonest. Can I deny the applicant at this point? I would appreciate any advise, thank you.
I was at a seminar and the word was that "emotional support" animals is a made up term. There are "Service Animals" used for blind, and other legitimate needs.
It's a scam and I wouldn't rent to them since they tried to hide their intent (to avoid paying a fee or deposit). Who knows what other trick they will try in the future.
https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-book...
II. Service Animal Defined by Title II and Title III of the ADAA service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Tasks performed can include, among other things, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items, alerting a person to a sound, reminding a person to take medication, or pressing an elevator button.
Emotional support animals, comfort animals, and therapy dogs are not service animals under Title II and Title III of the ADA.
For rental properties, ADA does not apply. ADA is more about public places like restaurants, libraries, clubs, schools etc...
The relevant federal regulations is HUD's Fair Housing Act, and Emotional Support Animals are covered and protected under that. If you reject ESA, you will violate FHA.
As far as I can tell there are four classifications.
Service Animals - those are trained animals that provides a specific need to their owners such as seeing eye dogs, medical alerts etc...there are online companies that one can order a vest for $20 and people put on their dogs to disguise them as SAs, when they are not. You cannot deny someone with an SA.
Emotional Support Amimals - any animals that is prescribed by a LMHP to ease anxiety of it's owner. Many online web sites will provide a letter of certification for a fee so this is a very easy vehicle for someone to get their pets certified as ESAs to be able to fly with their pets and to be able to move into no pet rentals. A significant number of those are scams but the problem is it's very difficult to prove it's a scam.
Therapy dogs - those are dogs trained to comfort elderly or terminally ill people at hospices, hospital, nursing homes, those are not specifically linked to an owner and are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Working dogs - those are police K9, trained to sniff bombs, track and retrieve, guard etc...and also are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Technically, IMO, you can't say they lied by not disclosing their pet or dog because they can say they don't think of it as a pet or regular dog, it's an ESA. You should have had an application that ask if they have any animals, not pets. You also should have something in the lease that require your approval if they have to move any animal in. In the case of a SA or ESA, you as the landlord has the right to verify the SA or ESA, by request to see documentation and call to verify with the provider to make sure the certification is legit, valid, active and current, and wellness documentation that the animal is in good health, free of parasite, flea, ticks, vaccinated etc...
Originally posted by @Thomas S.:
The tenant is obviously lying. Insist that they show proof of need from their regular doctor. Make it clear a form off of the internet is not sufficient. It must be from their regular family doctor.
That depends on the state. You may not be able to insist the proof of need come from their regular doctor.
In my state (Florida), they are just now looking at a new senate bill requiring the certification is NOT from someone who the "disabled" has seen only exclusively for a fee. It hasn't even passed yet. Until then many landlords' hands are cuffed.
(May 17, 2004) states that a doctor or “other medical professional, a peer support group, a non-medical service agency, or a reliable third party who is in a position to know about the tenant's disability" may provide the verification of the tenant's disability.
That is an exceedingly low bar. A peer support group is a joke? So practically anyone can provide the verification needed. My neighbor may be able to verify that I need 50 rattle snakes to stay mentally stable. So the online instant certification for $30 may be "Legit" under the letter of the law even though we know it's a scam.
also there seems to be a dozen concurrent threads on this topic with only slight variances.
I wish there is a way all these discussions can be distilled, digested and build on to get us landlords more educated. Right now it seems to be all over the places.
- Specialist · Paradise Valley, AZ · Member since 2018 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Jen R.:
You must allow emotional support animals due to fair housing laws (not ADA as mentioned above). And actually, the law states that the ESA does not have to be disclosed during the application process. If you deny based on that alone, you could find yourself in a lawsuit. Yes, they have to request reasonable accommodation, but by law they can wait to do so until after their application has been approved.
The current law is full of loopholes for scammers, but unfortunately it’s what we have to work with...
This site offers some helpful info:
That link pertains to Wisconsin. Just curious why you think it applies to Ohio or anywhere else?
What is an Emotional Support Animal (ESA)?An Emotional Support Animal is newly defined by Wis. Stat. 106.50(1m)(im)
@Account Closed - yes, the website is run by a group in Wisconsin, but federal housing law governs ESA’s (and trumps any state laws, as the article points out). It’s difficult to find clearly explained info on the federal sites, and I thought the website did a nice job breaking down the federal laws in a practical way.
- Specialist · Paradise Valley, AZ · Member since 2018 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Sam Leon:
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Violet Lisa:
I guess my situation is a little unusual - I have a potential tenant who has filled out applications but did not disclose they have an emotional support dog until we mentioned there will be a pet deposit since there will be a dog living on the property as well. I am okay with the pet situation but I feel it's a bit odd they told us the dog is emotional support right after my property manager let them know about the pet deposit instead of just being upfront about it. I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and I think this is dishonest. Can I deny the applicant at this point? I would appreciate any advise, thank you.
I was at a seminar and the word was that "emotional support" animals is a made up term. There are "Service Animals" used for blind, and other legitimate needs.
It's a scam and I wouldn't rent to them since they tried to hide their intent (to avoid paying a fee or deposit). Who knows what other trick they will try in the future.
https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-book...
II. Service Animal Defined by Title II and Title III of the ADAA service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Tasks performed can include, among other things, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items, alerting a person to a sound, reminding a person to take medication, or pressing an elevator button.
Emotional support animals, comfort animals, and therapy dogs are not service animals under Title II and Title III of the ADA.
For rental properties, ADA does not apply. ADA is more about public places like restaurants, libraries, clubs, schools etc...
The relevant federal regulations is HUD's Fair Housing Act, and Emotional Support Animals are covered and protected under that. If you reject ESA, you will violate FHA.
As far as I can tell there are four classifications.
Service Animals - those are trained animals that provides a specific need to their owners such as seeing eye dogs, medical alerts etc...there are online companies that one can order a vest for $20 and people put on their dogs to disguise them as SAs, when they are not. You cannot deny someone with an SA.
Emotional Support Amimals - any animals that is prescribed by a LMHP to ease anxiety of it's owner. Many online web sites will provide a letter of certification for a fee so this is a very easy vehicle for someone to get their pets certified as ESAs to be able to fly with their pets and to be able to move into no pet rentals. A significant number of those are scams but the problem is it's very difficult to prove it's a scam.
Therapy dogs - those are dogs trained to comfort elderly or terminally ill people at hospices, hospital, nursing homes, those are not specifically linked to an owner and are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Working dogs - those are police K9, trained to sniff bombs, track and retrieve, guard etc...and also are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Technically, IMO, you can't say they lied by not disclosing their pet or dog because they can say they don't think of it as a pet or regular dog, it's an ESA. You should have had an application that ask if they have any animals, not pets. You also should have something in the lease that require your approval if they have to move any animal in. In the case of a SA or ESA, you as the landlord has the right to verify the SA or ESA, by request to see documentation and call to verify with the provider to make sure the certification is legit, valid, active and current, and wellness documentation that the animal is in good health, free of parasite, flea, ticks, vaccinated etc...
Your Comment: "The relevant federal regulations is HUD's Fair Housing Act, and Emotional Support Animals are covered and protected under that. If you reject ESA, you will violate FHA."
Your Source please?
It says "MAY REQUEST" that doesn't mean you are OBLIGATED.
My source is here: A down loadable link to settle the question directly from HUD. I suggest you read it before asserting a position.
- Investor · Milwaukee - Mequon, WI · Member since 2010 · 5k+ posts · 7k+ votes7y
@Violet Lisa - not sure where you, but be careful with State law and advice from other States!
To offer a different take on your question: why not? We are very pet friendly!
Always have been for 10 years now, and it has served us well. We charge a extra monthly pet fee - $25 to $50 is normal in the Midwest. If your security deposit is smaller (under $1000), you can also request an additional pet deposit to protect yourselves from damages.
In my experience kids are way more destructive on properties than pets!
And pet owners are usually very responsible and will actually confess any pet damages before they want to move out and offer to pay for that. You never get this with regular damage; they usually try to not bring it up. Usually some scratches on a door or the front window sill.
So, if you like the tenant, why don't you make some extra money?
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Your Source please?
It says "MAY REQUEST" that doesn't mean you are OBLIGATED.
My source is here: A down loadable link to settle the question directly from HUD. I suggest you read it before asserting a position.
Actually, HUD states that the tenant may request reasonable accommodation, but the housing provider "must meet their obligations under...the reasonable accommodation standard...".
I guess I’m not really sure what point you are trying to make? There are very narrow circumstances under which you can claim undue hardship.
- Investor · Milwaukee - Mequon, WI · Member since 2010 · 5k+ posts · 7k+ votes7y
Forgot to mention - Mike Butler wrote a great book Landlording on Autopilot. He is a ex-cop and very street smart.
His tip: never flat out decline an applicant, just keep asking for more documentation, references etc. - they usually move on.
@Marcus Auerbach if the animal is legitimately an ESA, you cannot legally charge extra pet rent or deposit.
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Sam Leon:
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Violet Lisa:
I guess my situation is a little unusual - I have a potential tenant who has filled out applications but did not disclose they have an emotional support dog until we mentioned there will be a pet deposit since there will be a dog living on the property as well. I am okay with the pet situation but I feel it's a bit odd they told us the dog is emotional support right after my property manager let them know about the pet deposit instead of just being upfront about it. I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and I think this is dishonest. Can I deny the applicant at this point? I would appreciate any advise, thank you.
I was at a seminar and the word was that "emotional support" animals is a made up term. There are "Service Animals" used for blind, and other legitimate needs.
It's a scam and I wouldn't rent to them since they tried to hide their intent (to avoid paying a fee or deposit). Who knows what other trick they will try in the future.
https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-book...
II. Service Animal Defined by Title II and Title III of the ADAA service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Tasks performed can include, among other things, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items, alerting a person to a sound, reminding a person to take medication, or pressing an elevator button.
Emotional support animals, comfort animals, and therapy dogs are not service animals under Title II and Title III of the ADA.
For rental properties, ADA does not apply. ADA is more about public places like restaurants, libraries, clubs, schools etc...
The relevant federal regulations is HUD's Fair Housing Act, and Emotional Support Animals are covered and protected under that. If you reject ESA, you will violate FHA.
As far as I can tell there are four classifications.
Service Animals - those are trained animals that provides a specific need to their owners such as seeing eye dogs, medical alerts etc...there are online companies that one can order a vest for $20 and people put on their dogs to disguise them as SAs, when they are not. You cannot deny someone with an SA.
Emotional Support Amimals - any animals that is prescribed by a LMHP to ease anxiety of it's owner. Many online web sites will provide a letter of certification for a fee so this is a very easy vehicle for someone to get their pets certified as ESAs to be able to fly with their pets and to be able to move into no pet rentals. A significant number of those are scams but the problem is it's very difficult to prove it's a scam.
Therapy dogs - those are dogs trained to comfort elderly or terminally ill people at hospices, hospital, nursing homes, those are not specifically linked to an owner and are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Working dogs - those are police K9, trained to sniff bombs, track and retrieve, guard etc...and also are not protected by reasonable accommodation.
Technically, IMO, you can't say they lied by not disclosing their pet or dog because they can say they don't think of it as a pet or regular dog, it's an ESA. You should have had an application that ask if they have any animals, not pets. You also should have something in the lease that require your approval if they have to move any animal in. In the case of a SA or ESA, you as the landlord has the right to verify the SA or ESA, by request to see documentation and call to verify with the provider to make sure the certification is legit, valid, active and current, and wellness documentation that the animal is in good health, free of parasite, flea, ticks, vaccinated etc...
Your Comment: "The relevant federal regulations is HUD's Fair Housing Act, and Emotional Support Animals are covered and protected under that. If you reject ESA, you will violate FHA."
Your Source please?
It says "MAY REQUEST" that doesn't mean you are OBLIGATED.
My source is here: A down loadable link to settle the question directly from HUD. I suggest you read it before asserting a position.
my assertion is supported by the link to the HUD document you linked. Your original statements:
"I was at a seminar and the word was that "emotional support" animals is a made up term. There are "Service Animals" used for blind, and other legitimate needs." ESA of course is not a service animal, but is not a made up term. It is recognized as a class of assistance animal protected by FHA for those owners who seek reasonable accommodation. Yes a large portion of them are scam but that doesn't mean 100% of them are "made up".
"It's a scam and I wouldn't rent to them since they tried to hide their intent (to avoid paying a fee or deposit). Who knows what other trick they will try in the future." it MAY BE and most likey is a scam but then an often used counter argument is that the landlord asked if an applicant has a PET, so they say no. That is because supposedly ESA owners do not think of ESA as a pet. So people can argue until they are blue in the face whether the non-disclosure is a lie to get around a no pet policy or because they do not think of their ESAs as pets and there is no way to prove it one way or another. At the end of the day is what a landlord feels comfortable in how far to take it.
- Investor · Milwaukee - Mequon, WI · Member since 2010 · 5k+ posts · 7k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Jen R.:
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Your Source please?
It says "MAY REQUEST" that doesn't mean you are OBLIGATED.
My source is here: A down loadable link to settle the question directly from HUD. I suggest you read it before asserting a position.
Actually, HUD states that the tenant may request reasonable accommodation, but the housing provider "must meet their obligations under...the reasonable accommodation standard...".
I guess I’m not really sure what point you are trying to make? There are very narrow circumstances under which you can claim undue hardship.
You are right! I stand corrected - no pet fee for legitimate ESA.
@Violet Lisa - every time a new post comes up about ESA’s, it is full of conflicting information - and much of that is understandable because the current laws have some difficult to understand nuances (like the issue of disclosure, for example), and because they are so easy to abuse by dishonest tenants. I found out this week that I can’t require an applicant to fill out a reasonable request form that I provide them; I can ask them to, but if they refuse and present their own doctor’s “note” instead, I cannot require an additional form. I can merely attempt to verify the letter they provide.
At the end of the day, don’t trust any of us and confirm with your local RE attorney if you are still unsure!
"That is an exceedingly low bar. A peer support group is a joke? So practically anyone can provide the verification"
This is the primary reason why ESA should not even be a issue. I can not understand why landlords continue questioning this issue. I have consistently avoided renting to anyone applying to rent having a ESA animal. I consider 100% of them to be a scam. As soon as I see they have a ESA it is automatic rejection since I do not allow animals. If a applicant is trying to avoid paying a pet fee...…...pass.
I have legally informed every single one that the unit has been rented. I always select a applicant more qualified and have never been challenged. If I was challenged I would have no issue supporting my selection. ESA should never be a concern for landlords.
- Rock Hill, SC · Member since 2012 · 28 posts · 13 votes7y
The very best thing we can do as landlords is to contact your US Congressman. If enough of us complain and keep complaining about this scam, they will narrow the law and regulations. If you donate to your Congressman, a political party or even if you are just a Registered Voter. COMPLAIN.
- Member since 2019 · 2 posts · 0 votes7y
Thanks so much, everyone! I am so glad to see all your replies. The rental property is in Sacramento, CA. The applicant did tell me they have a dog. The tricky part was as soon as we mentioned the pet deposit, she said the dog was an ESA animal. She's been calling yesterday and today for an update.
I live far away in a different city and I feel I need to find someone who I can trust, this raises a little red flag to me.
- Originally posted by @Thomas S.:
This is the primary reason why ESA should not even be a issue. I can not understand why landlords continue questioning this issue. I have consistently avoided renting to anyone applying to rent having a ESA animal. I consider 100% of them to be a scam. As soon as I see they have a ESA it is automatic rejection since I do not allow animals. If a applicant is trying to avoid paying a pet fee...…...pass.
While I agree with your sentiments regarding the ease of scamming the system, I disagree that landlords should not consider this an issue. I know for a fact that in our area there are individuals who call about vacancies for the sole purpose of tripping a landlord up and then slamming them with a fair housing lawsuit. I’m confident I have been contacted by some of these individuals in the past based on the way they word their questions. If a landlord does not know the law, he/she can easily be tripped up and respond with the “wrong” answer.
Also, under the current laws a tenant can apply, be approved, and move in, and THEN submit an ESA accommodation request. I’m genuinely curious as to what you would do in that scenario? At that point it’s not as simple as moving on to a more qualified applicant.
- 7yMike CumbieBusiness MemberREALTOR® · Brockport, NY · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
The poster you are responding to is also not in the U.S so the laws/requirements are not the same. Canada has their own versions of fair housing laws and they are different than ours. I can say "If I was in New Zealand, I'd smack the little pallywog on the rump and send it on it's way". But since I am not there and am under no jurisdiction ....MEH.
As far as the original poster, I would in no way use that service animal/wheelchair/eyeglasses/cross eye/stutter/loss of hair/peg leg or eyepatch as a reason for approving or denying an applicant. Them failing to disclose any of those conditions would also not be a cause for me to evict or question their intentions.
Just my 2 cents (and hopefully when the feds are scrubbing through these post I get to look like the good guy!)
- Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Violet Lisa:
I guess my situation is a little unusual - I have a potential tenant who has filled out applications but did not disclose they have an emotional support dog until we mentioned there will be a pet deposit since there will be a dog living on the property as well. I am okay with the pet situation but I feel it's a bit odd they told us the dog is emotional support right after my property manager let them know about the pet deposit instead of just being upfront about it. I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and I think this is dishonest. Can I deny the applicant at this point? I would appreciate any advise, thank you.
I was at a seminar and the word was that "emotional support" animals is a made up term. There are "Service Animals" used for blind, and other legitimate needs.
It's a scam and I wouldn't rent to them since they tried to hide their intent (to avoid paying a fee or deposit). Who knows what other trick they will try in the future.
https://adata.org/publication/service-animals-book...
II. Service Animal Defined by Title II and Title III of the ADAA service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Tasks performed can include, among other things, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items, alerting a person to a sound, reminding a person to take medication, or pressing an elevator button.
Emotional support animals, comfort animals, and therapy dogs are not service animals under Title II and Title III of the ADA.
ADA is not a law that applies to residential real estate. It applies to public facilities. The Fair Housing Act and its later ammendments is the applicable law to residential real estate, and under that law a a service animal includes many things including "providing emotional support to persons with disabilities who have a disability related need for such support." (HUD Guidance memo FHEO-2013-01) The memo goes on to explain the differences between the ADA and FHA and how each view support animals and what applies.
District Invest Group545 Reviews Originally posted by @Jen R.:
@Violet Lisa - every time a new post comes up about ESA’s, it is full of conflicting information - and much of that is understandable because the current laws have some difficult to understand nuances (like the issue of disclosure, for example), and because they are so easy to abuse by dishonest tenants. I found out this week that I can’t require an applicant to fill out a reasonable request form that I provide them; I can ask them to, but if they refuse and present their own doctor’s “note” instead, I cannot require an additional form. I can merely attempt to verify the letter they provide.
At the end of the day, don’t trust any of us and confirm with your local RE attorney if you are still unsure!
I also have read in different places that one way to sniff out the scammers from the legit ESA owners is to require a special form and verify, and I have often wondered what if the applicant present you with their own certificate from FiveMinuteESACertificateForFiveDollars.com, then what do you do? I tend to agree that you can't insist on them using your own form, and you can't just outright deny it simply because you suspect it's BS. If you do call, I doubt you will be able to get much out of it since the applicant only had to fill out an electronic survey to obtain the certification.
and yes many of those web sites recommended to their users to not disclose initially then bring on the animal later as a surprise and say "oh, it's not a pet".
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