Tenant is Anti-Glyphosate (Round Up) - Realistic Request?

🎉 Director of Events at BiggerPockets · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 425 posts · 438 votes

I recently contracted a landscaping company to do a complete overhaul at my rental. Today, the tenant contacts me unhappy that they were using Round-Up as it contains glyphosate. Trying to reassure her, I sent her links to the EPA site (https://www.epa.gov/ingredients-used-pesticide-products/glyphosate) which states that it isn't harmful when used correctly. She does not believe it and is adamant that they stop and switch to a more natural solution.

Has anyone else had this come up with tenants?

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Russell BrazilBusiness Member

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Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes

Just dont use round up no big deal, and just tell her, cool I get it, we wont use round up, but you will have to deal with the weeds. You are constrained by what is possible.

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Tim Bergmann
Contractor · St. Louis, MO · Member since 2019 · 1 post · 0 votes
7y
@Alexandra Hughes There are other options the landscaper can use however glyphosate is generally the most economical. The main decision to me would be whether or not you want to give in to their request.
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Jim K.
Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes
7y
Originally posted by @Alexandra Hughes Pailet:

@John Clark It’s the only product they regularly use and I believe it. They aren’t the most organized company but they work hard and get the job done.
I told them about other options - the vinegar mix, per my tenant - but it was going to delay work by a day. Ultimately we all compromised and found a solution, however, I’m glad they could use the chemical as planned because these Colorado weeds are no joke. I lived in the house before and tried everything I could last year and they just kept coming back.
Glyphosate concentrate is maybe $15/gallon when you buy in bulk and each gallon makes 16 high-concentrate gallons of general-purpose weedkiller, more when you dilute it down further to the 2% recommendation. Cheap as hell and effective for months.
I spray for bugs every year, too, but you never hear about bug spray cancer, no, no, no, and that stuff is transparently dangerous to children and pets. People literally take a bath in pool chemicals. And do you think the Brita pitchers actually filter out the chemicals used to sterilize the water? Of course not, but the glyphosate is a convenient target. People are basically eating it by the handful in their bread and vegetables and seeds and nuts and corn oil, but no, no, glyphosate KILLS! KILLS YA DEAD!!!
Lee will know better, but there's also a dye that you can add to any sprayed product to see where you're spraying it. Don't know what it does to equipment, if anything. Never used it. I just spray glyphosate as the best imperfect alternative.
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Camille T.Pro Member
Member since 2019 · 44 posts · 33 votes
7y
I would be concerned about liability, especially since it is in the news and known to be an issue. And, I would never lie to my tenants. My business and personal reputation are important.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/jury-awards-couple-2billion-monsanto-roundup-weed-killer-cancer-lawsuit-trial-today-2019-05-13/
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Alexandra Hughes PailetPro Member
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🎉 Director of Events at BiggerPockets · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 425 posts · 438 votes
7y
@Camille Treacy I completely agree! I am lightly concerned about the liability but more importantly I did not want to be dishonest with her. I’m glad we were able to come to a compromise and I could be truthful with her even though we disagreed about the potential risk of using the product.
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Alexandra Hughes PailetPro Member
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🎉 Director of Events at BiggerPockets · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 425 posts · 438 votes
7y
@Mike Cumbie That is great advice. It’s kind of funny because the yard is awful and full of very persistent weeds but the tenant said it was fine with her. Knowing it would likely become a future issue, I decided to bite the bullet and hire out for the full overhaul of the front yard (street facing so the city will care about the appearance). I decided to go with a 90% hardscape for minimal maintenance as the tenant expressed that she did not want to do much yard work even though basic yard upkeep is in her lease. The overhaul and xieroscape option was supposed to be a win/win for us both as she is potentially a long-term tenant (4 years). To my surprise, she stopped the landscapers when they were halfway finished after she saw the chemicals they were using. Thankfully we found a quick compromise but in the future I don’t want to give in when I’m footing the bill for repairs. I was emphatic since she was very passionate about this topic and how it related to her health, which I can understand. In the future I’ll try to stand my ground depending on the issue or request.
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Ned J.Pro Member
Investor · Manteca, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
7y
If you don't change it then EVERY issue that the woman has will be because of the RoundUp......she will blame EVERY illness or issue on YOU for using that chemical, when she told you not to...
She has a headache?.... it's the RoundUp....
Got a skin rash?.... its the RoundUp...
18 year old pet die?...... its the RoundUp.....
Favorite sports team lose in game 7?...... its the RoundUp......
Change the chemical used or you will deal with more drama then its worth..... her perception of risk, whether it be true or not, is not worth the hassle when you compare it to making a small change in the weed control plan
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Zak Reynold
Member since 2019 · 1 post · 2 votes
7y
There is several thousands of lawsuits pending & over $5 billion worth of decisions in 3 lawsuits. California has made it illegal & several other states are likely to follow. By the way "If used properly" already has been taken out of the equation according to the courts that handed down those judgments. I would just tell them if they find a safe alternative to go ahead with it
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Mark S.
Real Estate Investor · Saint Paul, MN · Member since 2017 · 543 posts · 474 votes
7y
@Matt Michaelson if it was horribly dangerous we would all be sick or dead.Do you eat baked goods, for example? Do you realize that small grain fields are sprayed with Roundup to kill them off so the grain starts to dry? That corn has been modified to be ‘Roundup ready?
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Greg M.
Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 5k+ votes
7y
Originally posted by @Zak Reynold:

There is several thousands of lawsuits pending & over $5 billion worth of decisions in 3 lawsuits. California has made it illegal & several other states are likely to follow. By the way "If used properly" already has been taken out of the equation according to the courts that handed down those judgments. I would just tell them if they find a safe alternative to go ahead with it
It is NOT illegal in California. It has been added to a long list of chemicals that may cause cancer. Santa Rosa, a small city, banned it in public parks as a feel good measure. Oddly they didn't ban it for the vast vineyards that supply much of the grapes for CA wines.
As for the lawsuits, CA is a state filled with millions of people whose IQ hovers around 70. The fact that a couple of juries ignored the science and instead bought the sob story does not mean that it will continue. These insane judgments will get greatly reduced and then the verdicts will get overturned by more reasonable courts.
Until Roundup is banned, landlords are free to use it.
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Greg M.
Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 5k+ votes
7y
Originally posted by @Victor S.:

folks that are so up in arms about this product, are you guys swimming in it or what? hell, even Starbucks had to put a cancer sticker on their coffee cups in CA...
Excuse me Victor, but you clearly don't grasp the seriousness of the cancer situation. These signs save an untold number of lives every year. I live in CA. I see these signs everywhere daily. I do not have cancer. That's proof that these signs work and save lives.
For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of visiting CA, Proposition 65 requires that everything that could cause cancer be labeled with a warning. The fact that you'd have to drink 500 cups of coffee daily for years to get cancer is meaningless. It needs to be labeled. The warnings are on most buildings, restaurants, markets, gas stations, auto dealers, wherever alcohol/tobacco/Rx are sold, etc. They are a complete and total joke and no one here takes them seriously. They are absolutely ignored.
WARNING: This post contains a chemical known to the State of California to cause cancer, birth defects, or other reproductive harm.
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Matt K.
Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
7y
Again, why not just let tenant take care of this? If they fail to perform then revert back to current provider or whatver...
But if they're this concerned and appears motivated...seems like a win win.
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Steve Pugh
Rental Property Investor · Houston, TX · Member since 2017 · 3 posts · 1 vote
7y
@Alexandra Hughes roundup causes cancer. Big lawsuit going on. Monsanto covered this up for years. Yes, it is reasonable request and you could be leaving yourself open to to lawsuit.
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Joe SplitrockPro Member
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Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes
7y
Unfortunately people panic and use emotion instead of logic. You don't get cancer because someone sprayed your yard for weeds. That is like saying if someone next to you is smoking a cigarette that you will get lung cancer. Cancer causing agents don't affect you if the exposure is short or infrequent. (Minus something crazy like nuclear fallout.) The people who got cancer from RoundUp were farmers who sprayed hundreds of acres for many years. They sat in a tractor with the chemical surrounding them in the air for hours at a time. Or they came in direct contact with the chemical repeatedly handling it.
Your tenant can just stay out of the yard and they will get no exposure. Any fumes will clear in a matter of hours. Unless they are laying on the ground rolling around in the wet RoudnUp, they won't get any in their system at all.
Your tenant should be much more worried about skin cancer, which the risks statistically increase at higher elevations. Maybe she uses sun screen, but testing shows that chemicals in sunscreen are absorbed into your body and could also lead to cancer.
If she is worried about absorption in her food, she should be aware that most every corn field in the US is covered in roundup for weed prevention. The "Roundup ready" corn gets soaked in Roundup, but is immune to its effects. Corn is used in thousands of consumer food products. I can 100% guarantee that she regularly consumes food that has corn in it that was once soaked with Roundup. It is unavoidable.
Of course when handling Roundup (or any chemical), exercise caution. Cover your skin. Wear gloves. Wear a mask and goggles. Don't spray on windy days or when it will rain. I would not handle a chemical like that daily in my job, but for occasional weed prevention, it is completely safe.
5 Reply
Mike Zipf
Software Engineer · North New Jersey · Member since 2015 · 56 posts · 25 votes
7y
I know you already came up with an answer, but telling the tenant you use no "chemicals" on the yard can also be a selling point. Let them know that comes with all natural weeds.
Also really avoid all the pseudo science here, essentially no one knows the health effects of chemicals especially people who are speaking through the internet megaphone.
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Tony Gunter
Investor · Canton, GA · Member since 2014 · 727 posts · 500 votes
7y
@Alexandra Hughes
As long as the applicator is following label directions your fine. The reality is that until the EPA and or State Agencies (they are involved as well) license the product for use as labeled, your good. Plus you have another layer of protection because they are applying, not you.
IMHO tenants have no say how I maintain my property, as long as it’s done within the limits of the law.
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Eric Littlepage
Rental Property Investor · Saint Louis, MO · Member since 2012 · 20 posts · 7 votes
7y
Biochemist here, so I had to chime in. Glyphosate is completely safe, and I use it all the time. Not worried at all. It's just sad that so many have succumbed to the hysteria, when there is absolutely no evidence it is harmful to animals at all. People think because it kills something that's alive, it must be bad for all life, but glyphosate specifically targets an enzyme that only plants have. You'd think that something that actually kills animals, like insecticides, would be more worrying to people, but Roundup has been a target for certain groups because it's used a lot more, and because they want to bring down Monsanto, mainly regarding GMO issues (which again is unfounded).
4 Reply
Sheree Philips
Member since 2021 · 1 post · 1 vote
5y
Round Up causes cancer. Even if it only maybe caused cancer... the expectation is tenants pay for safe & peaceful homes. Tenants pay rent early and are quiet & mindful of others. Perhaps not give them & you future health issues. There's enough to worry about in the world.
1 Reply
Scott M.
Real Estate Broker · Rochester Hills, MI · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
5y
Great post and unique as @Nancy DeSocio said. As this thread shows lots of passion on both sides of the issue, very little gray area it is either the devils drink or no big deal get over it. Because of that passion and that of your tenant the last thing I would do is lie to them. While I love @Jim K. suggestion of Yard Kitten lying to the tenant about this could carry some liability. Say she gets sick from something unrelated and she finds out you are using devlis drink, potential problem.
I ask this often, but what does your lease say? is the tenant responsible for the long term care of the landscaping or you? Are you just handling it during this initial stage and then going to turn it over to them?
1 Reply
Nick Barber
Member since 2021 · 18 posts · 22 votes
5y
round up and monsanto are evil. 7 states have allows local communities to restrict use. in ca 25 cities have banned or restricted its use. Austria banned its use in 2019. Germany is to phase out use by 2024. Other countries have banned its use. EU is only allowing use til 2022 then who knows. 19 other countries have legislation pending. 8 out of 10 provences in canada have restrictions.
time to get heads out of the sand on this. the cdc and epa are not the organization to look to on this topic. just google epa monsanto ties. this is long out of conspiracy circles folks.
dont endanger you, your tenants, their kids , pets, drinking water or the community
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Jim S.
Sterman, MI · Member since 2017 · 378 posts · 306 votes
5y
I had a tenant say the same thing to me. I said, then you take care of it and if you don't I will. She did.
1 Reply
Marcus Auerbach
Investor · Milwaukee - Mequon, WI · Member since 2010 · 5k+ posts · 7k+ votes
5y
Tough one, because on one hand you can't have tenants dictate how you do things, on the other hand I would NOT allow a landscaper to spray roundup (on a regular basis) at my house.
Glyphosphate is banned in Europe. In the US it is used liberally to spary crops, grain, potatos etc. I have a slight but persistent skin rash and just got back from 2 weeks in Europe with perfectly healthy skin. Now I have to find out what the heck I am doing in the US that causes it. We eat healthy here in the US, but it's impossible to get away from the chemicals.
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