Tenants stained new epoxy garage flooring - can we charge for th?

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Tenants stained new epoxy garage flooring - can we charge for th?

Taylor Martel
Event Planner 路 TX 路 Member since 2017 路 21 posts 路 23 votes

We have a larger rental home in TX that was built 2017. In August 2018, we had epoxy flooring installed in the 3 car garage. In November we vacated the property and had the place professionally cleaned. Property was vacant between Nov-March. Tenants moved in in March at which point the garage floor was in pristine condition. They just moved out and left multiple large stains on the garage floor that a power washer couldn't get out. They look kind of like rust or some sort of chemical. The professional power washer said they might be oil as well. Looks like they disposed of whatever the chemical was in the trash bin,  and put the bin on the concrete driveway where it leaked further creating another dark stain that the power washer also couldn't get out. They also left the house extremely dirty and neglected the landscaping to the point where it cost $500 for cleanup labor,  sod replacement,  and mulch to be installed. We found several spots in the master bedroom where they had stained the carpet (about 1/4 of the room) with some type of light purple substance. They were only there a year and 3 months and the carpet is less than 5 years old. 

We were planning on charging them for 1/2 the cleaning,  the yard maintenance minus the mulch cost,  and the carpet replacement. 

What we are unsure about is the garage floor. I mean it was beautiful before they moved in and now has large stains all over it - the estimate to redo the epoxy will be a few thousand. I don't see this as normal wear and tear and am wondering what other experienced landlords think or if anyone's had any similar experiences. 

FYI - unfortunately, we don't have a before pic of the garage floor but it was installed 8/18 and lived in until 11/18 and then no one lived in the house between 11/18-3/19. The conditions form they filled out doesn't list any stains on the garage floor. 

Any thoughts would be appreciated!

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Kyle J.
Rental Property Investor 路 Northern, CA 路 Member since 2012 路 5k+ posts 路 5k+ votes
6y

If it were me, I wouldn't charge them for the garage floor.  It sucks, I know, because I'm sure it looked great before they moved in.  However, if cleaning it didn't work and the only option left is to completely redo the floor at a cost of a "few thousand dollars", I don't see any judge anywhere thinking that is reasonable if your previous tenants were to object and take you to court (and they almost certainly will).  

Plus, in my experience, this is just one of those things that happens with rentals.  It's even harder when it's a home you used to live in.  You have a really nice home that you used to live in and you want all your tenants to keep it as nice as when you lived there.  However, that's not going to happen and the sooner you start thinking about it as a rental as opposed to your previous family home, the easier this will get (I speak from experience).  

Ultimately, I don't think a few stains on the floor of the garage is going to affect the rentability of the home.  So personally I'd just try cleaning it as good as I could, and then I'd let it go.  (For what it's worth, I bet future tenants still think it looks better than the garage floors in most of the other rentals.)

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  • Lauren Kormylo
    Rental Property Investor 路 Phoenix, AZ and Rehoboth Beach DE 路 Member since 2019 路 1k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    6y

    I think you should try more than power washing the epoxy.

    From this site: https://allgaragefloors.com/ep...

    "For rust stains, we recommend using a 1:1 ratio of CLR and warm water.
    Apply it directly to the rust spot using a scrub brush or soft scrub pad
    and then rinse with cold clean water. Do not let it sit for more than a
    minute or two on the surface."

    There are so many suggestions for cleaning epoxy floors, it seems like they very prone to stains.  It is a garage, after all.  

    0Reply
  • Taylor Martel
    OP
    Event Planner 路 TX 路 Member since 2017 路 21 posts 路 23 votes
    6y

    Lauren - thanks so much for your advice and for leaving the site. We'll definitely try this method - I do believe the guy that did the power washer used a cleaner and brush to try to get the stains out as well but was unsuccessful. I'll see what cleaner he used to confirm if it was CLR or not. 

    0Reply
  • Taylor Martel
    OP
    Event Planner 路 TX 路 Member since 2017 路 21 posts 路 23 votes
    6y

    Just an update - the guy who did the power washing used this product and tried scrubbing out the stains with a brush which did not come out. 

    0Reply
  • Lauren Kormylo
    Rental Property Investor 路 Phoenix, AZ and Rehoboth Beach DE 路 Member since 2019 路 1k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    6y
    That looks like a good cleaner for most things,  but CLR stands for calcium, lime and rust.  So try that, it just may do the trick.  It's strong stuff.
    3Reply
  • Joe SplitrockPro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor 路 Sioux Falls, SD 路 Member since 2015 路 9k+ posts 路 18k+ votes
    6y

    @Taylor Martel those appear to be rust stains. I have rust stains in my garage. Literally just setting any iron based item on your floor that is wet can cause rust stains. I would call it typical use, but would charge for cleaning. As @Lauren Kormylo suggested use CLR which is made specifically to remove. It could discolor the epoxy and may not get it all out. I use CLR to get stains out of toilets - our water here has high iron and calcium content. I have used CLR to get rust stains out of concrete from rusty cars parked on a driveway or garage. Greaser will get oil based stains, CLR for metal or mineral stains. Still it is a garage, so you will have to expect some staining is normal.

    Realistically I would not recommend an epoxy floor in a garage for a rental property. Even in a personal residence, epoxy floors can be trouble if they were not applied professionally using high grade epoxy. 

    As far as what to charge your tenant. If you hired the cleaning, I would charge them 100% of the cleaning and provide the receipts as proof. As far as the carpet, you really can't charge them the full cost. Carpet depreciates so you can only charge the remaining value. For example if you determine the carpet has a 10 years life and it is 5 years old, you can charge for 50%. In a rental property carpet generally doesn't last more than 5-10 years, but it partly depends on the quality of the carpet. 

    It sounds like the tenant was hard on the property, but I can tell you many tenants are like this. 

    3Reply
  • Scott Mac
    Austin, TX 路 Member since 2019 路 5k+ posts 路 5k+ votes
    6y

    Putting a "Beautiful Floor" in a rental garage is asking for trouble.

    If you use delicate type things (easily stainable or easily breakable) in a rental don't expect them to hold up.

    Cars park there--and cars make messes--leaky oil gaskets, radiator hose broken (rust deposits), rubber tire marks.

    Maybe you could call the product manufacturer and ask if there is a way to clean off normal car stains.

    Good Luck!

    4Reply
  • Kyle J.
    Rental Property Investor 路 Northern, CA 路 Member since 2012 路 5k+ posts 路 5k+ votes
    6y

    If it were me, I wouldn't charge them for the garage floor.  It sucks, I know, because I'm sure it looked great before they moved in.  However, if cleaning it didn't work and the only option left is to completely redo the floor at a cost of a "few thousand dollars", I don't see any judge anywhere thinking that is reasonable if your previous tenants were to object and take you to court (and they almost certainly will).  

    Plus, in my experience, this is just one of those things that happens with rentals.  It's even harder when it's a home you used to live in.  You have a really nice home that you used to live in and you want all your tenants to keep it as nice as when you lived there.  However, that's not going to happen and the sooner you start thinking about it as a rental as opposed to your previous family home, the easier this will get (I speak from experience).  

    Ultimately, I don't think a few stains on the floor of the garage is going to affect the rentability of the home.  So personally I'd just try cleaning it as good as I could, and then I'd let it go.  (For what it's worth, I bet future tenants still think it looks better than the garage floors in most of the other rentals.)

    5Reply
  • Steve Morris
    Real Estate Broker 路 Portland, OR 路 Member since 2019 路 4k+ posts 路 2k+ votes
    6y

    What sort of security deposit did you get?  In OR, you can hold back an amount to fix things that are NOT normal wear and tear.

    0Reply
  • Taylor Martel
    OP
    Event Planner 路 TX 路 Member since 2017 路 21 posts 路 23 votes
    6y

    All - thanks for your input. We're going to try the CLR for sure. I totally agree about not putting high end or temperamental items in a rental. This was actually our previous home that we kept as as investment and the epoxy flooring was done for free by the builders Warranty because there were cracks on the floor Street a year...I truly appreciate the advice/input and will keep it all in mind moving forward. We will charge them for the cleaning/power wash but won't charge them for replacement of garage flooring and will just look at it as normal wear and tear...馃榿

    0Reply
  • Michael Robbins
    Property Manager 路 Henderson, NV 路 Member since 2018 路 501 posts 路 317 votes
    6y

    I would charge the tenants for the stained garage floor if: (1) you have before pictures, (2) the tenant did not notate stains on garage floor upon move in on their inventory and condition form, and (3) have vendor verify stains either can be removed via power wash or it has to be re-epoxied.  I would charge them whatever you get charged if the stains can be removed.  If the stains cannot be removed and you have to apply new epoxy then I would charge the prorated lifespan left on the epoxy flooring.  The prorated life left will probably be almost the entire cost because I believe they can last 20-30 years.  The point of the proration is to show the tenant you are attempting to be fair.  

    0Reply
  • Taylor Martel
    OP
    Event Planner 路 TX 路 Member since 2017 路 21 posts 路 23 votes
    6y

    Michael - thanks for your input. We don't have before pictures unfortunately but do have a video of what the floor looked like right after it was completed. They did not notate any stains on the floor on their conditions form. After the powerwash and deep cleaning from powerwash guy the stains did not come out. We're going to try to use CLR and hopefully it will come out then. If that doesn't work - we'd have to re-epoxy or leave it as is...

    0Reply
  • Bill B.
    Investor 路 Las Vegas, NV 路 Member since 2013 路 8k+ posts 路 10k+ votes
    6y

    I would ask for a refund from the epoxy company and/or the installation company. Any product designed for a garage that cost more than a $100 should be advertising something about how great they resists stains. This could just as easily have been a wrench left on the floor. Would you try to take their money for leaving a wrench on the garage floor?

    1Reply
  • Syed H.
    Developer 路 NY/NJ/PA 路 Member since 2018 路 758 posts 路 935 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Michael Robbins:

    I would charge the tenants for the stained garage floor if: (1) you have before pictures, (2) the tenant did not notate stains on garage floor upon move in on their inventory and condition form, and (3) have vendor verify stains either can be removed via power wash or it has to be re-epoxied.  I would charge them whatever you get charged if the stains can be removed.  If the stains cannot be removed and you have to apply new epoxy then I would charge the prorated lifespan left on the epoxy flooring.  The prorated life left will probably be almost the entire cost because I believe they can last 20-30 years.  The point of the proration is to show the tenant you are attempting to be fair.  

     epoxy floors are known to stains and there is a lot of installer error/quality issues when it comes to them as well. It鈥檚 not realistic to blame a tenant for this. Epoxy shouldn鈥檛 ever be used in a rental and honestly in almost anyone鈥檚 home. 

    0Reply
  • Syed H.
    Developer 路 NY/NJ/PA 路 Member since 2018 路 758 posts 路 935 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Taylor Martel:

    Michael - thanks for your input. We don't have before pictures unfortunately but do have a video of what the floor looked like right after it was completed. They did not notate any stains on the floor on their conditions form. After the powerwash and deep cleaning from powerwash guy the stains did not come out. We're going to try to use CLR and hopefully it will come out then. If that doesn't work - we'd have to re-epoxy or leave it as is...

    RE-epoxying a floor is a nightmare. Leave it as is, unless you want to re-epoxy for thousands every few years  

    0Reply
  • Timmi Ryerson
    Property Manager 路 Ketchum, ID 路 Member since 2016 路 277 posts 路 132 votes
    6y

    Wow there was really a lot of damage for only having been there for a year +.  I would not be so lenient and would charge them for the damage.  I would also charge them for the cleaning and sod replacement.  That is not normal wear and tear it is excessive.  The stains in the carpet are also due to carelessness and lack of attention to the proper care and maintenance of a property.  I would get an estimate to restore the garage floor and charge them for the whole amount.  I disagree that you should not put higher end stuff into a rental.  I do it and charge for it with higher rent.  My tenants do not live so carelessly that they cause damage.  I also do inspections every 6 months just so I can see if tenants are keeping their homes in good condition.  If they do not, they get a notice to comply and more regular inspections until there are several in a row that they pass.   That being said, I also have a Policies and Move out Instruction document that I have tenants read and sign at the time they sign their lease.  It tells them that I will charge for damage like stained carpets, torn draperies, broken blinds, excessively dirty walls and uncleaned units upon turnover.  So there are not surprises.  If I had epoxy on the garage floor, I would include that in the list of items that could be damaged and therefore could be charged against their security deposit.

    0Reply
  • Ai Ling Chow
    Denver, CO 路 Member since 2020 路 2 posts 路 1 vote
    6y

    So did the CLR work?

    0Reply
  • Taylor Martel
    OP
    Event Planner 路 TX 路 Member since 2017 路 21 posts 路 23 votes
    6y

    Ai - the CLR did not work on the garage floor or the stain on the concrete. Not sure what to do about it now...

    0Reply
  • Josh C.Pro Member
    Property Manager 路 Indianapolis, IN 路 Member since 2010 路 1k+ posts 路 1k+ votes
    6y

    I think charging them for rust spots on a floor made to hold cars and lawnmowers is excessive. Everything inside for sure, but garages are made throw your rusty crap on. I highly doubt some rust spots on a garage floor hurts value or rentability of the place.

    1Reply
  • Joe SplitrockPro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor 路 Sioux Falls, SD 路 Member since 2015 路 9k+ posts 路 18k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Taylor Martel:

    Ai - the CLR did not work on the garage floor or the stain on the concrete. Not sure what to do about it now...

     For concrete you can try Singerman Laboratories rust remover. It will do the trick if applied properly. I wouldn't use that on epoxy floor because it is likely to damage the finish. 

    On the epoxy floor I would use regular floor cleaners and a floor scrub brush. Something like Simple Green, full concentration, scrub and let it sit, then scrub more. You can try Magic Eraser on the floor. I always try Magic Eraser if nothing else works and it often works like magic. With anything you try, start in a small area to test and make sure you don't damage the finish. If the finish is damaged, but clean, you may be able to rescue the sheen by added a clear coat designed to work with the epoxy brand.

    Before doing anything, call the company that applied the finish. Most of them have warranties and they will have a recommended way to clean. The type of epoxy and how it was applies makes a major difference. The industrial epoxy finishes used in warehouses are bullet proof, but using that quality in a garage costs thousands. The DIY kits at Home Depot for $200 are not going to hold up.

    2Reply
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire 路 Northeast, TN 路 Member since 2015 路 10k+ posts 路 16k+ votes
    6y

    Since you don't have any before pictures when they moved in, you'll have to eat that one as you don't have any proof that it wasn't there when they moved in (a video of after it was done a year or two earlier doesn't count). And as others have said, garage floors are going to get dirty. You'd have a hard time getting a judge to go along with a 4 figure plus claim to have new epoxy done. 

    In any case, with rentals, never use anything that's not tough enough to stand up to less than ideal care. We don't have any carpeting in any rentals because tenants are hard on floors. 

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    0Reply
  • Andrew S.
    Rental Property Investor 路 Helena, MT 路 Member since 2017 路 282 posts 路 117 votes
    6y
    Try brake cleaner to get it off
    0Reply
  • Rylanda Wilson
    Member since 2018 路 3 posts 路 1 vote
    6y

    Sometimes it is easier to camouflage stains and discolorations with inks, dyes and stains.  I am not familiar with the type of flooring installed in your garage, but I wonder if stippling with magic markers in multiple colors to match the floor could draw the eye away from the stain.

    0Reply
  • Account Closed
    San Jose, CA 路 Member since 2015 路 4k+ posts 路 3k+ votes
    6y

    OMG, do you really expect a garage to not be used and therefore stained?  It's not a brand new floor for the kitchen, this is a garage!  If you want perfect flooring in a garage, I just don't know what to tell you.  What do you expect people to do in a garage?  Do you never stain your garage floor?

    Tenants are people.  People use their homes.  Don't you?  Do you never cause stains?  Do you expect to be able to eat off your garage floors?

    Aye, aye, aye people.

    0Reply
  • Taylor Martel
    OP
    Event Planner 路 TX 路 Member since 2017 路 21 posts 路 23 votes
    6y

    Thanks for your suggestions Rylanda and Andrew!

    Sue - while I appreciate you taking the time to leave a comment, you might want to consider dialing back on your tone as you're coming across as very passive aggressive. This is forum about people asking questions and discussing opinions regarding a subject where many things are not black or white/set in stone...Just a suggestion. Again,  thanks for sharing your opinion. 

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