Potential tenants seeing vacant unit unattended?
Member since 2020 · 9 posts · 2 votes
Potential tenants seeing vacant unit unattended?
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Investor · Malakoff, TX · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
5yI'd never let people into my rentals without someone present. What I do to save time is group/open house type showings once or twice a week.
38 Replies
- Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes5y
After my partner passed away I made the mistake of turning some of my properties over to a Management Company (THAT lasted less than a year before I took them back). They used the lock box method. Prior to this Bill and I handled all our properties and I was usually the one who showed these. I still stopped by periodically and would find cigarette butts, left over fast food bags, napkins, etc. in the one property that was up for rent during this time. Once I found one of the bedroom closed and locked and thought perhaps a child had done this by accident. I was able to get it unlocked even though it had an older knob.
The absolutely WORST (and what did it for me) was when applicants began to complain of a "funny odor " in the house. The property management company informed me of this. Did THEY go over and check it out? Nope. I went and found that each of the three toilets had a "deposit" in it (and I'm not talking about urine either). Who the heck goes to check out an empty house only to use the toilet? Well, it appears some low life folks (or perhaps it was those who left the fast food bags). The water was off at the place but was easy to turn back on at the meter and I always carry a meter key with me anyway in case of emergencies.
At any rate I said told property management to take the darn lock box off the door and either be there to show the house or I'd be taking it back before our contract expired and handle the situation myself.
Please note this was my largest and highest rent house in a very nice neighborhood, not some low life place in "the hood".
I might point out that on one of my landlord forums a landlord reported driving by one of their properties that was for rent and was again being shown using the lock box method. He noticed two cars parked in front of the place and out of curiosity parked nearby just to see who might be checking out his place. Said many minutes went by and when the couple finally came out one was carrying a folded blanket. It appears his empty house was being substituted for a cheap motel.
- Specialist · PA · Member since 2016 · 143 posts · 71 votes5y
@Dylan Katz I thought about doing virtual showings few times. Showings in person are very time consuming. It's worth a try to go virtual. One of our most recent residents was pre-approved over the phone (She was referred by one of our current tenants). I never saw her and don't think it's necessary to meet in person.
We REO Link products as well. They are great. Pan Tilt are more expensive but better.
@Luciano A. What method/systems do you use to collect a security deposit? What's percentage of prospects are comfortable with putting a showing deposit? I wish REO link also made locks with SIM instead of WIFI, have you come across any?
- Rental Property Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 97 posts · 66 votes5y
@Dylan Katz
I do this with my rentals whenever I market them. All of my rentals come with a vivint security system and until a resident moves in, I can change the lock codes and control the cameras. I have prospects fill out a quick 3 minute ID check form online where I can verify 2 forms of Social media, as well as a picture of their ID. After I verify their ID I can text them a temporary lock code that is good for 2 hours for them to get inside. There are 2 cameras outside and 1 camera inside that record 24/7. I can watch the prospects to make sure they are treating my property with respect and I can see if they remembered to lock the door or.forgot to turn a light off etc.
I've heard people suggest charging a deposit. I personally do not but I've never had issues myself. That being said if you can afford it, it's probably best to at least have someone check out the property in person within about 6-8 hours after whomever sees the property just to verify nothing is missing or disturbed.
- Rental Property Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 97 posts · 66 votes5y
@Dylan Katz
Oh but one thing I will say is beware of scammers. This has never happened to me, but I have heard stories of people getting your lock code and then pretending to be the landlord to another unsuspecting tenant and telling them they can move on in after signing an online lease and wiring a "deposit" to them. Obviously without being the owners, they can't move in, but there are people I've heard stories about that have sent thousands of dollars for a deposit for a home, moving all of their stuff into the home thinking they just paid to live their. Until finally the real landlord finds out and comes to find them moved in. These scams can seem really realistic and a lot of times the scammer never gets caught because it's almost always 100% online.
- Rental Property Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 97 posts · 66 votes5y
@Mike Gordon
I use Vivint security system. I do not know of the top of my head but their electronic door locks do work without wifi.
- Rental Property Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 97 posts · 66 votes5y
@Mike Gordon
The cameras however do require a wifi connection to work via your phone. And so long as you have an administrative account you can create guest accounts for the tenants and assign them their own security code without having to risk them being able to change any settings or add accounts that you don't want changed
- 5yTheresa HarrisPro MemberMember since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
It may save you time, but what if they damage something? Also don't you want to meet them to see what they are like? You can get a good idea about the person from talking to them in person.
- Developer · Houston TX · Member since 2018 · 423 posts · 400 votes5y
I like REO products and I too wish they could have locks without SIM cards. Kwikset does have one that is Bluetooth capabilities but to change a code you would need to be close to the lock. I am sure with the AirBnB industry there has to be something to accommodate locks without wifi.
In regards to the security deposit. We have found those who are serious will have no issue given they call our office versus a cell phone so they can be assured they aren't being scammed. When we have hesitation from prospects we do tell them we can show in person but we then give them the time frame versus them telling us what day/time works best for them. In addition, we ask for their email address at which time we send an email explaining our process and a link with an invoice. Our property management software allows us to send invoices that can be paid via email. I think Quickbooks would allow you to do the same.
Some of the bigger investors and with COVID virtual tours which I think Zillow helps with are becoming very popular.
Hope this was helpful
- Investor · Bayside, NY · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes5y
Originally posted by @Dylan Katz:
@Joe Martella
What kinds of things do you look for when you meet and talk with potential tenants?
I do open houses, chat which potential applicants to get a gut feeling. Some years back, a manager at a company I worked for said one trick he used is tell a bad joke and see how people react.
I was renting 2BR units, and often I get 2 single guy roommates looking to rent. One of the jokes I used is "you guys are not going to hold wild parties here, will you?" in a joking way. Someone with a good sense of humor will answer "you're welcome to join us", and we'll get a good laugh. Otherwise, they say "no". But once, I asked that, the applicant who actually wanted the apartment, got angry, his face turned red, shouted "who are you accusing of me of holding wild parties". A few minutes later, he calmed down, realized what he did, and apologized.
As I had open houses, I tell people to call back to confirm if they get picked. I usually have 15 to 20 people coming to one, and I would apologize to those that don't get picked. When the guy who lost his temper called, I apologized and told him he wasn't selected. His answer was "I'll find out where you live and come get you. how dare you waste my time". He called a few more times to harass me.
I thought about it through the years. If I do rentals without talking to applicants and getting a gut feeling, just relying on on-line applications, I would wind up renting to an unhinged character like the one that threatened to kill me. You'll only find out when you meet and talk to them.
Then on the other hand, some applicants are not the greatest on paper. One guy had a bankruptcy in file, and said he didn't want to talk about it. But talking to him, he seems to be a decent God fearing man, and I selected him. Later, he told me his bankruptcy was due to a loan his son took out to start a trucking business, and he was the guarantor. The business went under and he can't pay off the $200K loan on his doorman salary. But he was one of the best tenants I ever had. If I need to go into his apartment to do anything, call him, he would say, I told you you can come in anytime. One time I got there, he was at work, got a copy of the Bible open on his dinner table, like he was reading it before going to work. So my feeling of him being a God fearing man was right on, despite the bankruptcy on his file.
- 5yDrew SygitBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Royal Oak, MI · Member since 2012 · 12k+ posts · 9k+ votes
@Dylan Katz we manage around 500 units.
For several months in 2020 we were not legally allowed to do in person showings. So we investigated Rently and ShowingHero and started doing self-showings.
Once we could do in-person showings again we continued to do the self-showings because they were so much more efficient.
Go with what works for you.
Logical Property Management4.9451 Reviews - 5yWill KennerPro MemberRental Property Investor · Seattle · Member since 2018 · 134 posts · 100 votes
@Luciano A. That sounds like a great system, very practical while eliminating trips for showings.
- Investor · Bayside, NY · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes5y
Originally posted by @Isaiah Williams:
@Dylan Katz
Oh but one thing I will say is beware of scammers. This has never happened to me, but I have heard stories of people getting your lock code and then pretending to be the landlord to another unsuspecting tenant and telling them they can move on in after signing an online lease and wiring a "deposit" to them. Obviously without being the owners, they can't move in, but there are people I've heard stories about that have sent thousands of dollars for a deposit for a home, moving all of their stuff into the home thinking they just paid to live their. Until finally the real landlord finds out and comes to find them moved in. These scams can seem really realistic and a lot of times the scammer never gets caught because it's almost always 100% online.
I had uncovered a few scammers over the years using "identity theft" to rent. You have to have a gut feeling talking to the applicants and seeing how they answer and react.
One guy came by, submitted an application, and upon receiving it, I asked to see his drivers license for ID verification. He looked uncomfortable, reach for his pocket, said he left his wallet home. He had on his application his roommate's name, but the roommate was not with him. I told him I have to meet renters in person, and he has to bring his roommate to see the place and for me to meet him.
His must like the place enough to bring his roommate a day later. His roommate was surprised when I asked him to fill out a separate application, believing his roommate submitted it. The first guy said it's his brother, but they have different last names as it turned out. Then it was a different person than the original application. Explained that they're step brothers. As the roommate was filling out the application, said to the first guy, "did you remember to bring your wallet and ID today?". He reached into his pocket and said "can't believe I left it home again".
When the roommate finished the application, I asked to see his drivers license. He was a bit shocked, stammered a bit, and I said "don't tell me you left your wallet home too". They looked at each other, guessed he couldn't use the "I left my wallet home" excuse again, reluctantly pulled his wallet out, and the name on the driver license is totally different than the application. I took a look, not sure what to say and do when he blurted out, "oh, I use a different name at work". I said "really?"
I am not sure what these guys are up to, so I quickly ushered them out, saying I have to meet someone for an appointment soon.
As to people using identity theft to rent an apartment, I wouldn't have believed it if I didn't seen it on "Judge Judy", the TV show. The landlord is suing a tenant for back rent after an eviction. When the defendant showed up, the landlord didn't recognize her. Judge Judy was surprised too, and ask the defendant who she is. She said she owns her own home, never lived in the apartment in question but believe someone stole her identity to rent the place. She said she suspected it was a former co-worker. The case was dismissed and I was wondering if they ever resolved it which should be easy enough if she supplied the real name of the co-worker to the landlord.
The long and the short of it, I can't feel comfortable seeing and talking to applicants, and get a gut feeling. And if rentals are done without seeing or talking to potential tenants, I see these scams are easy to pull off.
Someone did ask on this thread "what do you say to get a gut feeling". The above is a good example of getting a bad feeling.
- Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes5y
I too like to meet with potential applicants if nothing more than to get a "gut" feeling for them. I'm old (and getting older by the minute) and find myself getting somewhat cranky about dealing with some things. My patience isn't very good nowadays. Guess I've heard too many SOB stories.
Had one woman come view one of my houses and her first comment out of her car was that the "front yard looked bigger in the pictures online". I'm not sure what she meant by that; the front yard was similar in size as all the other houses in that neighborhood. Perhaps she enjoyed mowing a huge yard? Her second comment was that she was looking to move because her current landlord "never fixed anything". Her example was that her back door doorbell hadn't worked for a couple of months and her landlord had not run right over and fixed it. It was at that point that I mentally withdrew that person off my list of possible tenants.
I once had a couple with a little girl about five come and view a house and the woman became convinced the place must have mice because she saw a dust bunny in the corner of the master bedroom. When she got down on her hands and knees to peer very close to it I thought "uh oh" on that one. She was so convinced the dust bunny was one mouse dropping that she stated she would only consider renting after the house had been sprayed by a professional exterminator.
Like the posting above by Mr. Chin, I've had "fast talkers" trying to compliment me into renting them a place. Had one woman who kept telling me I looked "great for my age" and she hoped she looked so good when she got to be as old as she thought I was. About the third time she repeated this I wanted to say "this is NOT winning you points toward getting you this place". She and her husband quickly filled out my application (I typically suggest people take it home to fill it out although it's only a 2 page form) and they both put down social security numbers that made absolutely no sense whatsoever.
And finally, I have my 15 minute rule. We make a appointment for a specific time; I wait no longer than 15 minutes past this time before I leave. And no second chances. The only option would be if someone calls or texts me beforehand and explains they are running a bit late and is very specific on when they will be at the rental to view it. In the beginning (when I was new landlord) I did not have this rule and invariably I found that those folks who came late and ended up renting ended up being very problem tenants.
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